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Old 03-15-2009, 08:50 PM    (permalink
Scotty D
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Default Should we trade Ernie?

Ernie has been a solid LB since entering the league, but his play has been more of a second round LB then the #9 overall. Schwartz and Mayhew are putting an emphasis on size while building this team and the undersized Ernie Sims may not be a player they want to have here in the future. We are going to be moving away from a Tampa 2 I assume and the assets his trade would bring could help the re-building.

What do you think his value would be?

Any trade ideas?

Would it be worth it?

Ernie Sims for John Henderson + maybe a pick
" " for picks from Indy?
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Old 03-15-2009, 08:53 PM    (permalink
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I love Ernie, but I would'nt be sad if we traded him. I love his personality and the leadership he brings to the team...but his size and play limit us and schwartz possible schemes. We have a couple of pieces that could be either 4-3 or 3-4 and Ernie is not one of them, he is strictly 4-3 tampa 2.
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Old 03-15-2009, 08:53 PM    (permalink
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You wouldn't get good enough value in return. In theory I think you guys would benefit from something like that, but the offers you'd get wouldn't be worth it.
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Old 03-15-2009, 08:54 PM    (permalink
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You finally have a position that isn't a weakness (OLB) and now you want to get rid of Ernie Sims? I don't understand.
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Old 03-15-2009, 08:58 PM    (permalink
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Send him over to Buffalo.
We'll give you Chris Kelsay! ;)
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But for everyone reading this in Buffalo and Cleveland and everywhere else, take solace in the following: As crazy as it sounds, you're lucky. Your Mount Everest experience is still ahead of you. It's waiting, and it's glorious.- Bill Simmons
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Old 03-15-2009, 08:59 PM    (permalink
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It depends on what we could get in return for him. He is nothing without Shaun Rogers.
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Old 03-15-2009, 09:01 PM    (permalink
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Default

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Originally Posted by TACKLE View Post
You finally have a position that isn't a weakness (OLB) and now you want to get rid of Ernie Sims? I don't understand.
He was much more valuable in the defense Rod was running. I still think he's a good player though and maybe when we add more pieces to the defense it will help him out. I'd hope he and Julian Peterson become good friends. To bad Tampa is moving away from their old ways because I'm sure they'd love Sims to replace Derrick Brooks.
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Old 03-15-2009, 09:04 PM    (permalink
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Buffalo still runs the tampa-2... :(
and we have a need for a WLB, with Posluszny in the middle, and Mitchell as a SLB.
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But for everyone reading this in Buffalo and Cleveland and everywhere else, take solace in the following: As crazy as it sounds, you're lucky. Your Mount Everest experience is still ahead of you. It's waiting, and it's glorious.- Bill Simmons
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Old 03-15-2009, 09:04 PM    (permalink
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I don't want to trade him. I would if we got a good offer.. I wouldn't shop him around though.
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Old 03-15-2009, 09:05 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Bills2083 View Post
Buffalo still runs the tampa-2... :(
and we have a need for a WLB, with Posluszny in the middle, and Mitchell as a SLB.
I'd take a third a third next year maybe. I'd ask for a second first though. That'd be a good team fit though in Buffalo, interesting.
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Old 03-15-2009, 09:09 PM    (permalink
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You finally have a position that isn't a weakness (OLB) and now you want to get rid of Ernie Sims? I don't understand.
Ernie Sims has been a weakness for the past one and a half seasons.
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Old 03-15-2009, 09:09 PM    (permalink
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You finally have a position that isn't a weakness (OLB) and now you want to get rid of Ernie Sims? I don't understand.
Must........ draft........ Aaron........ Curry........ [/zombie]
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Old 03-15-2009, 09:21 PM    (permalink
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I'd take a third a third next year maybe. I'd ask for a second first though. That'd be a good team fit though in Buffalo, interesting.
I haven't seen Sims play too much recently.
What's the major knock on him right now?
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my lord...I cannot imagine such a world where I can mention Raymell Rice's thighs around a girl and not be the only one sexually aroused
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But for everyone reading this in Buffalo and Cleveland and everywhere else, take solace in the following: As crazy as it sounds, you're lucky. Your Mount Everest experience is still ahead of you. It's waiting, and it's glorious.- Bill Simmons
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Old 03-15-2009, 09:24 PM    (permalink
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A rich man's Demorrio Williams? Can over pursue by going for that big hit. Plays much bigger then his size but it can still be a hindrance. Doesn't have the knack for big plays (INTS, Sacks, FF). Solid 100+ tackle a year LB though. Doesn't have an injury history yet. Still on rookie deal. Very fast and good in coverage.
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Old 03-15-2009, 09:29 PM    (permalink
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A rich man's Demorrio Williams? Can over pursue by going for that big hit. Plays much bigger then his size but it can still be a hindrance. Doesn't have the knack for big plays (INTS, Sacks, FF). Solid 100+ tackle a year LB though. Doesn't have an injury history yet. Still on rookie deal. Very fast and good in coverage.
-We don't have anyone in the LB corp that makes big hits. It would be nice to see, finally, even though if he overpursues a little too often.


