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Old 03-01-2009, 03:20 AM    (permalink
HellonEarth84
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Default If 1 year ago, someone said Cassel and Vrabel

If 1 year ago, someone said Cassel and Vrabel would get the Pats a high 2nd rounder, you'd call them crazy.

I'm happy with the pick. I think the Pats could've got a bit more, but it wouldnt have been much. Maybe a 5th-6th rounder as a flyer, but they wouldnt have ended up making the team anyways.

If we sign a CB in FA, then draft OLB, SS, OT with the first 3 picks, we can then trade our other 2nd rounder or the 3rd rounder and snatch up more picks for next year.
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Old 03-01-2009, 06:03 AM    (permalink
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I'm happy enough with the trade because I just don't see what Vrabel would have added to the team extra a locker room presence next year and the market just didn't warrant a first for Cassel. Now on draft day if both Stafford and Sanchez were gone say top 5 then the price could've been jacked up but then free agency would have been a non-factor.
Personally i'd like either Leigh Bodden or Ron Bartell and Sean Jones, however I hear that Shawn Springs is visiting and he sounds like just the player that BB would take.
As for the draft I think we could definitely take a 'luxury' pick of BPA in the 1st. I say this because the value on our biggest needs ie; OLB and secondary probably won't be ther, however at WR(which has become a need) should be excellent. I would be very surprised of all of Crabtree, Maclin, DHB, Harvin, Nicks and Britt are all gone by 23. Personally I would absolutely love Harvin
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Old 03-01-2009, 07:51 AM    (permalink
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We could have gotten more.
Was it a bad trade? No. It just wasn't as good as it could of been.
Now it all depends on what we do in FA now.
If we make no big moves from here to the draft
then it was terrible trade. We shoulda kept it til then when we a 1st rd would of been certain.
If we make a big splash in FA now then the trade is a total success.

As much as I love Harvin as a NE prospect...
Chad Jackson still haunts me. A Florida WR who ran a faster 40 then Harvin.
I'd rather have Nicks if he was available.
I'd be with it (drafting a WR @ 23) if Larry English/Simtim/Maybin are gone
If not- I think we should definitely go pass rushing OLB.
If all 3 are gone- then I say let's take a WR... either Harvin/DHB/Britt/Nicks
then grab that OLB prospect with one of our 2nds.
If that happend though... who would start oppisite A.Thomas then?
TBC? Crable? Woods? Guyton? We need a good OLB prospect more then we need a 3rd WR
If we can have no-names (Givens, Caldwell, Patten, Gaffney) fill that role just fine
then I'm sure we can grab someone through free agency or via trade (i.e. Welker)
We seem to do a good job with that.

Some noticable FA WR that I wouldn't mind joining the team as our 3 guy:
-Miles Austin (Dallas Cowboys) I LOVE THIS GUY!
-Drew Bennet (Rams)
-Michael Clayton (Bucs)
-Mike Furrey (Lions)- Welker-ish
-Joey Galloway (Bucs)
-Marvin Harrison (Colts)
-Devery Henderson (Saints)
-Justin McCareins (Titans)
-Reggie Williams (Jags)
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Old 03-01-2009, 11:48 AM    (permalink
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I'm happy they got somethign for him. Better than keeping him an his huge salary.

So they got the best they could.

Vrabel wasn't going to do anything most likely. May not have made the team.

Don't know why they couldn't have gotten a conditional like "another 2nd if they make the playoffs under Cassel", but oh well.

Harvin is electric, can he be a #2 WR down the field? Or is he more a slot guy?

I'm hesistant to waste a high pick on a WR, cause they bust so often and NE hs had crazy bad luck with Jackson and Johnson.

Dillard from Rice could be a good pickup in the 4th or so. High quality guy, great hands, route running, etc. Kind of smallish hands and not incredibly fast but hugely productive.
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Old 03-01-2009, 12:19 PM    (permalink
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Harvin makes no sense for the Pats...he occupies the same space as Welker in that offense... They need a guy to get down field and open things up in the middle... Nicks or Britt with one of their picks would be great if they can't move into a spot to grab Maclin, DHB, or Crabs.
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Old 03-01-2009, 12:27 PM    (permalink
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Harvin makes no sense for the Pats...he occupies the same space as Welker in that offense... They need a guy to get down field and open things up in the middle... Nicks or Britt with one of their picks would be great if they can't move into a spot to grab Maclin, DHB, or Crabs.
Doubt they take any of those guys. They'd have to spend a high pick and they know they are jinxed/poor talent evaluators when it comes to WR as high picks.

