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Old 04-18-2013, 04:27 PM    (permalink
asham27
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I thought Gino looked good in the Cincinnati game. I don't get how adding an unproven rookie somehow remedies things.
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Old 04-18-2013, 07:42 PM    (permalink
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Moving Osemele to LT IMO would be a big mistake, I think coordinator0 stated it earlier but he played really well at LG and it just wouldn't make sense to move him away from a position he played so well at.

I can understand they don't want to move Oher to LT, because he sucks at LT AND he's going into a contract year(i think), much rather play him at RT and offer him RT money, because he's sure not worth top LT $$.

I know Harbaugh doesn't want to do it, but re-sign McKinnie for ***** sake!! Either that or trade up in the draft. Osemele's best fit is at LG and Oher is a RT. Best to keep those guys put and go out and find an LT.
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Old 04-18-2013, 10:32 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BmoreBlackByrdz View Post
Moving Osemele to LT IMO would be a big mistake - it just wouldn't make sense to move him away from a position he played so well at.

but re-sign McKinnie for ***** sake!!
Eh.
McKinnie probably won't be back & if he is, it won't be until after the draft has panned itself out.
Even if he is back, he's average at best at this point in his career.
Not to mention, he'll 100% be out of shape come start of the training camp.
- Osemele played excellent last season, and at this point - he's our best option at LT, so might as well try it out.
-- We do need to draft line, but that's at center - since Gradkowski is unproven and lacks ideal measurables.
Let's not forget, Jah Reid and Ramon Harewood are both solid options inside at guard.
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Old 04-19-2013, 08:42 AM    (permalink
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Eh.
McKinnie probably won't be back & if he is, it won't be until after the draft has panned itself out.
Agreed, they'll probably add him as a last resort option, at the cheapest possible price. Which I have no problem with. I laughed when he compared himself to a Maserati. I do still believe our o-line would be better w/ him at LT instead of Osemele.

Even if he is back, he's average at best at this point in his career.
Not to mention, he'll 100% be out of shape come start of the training camp.

- Osemele played excellent last season, and at this point - he's our best option at LT, so might as well try it out.
Right, he played excellent at guard last season, he was solid at RT but I think we can all agree on where he's best suited at. I don't mind trying Osemele out at LT during minicamps and OTA's but I honestly think our o-line is at it's best when he's lined up at LG.

-- We do need to draft line, but that's at center - since Gradkowski is unproven and lacks ideal measurables.
I don't see why you think we need to draft C over LT?? We drafted Gino Gradkowski last year to be Birk's replacement. Don't you at least want to give him a chance before you waste a draft pick trying to replace someone who you've never seen play more than 1 game?

Let's not forget, Jah Reid and Ramon Harewood are both solid options inside at guard.
I don't think neither Harewood nor Reid are solid options at guard, Harewood was benched for Bobbie Williams and Reid benched for Osemele. I don't understand why you have no faith in Gradkowski but you think Harewood and Reid are solid options
not trying to come off as a douche, just a good solid debate ! :)
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Old 04-19-2013, 10:08 AM    (permalink
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not trying to come off as a douche, just a good solid debate ! :)
I've got to agree. I think Harewood was a surprise start at the beginning of the year, but he didn't impress. Neither did Reid. Gradkowski played well against Geno Atkins & Co. He's 6'3", 300. He could get stronger, as could everyone, but that's perfectly fine for a center. He's got good technique and should be fine as our guy. Using a high draft pick on another C won't get us that much better of a player. If we go OL, it's got to be LT - and if we resign McKinney after the draft, we can take a guy who needs some development time (year or two).
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Old 04-19-2013, 11:39 AM    (permalink
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not trying to come off as a douche, just a good solid debate ! :)
One thing - Reid wasn't benched for Osemele. He got hurt and was put on IR which forced the team to shuffle the OL around. They already knew how bad Harewood and Williams were so obviously I'm glad they took a chance on an alignment they hadn't used before.

Other than that I agree. There's a reason Harewood got benched after like 3 or 4 games and then wasn't activated for nearly every other game for the rest of the season. I thought Reid was solid at LG but not great and I still don't believe that's a position he should be playing.
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Old 04-19-2013, 06:02 PM    (permalink
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My forum mock draft class...