-Our LBs rarely make interceptions as it is. We blitz Mitchell the most, so he gets most of the sacks.

-Good to see.


I read that he does better with a big body in front of him. Is it because that linemen (Rogers) ate up most of the offensive linemen, allowing for Sims to make plays on the ball?
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But for everyone reading this in Buffalo and Cleveland and everywhere else, take solace in the following: As crazy as it sounds, you're lucky. Your Mount Everest experience is still ahead of you. It's waiting, and it's glorious.- Bill Simmons
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Old 03-15-2009, 09:43 PM    (permalink
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Doesn't Schwartz still run a version of the Cover 2? If that's the case I think he still fits fine in the Lion's D at WLB.
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Old 03-15-2009, 09:48 PM    (permalink
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I read that he does better with a big body in front of him. Is it because that linemen (Rogers) ate up most of the offensive linemen, allowing for Sims to make plays on the ball?

Yes thats when Ernie was at his best, thats really true for a lot of LBs. Their true value and skill is shown when DTs give them space to work.
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Old 03-15-2009, 09:50 PM    (permalink
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Yes thats when Ernie was at his best, thats really true for a lot of LBs. Their true value and skill is shown when DTs give them space to work.

That works well with the Bills because we have Stroud up front.
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But for everyone reading this in Buffalo and Cleveland and everywhere else, take solace in the following: As crazy as it sounds, you're lucky. Your Mount Everest experience is still ahead of you. It's waiting, and it's glorious.- Bill Simmons
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Old 03-15-2009, 09:51 PM    (permalink
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-We don't have anyone in the LB corp that makes big hits. It would be nice to see, finally, even though if he overpursues a little too often.


-Our LBs rarely make interceptions as it is. We blitz Mitchell the most, so he gets most of the sacks.

-Good to see.


I read that he does better with a big body in front of him. Is it because that linemen (Rogers) ate up most of the offensive linemen, allowing for Sims to make plays on the ball?
Yup. Sims needs someone to eat up blockers so he can use his speed to roam. Sometimes his speed hurts him though and he runs himself out of a tackle by either overpursuing or just putting himself into a bad position to make a solid tackle.

I honestly wouldn't trade Sims for anything less than a 2nd and additional picks. I don't see the value in it. We have some big, fat DT's to hopefully take some pressure off of him in the run game this year. He is still young and even though (i havent actually heard this so Im assuming you people know what youre talking about) Schwartz prefers bigger guys I think he could still prosper greatly in a defense where he isnt the only guy with talent.
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Old 03-15-2009, 09:56 PM    (permalink
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I think he could still prosper greatly in a defense where he isnt the only guy with talent.
I agree with this. Sims is a great complimentary LB to a defense, but he isn't the leader or big playmaker.
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Old 03-15-2009, 09:57 PM    (permalink
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Default Protect HIM

Protect him with some D-Tackles and he becomes a stud once again. I think Schwartz will like his attitude.
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Old 03-15-2009, 09:58 PM    (permalink
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If Detroit seriosuly wanted to trade Ernie Sims (and I doubt they do) the Giants are probably the best fit.

The Giants want more speed and athletism at OLB; they have a damn good DLine for him to play behind and their LBs tend to play down hill which is a good fit for Sims. More importantly they have a truck load of draft picks and very few team needs.

If Detroit are willing to trade Sims and if they want a 2nd round pick, the Giants will more than likely be very willing to trade #60 for Sims and perhaps #45. Alternatively they also have plenty of good players they could include as part of a deal at positions of need for the Lions.

Buffalo have alot of holes to fill and probably wouldn't offer as much for a OLB; defensively pass rushers are a much more urgent need.

Derrick Johnson could also be a similar trade option for teams with Kansas City shifting to a 3-4; particularly as he is off contract after 2009.

Alot has been made of Jim Schwartz, but don't forget the Lions brought in Gunther Cunninham who used more mobile LBs like Donnie Edwards and Derrick Johnson at KC.

Last edited by Big_Pete : 03-15-2009 at 10:17 PM.
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Old 03-15-2009, 09:59 PM    (permalink
DoWnThEfiElD
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Linebackers usually play much better with a decent D-Line
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Old 03-15-2009, 10:05 PM    (permalink
LOLitsTomBrady
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hell no. Ernie is our best player on defense. Hes small yes but he still makes great plays and can tackle.
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Old 03-16-2009, 09:36 AM    (permalink
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I don't want to see Ernie get traded either. He's someone you can build the defence around and is still young enough to do that. Personally, I can't wait to see him and Peterson play together.
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