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Old 02-20-2009, 10:08 PM    (permalink
jayceheathman
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Andre Johnson is > TO
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Old 02-20-2009, 10:14 PM    (permalink
russie
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Andre Johnson is > TO
this is true as of now, but it also doesnt fit with the point of the thread. the point is the best of the decade, not who is better right now
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Old 02-20-2009, 10:23 PM    (permalink
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Terrell Owens simply cannot be argued against being at least second team in this debate. He has had at least 1050 yards and 9TD's every season but one this decade. And in that season he didn't he played only 7 games.
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Old 02-20-2009, 10:26 PM    (permalink
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A decade of gridiron glory.

QB: Joey Harrington
RB: Shawn Bryson
RB: Artose Pinner
WR: Charles Rogers
WR: Mike Williams
TE: Casey Fitzsimmons
LT: Jeff Backus
LG: Rick DeMulling
C: Dominic Raiola
RG: George Foster
RT: Stockar McDougle

DE: Kalimba Edwards
DT: Shaun Rogers
DT: Shaun Cody
DE: Corey Smith
OLB: Boss Bailey
MLB: Paris Lenon
OLB: Teddy Lehman
CB: Dre Bly
CB: Travis Fisher
S: Kennoy Kennedy
S: Kalvin Pearson
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Old 02-21-2009, 03:44 AM    (permalink
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Portis could take his place, the knock on him though is he's never really put together a spectacular season.
Clinton Portis had one of the best rookie runningback seasons in recent memory. Plus he dominated the season after that as well. In his first season he started only 12 games, while starting 13 the next. I'd probably put him on the list over Shaun Alexander. Especially since he's had success with two different ball clubs.

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Old 02-21-2009, 04:47 AM    (permalink
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Id take a guy that has 3-4 incredible seasons over a guy that has 5 nice seasons.
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Old 02-21-2009, 12:34 PM    (permalink
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Id take a guy that has 3-4 incredible seasons over a guy that has 5 nice seasons.
So what are you saying by that?
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Old 02-21-2009, 12:37 PM    (permalink
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agreed. hester may have had the best statistical season out of the two, but he really has only had an great impact for the one season. with hall, it was a few seasons where he was the best. dont think that i am taking anything away from hester, i'd love to have him returning kicks for the vikes, but as of now(even though he has plenty of time to regain form), he isnt that scary returning the kicks. the bears screwed up when they tried to make him a #1 receiver. they should have left him alone, just returning kicks, making half a dozen highlight reels a year.
What? Hester had two amazing seasons as a return man. Hall had, at best, three, and none touch what Hester did.

And the Bears screwed up making him a receiver? He's developing at a very rapid rate. The dude can play.
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Old 02-21-2009, 12:52 PM    (permalink
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And the Bears screwed up making him a receiver? He's developing at a very rapid rate. The dude can play.
he's developing at a very rapid rate? that's why receiver is once again a need of the bears? the man was amazing(and scary) when all he had to do was return kicks. when the bears started to hang their hats on him being their #1 receiver, his return production went down. just because LT has good hands, doesnt mean the chargers should turn him into a wide receiver. and before you question it, i use this anallogy point out that hester was the LT of returners, and special teams is still one third of the game.
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Old 02-21-2009, 01:08 PM    (permalink
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I personally think that the argument would be between Edge vs. Portis. While Alexander was viewed as soft and ran behind an excellent O-Line, he put up just amazing numbers between 01 and 05. I mean, he had 98 TDs in those 5 years(incl rec. tds). And he averaged about 1500 yards rushing and 250 yards receiving in those seasons.

So, as for a Edge vs. Portis argument, let's look at some stats... James has played 25 more games than Portis this decade. So in terms of per game numbers Portis is better in almost every category. He actually even has more TDs than James despite the less games played(76TDs vs. 74TDs this decade). Portis has 7 more yards per game, and 0.4 more yards per carry. The yards per game isn't too significant, but the YPC is. In this argument Edge misses out on his rookie season which really hurts him as he had over 2100 yards from scrimmage and 17 TDs in 1999.

So I think I will be changing Edge to Portis, and leaving Alexander on the list.
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Old 02-21-2009, 01:37 PM    (permalink
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he's developing at a very rapid rate? that's why receiver is once again a need of the bears?
I'm not sure if you're aware of this, but most teams play more than one wide receiver on the field at the same time.