Quote:
Originally Posted by TACKLE View Post
1.32 Johnathan Cyprien, SS, FIU
2.62 Da'Rick Rogers, WR, Tennessee Tech
3.94 David Bahktiari, OL, Colorado
4.103 Sanders Commings, CB/S, Georgia
4.130 DeVonte Holloman, ILB, South Carolina
5.168 Lerentee McCray, LB, Florida
6.199 Marcus Davis, WR, Virginia Tech
6.200 Mychal Rivera, TE, Tennessee
6.203 Zac Stacy, RB, Vanderbilt
7.238 Steve Beauharnais, ILB, Rutgers
7.247 AJ Francis, DT, Maryland

+

Karlos Dansby
- I signed Dansby in order to get a good player/strong leader and to give me more flexibility. The reasoning behind

-Cyprien and Rogers is pretty self-explanatory.

- I'm a big fan of Bahktiari. I really think he's capable of being a starter at all 5 spots on the O-Line.

- Sanders Commings is a guy I'm extremely high on. Personally, I think he's a late 1-early 2 type talent. No pressing need at CB but he was easily my highest rated player and he could provide depth at both corner and safety in the back-end.

- Holloman gives us an athletic guy who can run and cover inside. Surprising tough inside for a former safety as well.

- McCray is another guy who is think is pretty underrated. No player gave Joeckel more problems this year than he did. Kind of an Albert McClellan type in that he could play RUSH, SOLB or be an inside thumper.

- Marcus Davis is a freak athlete who is built for a vertical offense like ours and a QB like Flacco. Has some inconsistency but has the skillset to be a #1 WR which is something rare to find at the end of the 5th. Worth a flyer.

- Dickson's contract is up after this year and Rivera who I personally think is better than some of these big name guys who get mentioned a lot might end up being a better & cheaper alternative in a year.

- Stacy was simply the highest rated player on my board.
- Same with Beauharnais.

- AJ Francis is a local product with great size and experience playing 3-4 DE. Needs a bit of work but has the tools to potentially be a very solid 5-tech imo.


I wish I would have traded up more with all these picks but many of them were comp picks anyway. Overall, I was very pleased with this haul.


Thoughts?
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Old 04-20-2013, 06:24 AM    (permalink
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I'm really having a feeling the pick might be Menelik Watson, he just fits the Ravens o-line to a T. Maybe he isn't ready to start immediately but I think with time he can be a dominant LT for Baltimore.
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Old 04-20-2013, 11:04 AM    (permalink
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I'm really having a feeling the pick might be Menelik Watson, he just fits the Ravens o-line to a T. Maybe he isn't ready to start immediately but I think with time he can be a dominant LT for Baltimore.
He doesn't fit Ozzie's trend of his first picks though. Look back at just about every draft the Ravens have had since Newsome took over (which was pretty much from the start I believe even if he wasn't named the GM for the first few years). All of those first picks were proven players. Even Jeremiah said that when he was with the Ravens Ozzie had a mantra of wanting to hit doubles (guys that you know what you're getting) with the first pick and not go for homeruns.

I'm guaranteeing it now - Menelik Watson won't be Baltimore's first pick in the 2013 NFL Draft.
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Old 04-21-2013, 06:01 AM    (permalink
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It's safe to say safety is the teams biggest need.
Of Johnathan Cyprien, Matt Elam, and Kenny Vaccaro; whos everyones favorite??
- Vaccaro will most likely be gone.
- Cyprien and Elam is a toss up - I like both, but Elam to me takes the cake.
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Old 04-21-2013, 10:02 AM    (permalink
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I prefer Cyprien actually. Maybe it's because the level of competition, but it seems like he's involved in more plays and brings it on every down. Elam has a great highlight tape but in between those plays, he looks like he's just going through the motions. I actually like D.J. Swearinger a lot if he can make it to our 2nd rounder. I have Eric Reid closer in the discussion with Cyprien, but I give the nod to Cyprien because he plays with a little more range and savvy back deep. Still have Vaccaro as my #1, plays the slot (check him against Tavon Austin), plays deep and can play aggressive in the box.
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Old 04-21-2013, 12:28 PM    (permalink
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Yep I'm a Cyprien guy too. He's actually my favorite safety in this class. What I've seen of Cyprien really impresses me even though he did play a lower level of competition. He doesn't have the size disadvantage in coverage that Elam does either. That's probably not a huge deal considering the Ravens have huff on the team but I'd still prefer a player that doesn't have that kind of uncorrectable weakness.

