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Old 02-28-2009, 01:56 PM    (permalink) 
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Default We wouldnt give our 2nd round pick for Cassel?
id happily give pick 33 for cassel
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Old 02-28-2009, 01:57 PM    (permalink) 
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I doubt the Pats would have done that one with the Lions. The only reason the Chiefs got it like that is because of Pioli and his connection with the Pats.
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Old 02-28-2009, 01:57 PM    (permalink) 
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I asked that same question.

I love Stafford still, but for that price I'd have taken my chances with Cassel, drafted Jason Smith or Aaron Curry at 1, and someone else at 20.
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Old 02-28-2009, 01:58 PM    (permalink) 
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I doubt the Pats would have done that one with the Lions. The only reason the Chiefs got it like that is because of Pioli and his connection with the Pats.
That makes no sense. New England isn't out to try and help KC. If our pick were higher and on the table, they'd have done it. Especially since we're in the opposite conference.
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Old 02-28-2009, 02:02 PM    (permalink) 
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I think it all depends on the assesments of Stafford, Sanchez, and Freeman. Cassell was a known commodity, but probably with a lower ceiling then the 3 rookies.

So if the Lions felt comfortable with betting that their guy has a strong chance to perform for them then why trade for Cassell as an above avg. QB compared to a potential franchise QB?

Cassell would have been nice from a standpoint that you know what he offers and comes with lower risk, and we would've been able to go a different direction at #1.
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Old 02-28-2009, 02:03 PM    (permalink) 
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That makes no sense. New England isn't out to try and help KC. If our pick were higher and on the table, they'd have done it. Especially since we're in the opposite conference.
I agree, makes no sense.
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Old 02-28-2009, 02:21 PM    (permalink) 
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I think it shows that we've already zeroed in on Stafford for our #1 Pick.
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Old 02-28-2009, 02:35 PM    (permalink) 
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I think it shows that we've already zeroed in on Stafford for our #1 Pick.
Maybe, I also would've liked Vrabel as a SLB and more importantly a mentor.

This deal also increases the chances of Sanchez dropping to #20, still very unlikely IMO, if that's the route they are hoping to take.
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Old 02-28-2009, 02:45 PM    (permalink) 
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That makes no sense. New England isn't out to try and help KC. If our pick were higher and on the table, they'd have done it. Especially since we're in the opposite conference.
How does it not make sense? It's one pick difference. The Lions would have had to give a lot more to get Belichick to deal with them over Pioli and the Chiefs other than one pick. Also, the Chiefs took Vrabel's contract.
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Old 02-28-2009, 02:51 PM    (permalink) 
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I would consider Cassell far far away from being a known commodity or a sure thing. The guy has 1 year of starting experience the last decade. He happened to be in basically the best system in the NFL, which he had been working in for years, with the best coaching. He had 2 pro bowl WR and a stingy defense. Who knows how he would look on a worse team & new system.
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Old 02-28-2009, 02:54 PM    (permalink) 
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Stafford would be much better than Cassel even if it's at the cost of the first pick overall vs the first pick of the second round.
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This deal also increases the chances of Sanchez dropping to #20, still very unlikely IMO, if that's the route they are hoping to take.
That would be a terrible way to go. So you'd pass on Stafford and then hope Sanchez is there at 20? What happens then if he's not? You're SOL and have to waste another year without a franchise QB.
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Old 02-28-2009, 03:02 PM    (permalink) 
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I would consider Cassell far far away from being a known commodity or a sure thing. The guy has 1 year of starting experience the last decade. He happened to be in basically the best system in the NFL, which he had been working in for years, with the best coaching. He had 2 pro bowl WR and a stingy defense. Who knows how he would look on a worse team & new system.
Agree with you, sexy boy. I don't buy Cassel at all.
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Old 02-28-2009, 03:14 PM    (permalink) 
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Agree with you, sexy boy. I don't buy Cassel at all.
But, would you like to buy a vowel?
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Old 02-28-2009, 03:28 PM    (permalink) 
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That's a valid question.

My guess is that Detroit may not definitely feel like they're not a year or two away. As stated above, they'll build around Calvin Johnson and Matt Stafford.
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Old 02-28-2009, 05:41 PM    (permalink) 
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I'm surprised with all this Cassel talk. He had one good year on loaded team.
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Old 03-01-2009, 08:17 AM    (permalink) 
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The Pats weren't any more loaded than any other team this year. Their line sucked, their defense sucked, and they had Welker & Moss...but no one else.
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Old 03-01-2009, 09:28 AM    (permalink) 
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The Pats weren't any more loaded than any other team this year. Their line sucked, their defense sucked, and they had Welker & Moss...but no one else.
WHAT? All they did was pass and their line did not suck.
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Old 03-01-2009, 09:39 AM    (permalink) 
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How does it not make sense? It's one pick difference. The Lions would have had to give a lot more to get Belichick to deal with them over Pioli and the Chiefs other than one pick. Also, the Chiefs took Vrabel's contract.
Ah yes, because Belichek really seems like a warm and fuzzy guy at heart who would trade a valuable comodity to his pal Scott Pioli just to be nice.
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Old 03-01-2009, 09:40 AM    (permalink) 
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That's a valid question.