Hester's decline was inevitable as a return man. It happens to every single player. The freakish atleticism he has is better harnessed from an actual position where he can have value for many more years.
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Old 02-21-2009, 01:54 PM    (permalink
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Casey Hampton, OP? Come on you can do better.
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Old 02-21-2009, 02:03 PM    (permalink
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Tony Richardson has been pretty dominant fullback I think too if you wanted to keep it RB / FB for both teams.
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Old 02-21-2009, 02:04 PM    (permalink
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Anyway, here's mine:

1st team
QB- Peyton Manning
RB- LaDanian Tomlinson
RB- Edgerrin James
WR-Terrell Owens
WR- Marvin Harrison
TE- Tony Gonzalez
OT- Walter Jones
OT- Orlando Pace
OG- Alan Faneca
OG- Will Shields
C- Kevin Mawae
DE- Jason Taylor
DE- Michael Strahan
DT- Richard Seymour
DT- Kevin Williams
LB- Ray Lewis
LB- Brian Urlacher
LB- Derrick Brooks
CB- Champ Bailey
CB- Ronde Barber
S- Brian Dawkins
S- Ed Reed
K- Adam Vinatieri
P- Shane Lechler
Ret- Devin Hester
2nd team
QB- Tom Brady
RB- Marshall Faulk
RB- Priest Holmes
WR- Randy Moss
WR- Tory Holt
TE- Antonio Gates
OT- Jonathan Ogden
OT- Willie Roaf
OG- Steve Hutchison
OG- Ruben Brown
C- Olin Kruetz
DE- Dwight Freeney
DE- Julius Peppers
DT- Warren Sapp
DT- Marcus Stroud
LB- Zach Thomas
LB- Joey Porter
LB- James Harrison
CB- Ty Law
CB- Chris McAllister
S- John Lynch
S- Troy Polamalu
K- David Akers
P- Brian Moorman
Ret- Dante Hall
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Old 02-21-2009, 02:13 PM    (permalink
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I'm not sure if you're aware of this, but most teams play more than one wide receiver on the field at the same time.
true, and hester is a good slot receiver, but slot receiver is usually a teams 3rd receiver. is the lack of production in the return game worth the small impact he will make as a receiver? i think not. but we will never see eye to eye on this, so it is pointless for either of us to continue arguing. you think he is making great strides as a receiver, and i think the bears once again screwed up one of their few scoring threats
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Old 02-21-2009, 02:53 PM    (permalink
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true, and hester is a good slot receiver, but slot receiver is usually a teams 3rd receiver. is the lack of production in the return game worth the small impact he will make as a receiver? i think not. pbut we will never see eye to eye on this, so it is pointless for either of us to continue arguing. you think he is making great strides as a receiver, and i think the bears once again screwed up one of their few scoring threats
This is such a lazy and common statement. We won't see eye to eye on this because you aren't substantiating your argument with any supporting logic.

Let's review your statements so far:

Hester is a good slot receiver: I'm actually not quite sure if you understand what a slot receiver does, but Hester is not really a slot receiver. He is best suited in a flanker position, where he is still off the ball but can play more on the outside and generally have the offense tailored to his deep threat abilities. True, he can run a crossing or a screen route, but he can do this from the flanker spot as well. I'm pretty sure you used it just to make a derogatory statement about his worth, which is also puzzling considering the worth of many so-called "slot receivers" (see: Wes Welker).

The Bears have a lack of production in the return game: False. Danieal Manning is still one of the best kick-returners in the NFL. There has unquestionably been a drop-off in the play of Hester, but this was an inevitable occurance anyway. There is a well-established pattern of returners that fizzle after a few years. Perphaps the switch to offense precipitated this, but only by a year or two at best.

Devin Hester will never develop as a receiver: This is the only statement I can't refute you on, because it's complete conjecture. That said, he's already a starting-caliber wide receiver in the NFL, so that alone accounts for a fair amount more production than you are willing to concede.