I agree that safety is the team's biggest need. LT might be up there too but at least the Ravens already have some good young talent to compete at ILB and maybe WR. At safety they have Huff and the the likes of Ihedigbo, Thompson (who's suspended for the first four games), Brown, Levine, and Cook.
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Old 04-21-2013, 04:43 PM    (permalink
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I have Arthur Brown and Cyprien as my clearcut two favorite prospects which should be available when we draft. Brown would add a dimension to our linebacker corps, which we currently do not have, while Cyprien is the imo better versatile project at safety compared to Elam.

From the tapes I watched, Cyprien has an amazing break on the ball and takes great ankles and delivers hits with a pop that seperates the ball from the receivers. If I can't get a fat guy at 32 who can protect Flacco, then I prefer either of Brown or Cyprien.
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Old 04-22-2013, 04:47 PM    (permalink
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So with the 32nd pick...


Which players do you want?

Which players do you not want?

Which players would you be indifferent towards?

Which players (if any) should we consider trading up for if they started to fall?
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Old 04-22-2013, 06:11 PM    (permalink
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I have Arthur Brown as my #1 guy also. I would have to have a legit 3 down LB that can cover and I love his instincts. IDK enough about the safetys. How do you guys feel about trading up to 18 to get Kenny Varcco the S from Texas. The cowboys did hint that they wanted to trade down./
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Old 04-22-2013, 07:00 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by TACKLE View Post
My forum mock draft class...


- I signed Dansby in order to get a good player/strong leader and to give me more flexibility.

The reasoning behind

-Cyprien and Rogers is pretty self-explanatory.

- I'm a big fan of Bahktiari. I really think he's capable of being a starter at all 5 spots on the O-Line.

- Sanders Commings is a guy I'm extremely high on. Personally, I think he's a late 1-early 2 type talent. No pressing need at CB but he was easily my highest rated player and he could provide depth at both corner and safety in the back-end.

- Holloman gives us an athletic guy who can run and cover inside. Surprising tough inside for a former safety as well.

- McCray is another guy who is think is pretty underrated. No player gave Joeckel more problems this year than he did. Kind of an Albert McClellan type in that he could play RUSH, SOLB or be an inside thumper.

- Marcus Davis is a freak athlete who is built for a vertical offense like ours and a QB like Flacco. Has some inconsistency but has the skillset to be a #1 WR which is something rare to find at the end of the 5th. Worth a flyer.

- Dickson's contract is up after this year and Rivera who I personally think is better than some of these big name guys who get mentioned a lot might end up being a better & cheaper alternative in a year.

- Stacy was simply the highest rated player on my board.
- Same with Beauharnais.

- AJ Francis is a local product with great size and experience playing 3-4 DE. Needs a bit of work but has the tools to potentially be a very solid 5-tech imo.


I wish I would have traded up more with all these picks but many of them were comp picks anyway. Overall, I was very pleased with this haul.


Thoughts?
- I like the Dansby signing. Especially given how it seems that the Rolando McClain experiment have already come to an end. Regardless of that, Dansby definitely brings traits to the table that McClain didnt. He may have lost a step, but is still decent in coverage, and still plays the run very well. (According to PFF he was the 5th best rated lb in that department last year.)
Assuming the price is right, this is a very solid move, that I hope will come true after the draft.

- Cyprien: I have him ranked as my #2 safety and #30 overall in my personal rankings. Great fit at SS next to Huff, great tackler, and with enough speed and range in his game to be more than just an in-the-box guy. Would take Cyprien in a heartbeat over Eric Reid and Matt Elam, who seems to be the other choices we have, if we decide to go safety in round 1.