My guess is that Detroit may not definitely feel like they're not a year or two away. As stated above, they'll build around Calvin Johnson and Matt Stafford.
God help us.
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Old 03-01-2009, 01:57 PM    (permalink) 
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we wouldn't have been interested in him at 14+ million a year. screw that. he's not our missing championship piece so might as well build through the draft and save the cap room for when we actually sell some tickets.
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Old 03-01-2009, 01:57 PM    (permalink) 
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Some people think New England turned down the 3 way deal to stick it to Josh McDaniels. I guess that makes sense.. Giving him to KC at a discount doesn't make much sense, but I wouldn't put it past them.. Though now they don't have to pay the around $18 Million that they would have owed to Cassel and Vrabel.

I don't really think we could have got Matt Cassel for #33.
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Old 03-02-2009, 08:16 AM    (permalink) 
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Think of it this way, if he couldn't get a team that was 16-0 into the playoffs, what does he do with a bad, average, or even above average squad?

Good move, keep your picks, take a real QB.
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Old 03-02-2009, 09:18 AM    (permalink) 
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Who's to say Cassel is that much safer than Stafford. Maybe Cassel wouldn't play as well with the Lions. If the Lions traded for Cassel they'd have to pay him a large contract and also play someone else #1 overall pick money. You could argue just taking Stafford and paying him #1 overall money is less of a risk because pick 33 won't go to another big contract. Here are 2 reasonable scenarios

#1: Stafford
#20: Brian Cushing or some other defender
#33 William Beatty

#1: Jason Smith
#20: Brian Cushing or some other defender
#33: Traded for Cassel

I don't see how the second scenario is all that much safer. The idea of taking a LB #1 overall just seems silly to me, so I won't bother with that scenario.
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Old 03-02-2009, 09:53 AM    (permalink) 
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Originally Posted by Halsey View Post
Who's to say Cassel is that much safer than Stafford. Maybe Cassel wouldn't play as well with the Lions. If the Lions traded for Cassel they'd have to pay him a large contract and also play someone else #1 overall pick money. You could argue just taking Stafford and paying him #1 overall money is less of a risk because pick 33 won't go to another big contract. Here's are 2 reasonable scenarios

#1: Stafford
#20: Brian Cushing or some other defender
#33 William Beatty

#1: Jason Smith
#20: Brian Cushing or some other defender
#33: Traded for Cassel

I don't see how the second scenario is all that much safer. The idea of taking a LB #1 overall just seems silly to me, so I won't bother with that scenario.
I love scenario A. Cushing or Peria Jerry at 20 would be nice.
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Old 03-02-2009, 09:59 AM    (permalink) 
tblain1
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Originally Posted by Halsey View Post
Who's to say Cassel is that much safer than Stafford. Maybe Cassel wouldn't play as well with the Lions. If the Lions traded for Cassel they'd have to pay him a large contract and also play someone else #1 overall pick money. You could argue just taking Stafford and paying him #1 overall money is less of a risk because pick 33 won't go to another big contract. Here's are 2 reasonable scenarios

#1: Stafford
#20: Brian Cushing or some other defender
#33 William Beatty

#1: Jason Smith
#20: Brian Cushing or some other defender
#33: Traded for Cassel

I don't see how the second scenario is all that much safer. The idea of taking a LB #1 overall just seems silly to me, so I won't bother with that scenario.
With Matt Cassell at least you have some sort of pro experience to gauge. And I would say a sucessful one at that. He has a good system, yes. But plugging in new players to a good system doesn't always work. Look how bad Dallas was when Romo was hurt. Matt Cassell is more of a known quantity and if you just trading him straight up for a pick that could eventually be William Beatty sounds good to me.

The thing that gives me jitters with Cassell is the one year cap hit and then whatever we would pay him after that (although it would have to come down I would imagine). Still we would be commiting a lot more long term to an unknown in Stafford.

What is our cap space? 27 million? And what is his cap hit? I know his 1-year franchise tag is something like $14 million, but thats probably not all cap hit right? Still that about cuts our cap room in half. But thats the price of a top QB I guess...
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