The Bears once again screwed up a scoring threat: Perhaps the most laughably ignorant comment of all. What scoring threats, where, have the Bears had since Walter Payton? James Allen? Raymont Harris? Cade McNown? Yikes...
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Old 02-21-2009, 02:56 PM    (permalink
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Casey Hampton may have been my Steelers bias sneaking its way in... But he's been a dominant force in the middle for the Steelers pretty much all decade. He's a big reason why their run defense has been top 3 almost without exception this decade.
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Old 02-21-2009, 05:14 PM    (permalink
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what about curtis martin? just thought i'd throw his name out there
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Old 02-21-2009, 05:43 PM    (permalink
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i dont get how you can actually call hester a starting receiver. if it is simply for the fact that your bears have had him start, then fine, i'll concede that point, but i'd still rather start berrian, wade, and even sidney rice over him. for a starter, his numbers are sub par at best. all i've been trying to say is that his value is better at kr than wr, and the bears have put him in a position where he has to concentrate on both, not just one
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Old 02-21-2009, 06:00 PM    (permalink
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Charles Woodson? come on... Ronde Barber easily is better. O and London Fletcher Baker is better than Joey Porter. What about Edgerrin James, his career was better than Shaun Alexander's. Simeon Rice could arguably be on there as well.
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Old 02-21-2009, 06:03 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bearsfan_51 View Post
Anyway, here's mine:

1st team
QB- Peyton Manning
RB- LaDanian Tomlinson
RB- Edgerrin James
WR-Terrell Owens
WR- Marvin Harrison
TE- Tony Gonzalez
OT- Walter Jones
OT- Orlando Pace
OG- Alan Faneca
OG- Will Shields
C- Kevin Mawae
DE- Jason Taylor
DE- Michael Strahan
DT- Richard Seymour
DT- Kevin Williams
LB- Ray Lewis
LB- Brian Urlacher
LB- Derrick Brooks
CB- Champ Bailey
CB- Ronde Barber
S- Brian Dawkins
S- Ed Reed
K- Adam Vinatieri
P- Shane Lechler
Ret- Devin Hester
2nd team
QB- Tom Brady
RB- Marshall Faulk I find it hard to include him he barely played this decade.
RB- Priest Holmes Same as above
WR- Randy Moss
WR- Tory Holt
TE- Antonio Gates
OT- Jonathan Ogden
OT- Willie Roaf
OG- Steve Hutchison
OG- Ruben Brown
C- Olin Kruetz
DE- Dwight Freeney
DE- Julius Peppers
DT- Warren Sapp
DT- Marcus Stroud
LB- Zach Thomas
LB- Joey Porter
LB- James Harrison YOU HAVE TO BE KIDDING ME
CB- Ty Law
CB- Chris McAllister
S- John Lynch
S- Troy Polamalu
K- David Akers
P- Brian Moorman
Ret- Dante Hall
James Harrison? He has been good two years.
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Old 02-21-2009, 06:19 PM    (permalink
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No Bengals players on any of the lists here :(. We should put Willie Anderson in over Roaf just for the sake of diversity :)
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Old 02-21-2009, 07:42 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Bengalsrocket View Post
No Bengals players on any of the lists here :(. We should put Willie Anderson in over Roaf just for the sake of diversity :)
Outside of Pace, Ogden, Walter Jones, Faneca and Mawae, everyone else should be from the Chiefs, they had some sick lines back in the day. Waters, Shields, etc.
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Old 02-21-2009, 07:43 PM    (permalink
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I'm surprised that I dont see Julian Peterson on there.
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Old 02-21-2009, 08:16 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by russie View Post
i dont get how you can actually call hester a starting receiver. if it is simply for the fact that your bears have had him start, then fine, i'll concede that point, but i'd still rather start berrian, wade, and even sidney rice over him. for a starter, his numbers are sub par at best. all i've been trying to say is that his value is better at kr than wr, and the bears have put him in a position where he has to concentrate on both, not just one
Let's say that a starting receiver is a top 64 receiver (for obvious reasons). I would easily put Hester in the top 50. One could make a case for Hester over Berrian, and I've been a big Berrian fan. The truth is that he can do everything Berrian can athletic-wise, and he can catch the ball.

And if you'd rather have Bobby Wade, you honestly don't know what the **** you are talking about. I'm surprised you're continuing with this. You've yet to even make a point.
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