- DaīRick Rogers: This is a pick, that I keep going back and forth on.
No doubt Rogers have some very intriguing tools to work with, and he has the upside and potential to be a true #1 WR. Furthermore I like that he adds another dimension to our passing attack, and his skillset compliments the speed of Torrey and Jacoby.
With that being said, his character scares me. One thing is the off the field stuff, that got him kicked out of Tennessee. Young men makes mistakes, and deserves a second chance. However, after watching 4-5 interviews with him, I can honestly say that something about his persona rubs me the wrong way. Maybe its just me, but I think he comes of as pretty immature and diva-esque, and I have my doubts as to wether or not he will fullfill his vast potential. He reminds a quite bit of T.O. both on and off the field. That intrigues and scares me at the same time.
Its not something that I can really quantify more, so just take it as a subjective gut feeling on my part. As far as value goes, its a solid pick. Despite the off the field stuff, I think he will be selected before our 3rd round pick.
An alternative way to go, could have been to trade up a bit, and get a guy like Quinton Patton who got picked by the Texans at #57. Dont know how forum mocks work as far as trade scenarios, but if a 4th rounder couldīve gotten it done, I probably wouldīve gone that way.

- David Bahktiari: This might be my favourite pick of them all!
Im no expert on evaluating o-line prospects by any stretch of the imagination, but I think Bahktiari possesses all the necessary tools to be a starting LT in the NFL. If he played for a better college team, I truly believe he could get some mention as a late first/early second round pick.
IMO getting him in the 3rd is a much, much better choice than taking a guy like Menelik Watson in the first. Again, if we were to trade up, I could see us targeting a guy like Khaseem Greene, who got picked at #87, but thats just to give some kind of alternative to your pick.

- Sanders Cummings: Very intriguing pick. Adds valuable depth and versatility in the backfield. The main knock on his game seem to be regarding his technique, and our staff can easily fix that imo. Good value, and a potential steal.
If you hadnīt picked WR in round 2, I think we should consider a guy like Aaron Dobson, who came of the board 8 picks later.

- DeVonte Holloman. Got nothing to add to your reasoning. I like the pick, and he will provide some atheticism and coverage ability to ILB.

- Lerentee McCray. Had to go back and watch a bit of his film to judge this. I like it, and agree that he is a bit underrated. Hes got some natural athleticism, size and aggresiveness to work with. The kind of guy you want to take a flier on in the 5th.
As an alternative, I wouldīve liked to pick up a guy like SS Earl Wolff, who came of the board at #190. I think Wolff is very underrated, and would be a nice depth pick with some upside.

- Marcus Davis: Great pick. Big guy with athleticism and upside. Well worth a flier just like Streeter was it last year.

- Mychal Rivera. Fine by me. Like your reasoning for the pick.

- Zac Stacy: LOVE IT! Stacy is one of my favourite sleepers in this draft. Runs hard and with a burst. Can do a little bit of everything. Even though we hate to think about it, there is a chance that Ray Rice will begin to decline soon, and even though Pierce looks the part, it cant hurt to have a guy like Stacy lurking around. I truly believe he can be a starter, if given the chance.

- Steve Beauharnais: Productive at Rutgers and a great character to have on your roster. If we dont go ILB early, I think its a good approach to bring in multiple guys in the later rounds.

Dont know anything about AJ Francis, so canīt really comment on that pick, but hey itīs the 7th round :-)

Overall I think you did a very good job in this mock. You where able to get good or even great value with basically every selection. You filled out our main needs, as well as adding solid depth in many spots. At no point did it seem that you stretched to far for any given player. I have my reservations about the DaīRick Rogers pick, but I can easily get behind it.
Very good job sir, and you get a solid A for this class.
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Old 04-22-2013, 07:02 PM    (permalink
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Jeez. That became a rather long-winded response. My apologies :-)
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Old 04-22-2013, 07:04 PM    (permalink
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I have Arthur Brown as my #1 guy also. I would have to have a legit 3 down LB that can cover and I love his instincts. IDK enough about the safetys. How do you guys feel about trading up to 18 to get Kenny Varcco the S from Texas. The cowboys did hint that they wanted to trade down./
Honestly, I would rather trade up to #18 to get Arthur Brown than to get Vaccaro. Not thrilled about Vaccaro, and think we have a good shot of landing a decent safety in round 2 or 3.
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Old 04-22-2013, 07:53 PM    (permalink
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Jeez. That became a rather long-winded response. My apologies :-)
It's all good, appreciate the feedback.
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Old 04-22-2013, 10:04 PM    (permalink
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I have Arthur Brown as my #1 guy also. I would have to have a legit 3 down LB that can cover and I love his instincts. IDK enough about the safetys. How do you guys feel about trading up to 18 to get Kenny Varcco the S from Texas. The cowboys did hint that they wanted to trade down./
I wouldn't actually be mad about it but there are better safeties in this class and this is a stacked safety class up all the way to the 4th round. It's especially loaded with physical strong safety's who can come down into the box ala Pollard.
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Old 04-23-2013, 01:56 PM    (permalink
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http://www.baltimoreravens.com/news/...d-0e455dd961b9