DHB especially, is he just a guy who runs one route down field as a track star? I'd rather get an all around WR later who can do more than one thing, like Dillard, although he probably has other weaknesses.
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Old 03-01-2009, 12:49 PM    (permalink
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They aren't poor talent evaluators as far as WRs go. They knew that Bethel Johnson was nothing more than straight-line speed, and he did a solid job for them in that capacity. He was a luxury pick, just like Jackson was. Jackson failed because he was always injured.

And, really, they don't need much more than a straight-line speed guy to blow past CB's and tie up safeties anyway... That's what they really lacked in 2008 without Stallworth.

All 3 of those top WRs should be gone by pick 15, but the Pats can put themselves in a situation to get one...
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Old 03-01-2009, 01:00 PM    (permalink
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They aren't poor talent evaluators as far as WRs go. They knew that Bethel Johnson was nothing more than straight-line speed, and he did a solid job for them in that capacity. He was a luxury pick, just like Jackson was. Jackson failed because he was always injured.

And, really, they don't need much more than a straight-line speed guy to blow past CB's and tie up safeties anyway... That's what they really lacked in 2008 without Stallworth.

All 3 of those top WRs should be gone by pick 15, but the Pats can put themselves in a situation to get one...
3WR iin the top 15?

I don't know how valuable a guy who is just a burner is. Bsides they could draft that guy from Miss. much later. Moss has the ability to do that, doesn't he? Brady doesn't throw the most accurate deep ball...kind of lofts it anyway.

Disagree on Johnson. I think they expected him to be an actual WR, not just a guy who runs fast and runs only one route. He sucked.

Jackson was an all out bust. INjured once, yes, but didn't have the maturity or the intelligence to learn anything.

Hakeem Nicks in the 2nd maybe. That would be interesting. I think he'll last that long.

Jarrett Dillard in the 4th/5th would be good.
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Old 03-01-2009, 01:20 PM    (permalink
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Maclin's a beast. There's not a whole lot of reason for him to be ranked so much lower than Crabs by so many people. And someone is going to draft DHB early on. My guess would be Oakland. So, ya, they'll all be gone by 15.

None of those 3 will be around, and after them, there's not great value in taking a WR in the first round for the Pats. I'd love Nicks (favorite college WR in 2008) in the 2nd round, but wouldn't be sad to see them pass on a WR until a little later (Dillard is in that group of guys I'd love to see in New England).

The Pats should go after one of those Top 3 guys though.
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Old 03-01-2009, 01:57 PM    (permalink
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percy at first glance would be your prototypical slot guy but i think he has the tools to be a solid #2.... he def needs to work on route running but i think he gives you alot of speed on the perimeter and gives you alot more flexibility on offense to put in a wildcat formation or a guy you could exclusively run screens for. he would give us a boost on offense and is a homerun threat that is needed in my opinion. yes we have moss, but you wont see moss having alot of 60 yard tds as he is aging and harvin could easily bust one
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Old 03-01-2009, 05:00 PM    (permalink
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percy at first glance would be your prototypical slot guy but i think he has the tools to be a solid #2.... he def needs to work on route running but i think he gives you alot of speed on the perimeter and gives you alot more flexibility on offense to put in a wildcat formation or a guy you could exclusively run screens for. he would give us a boost on offense and is a homerun threat that is needed in my opinion. yes we have moss, but you wont see moss having alot of 60 yard tds as he is aging and harvin could easily bust one
I'd back that up by saying he didnt have a strong armed QB in college or a system that would get him the ball down the field. May be a bit of a luxury pick but with 3 2nds i think you can take him and still get your other positions filled in round 2.
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Old 03-01-2009, 05:03 PM    (permalink
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The crazy thing about the trade is the fact that they turned down the deal in place where they would have landed the 12th pick...that is what doesn't make sense...but yes value sure shot up.
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Old 03-01-2009, 06:44 PM    (permalink
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yea that really puzzles me
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Old 03-02-2009, 08:12 PM    (permalink
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Old 03-05-2009, 05:48 PM    (permalink
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I'm sure if they held out a lil longer or waited till the draft they could have gotten a 1st for Cassell/Vrabel or even a conditional pick in next years draft. But since they made the move that frees up a lot of cap space to make some moves in FA and possibly redo some contracts. I dont think the front office wanted to put the money into signing a high draft pick with some major free agents to be next season (Seymour, Wilfork, Mankins) although an Curry/Mayo combo would've been amazing...
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Old 03-06-2009, 09:33 AM    (permalink
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Is there any reliable source reporting offers for Cassel? The only thing I see is the 3 team deal that Denver declined. I have not read a single report about Detroit or Tampa making any offers, yet idiots like Mariotti are still spewing nonsense.

Has anyone seen anything other than that 3 way trade?
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