Glad this is being discussed under serious consideration. I always hated when a team gave up a 2nd next year for a 3rd this year. We have so many picks, we can afford to trade for that premium. We'll still have a lot of compensatory picks next year since our signings have been guys who were cut, but if the draft is stronger at the top, we set ourselves up with the ammo to make a move.
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Old 04-23-2013, 02:43 PM    (permalink
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Since pretty much all of the excess picks the Ravens have this year come in the later rounds (extra picks 4th, 5th, and 7th with two extra in the 6th) I wouldn't mind the Ravens trading their own picks in those rounds for future picks that are a round higher than the one(s) they give up. To me this draft is too deep to consider trading Baltimore's 3rd for a 2nd next year though. A 2nd for a 1st next season would be interesting but I don't think Baltimore gets offered that.
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Old 04-23-2013, 04:40 PM    (permalink
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I've been going back and forth on this player all year - not just for the Ravens but for my overall evaluation. I've been one of his biggest fans and one of his biggest critics. coordinator is not going to like this but other than Arthur Brown, I think Ogletree may be the one player I want most. I'm well aware of his issues working through traffic but I don't think he was disciplined very well at UGA and they just let him freelance all the time and didn't really teach him to read keys properly. I just think the positives really outweigh the negatives with him.and I really feel he can tap into that potential with a strong, structured team like we have and become that dynamic, space LB who would give our defense a whole new element. Wouldn't expect him to come in day one inside in a 34 and light the world on fire. He will take some patience but I do feel like our coaching staff can develop him into a bonafide stud.
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Old 04-23-2013, 09:01 PM    (permalink
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I've been going back and forth on this player all year - not just for the Ravens but for my overall evaluation. I've been one of his biggest fans and one of his biggest critics. coordinator is not going to like this but other than Arthur Brown, I think Ogletree may be the one player I want most. I'm well aware of his issues working through traffic but I don't think he was disciplined very well at UGA and they just let him freelance all the time and didn't really teach him to read keys properly. I just think the positives really outweigh the negatives with him.and I really feel he can tap into that potential with a strong, structured team like we have and become that dynamic, space LB who would give our defense a whole new element. Wouldn't expect him to come in day one inside in a 34 and light the world on fire. He will take some patience but I do feel like our coaching staff can develop him into a bonafide stud.


I just don't feel like Ogletree is a good ILB prospect. On another forum I said he reminds me of what Pollard would look like playing that position. He has the same type of mentality for tackling and I don't think that would work too well as a 3-4 ILB. Ogletree's instincts and ability to work through traffic worry me the most. He just strikes me as a guy that got by because of his athleticism. That can be looked at as having a ton of upside but in this case I wouldn't want him. It's hard to speculate what he was and wasn't taught at Georgia.

If I was a fan of a team who needed a 4-3 WLB he would be at the top of my list easily. I really like his ability to run down plays on the outside and I liked his burst when he was rushing the QB from the edge. Just anything on the inside seems to be a waste with him. I'm not discounting him as a potential pick for the Ravens though. I could very easily see them wanting him. I hope it doesn't come to that though. Give me Moore in the 2nd round over Ogletree at 32/a few picks later if he they trade back.
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Old 04-24-2013, 09:27 AM    (permalink
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http://boards.baltimoreravens.com/to...7-round-draft/



Here is a 7 round mock. I would love Brown then Reid in round 2. I highly doubt we touch Rogers though.
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