San Francisco 49ers Discussion

[Madirishman]

Originally Posted by phlysac

I was of that opinion as well but due to the lack of rush ends in this year's draft I am incresingly concerned that potential 3-4 OLBs...

Brian Orakpo
Everette Brown
Aaron Maybin
Clay Matthews
Michael Johnson
Connor Barwin
Larry English
Lawrence Sidbury

will all be off the board at #43.

I believe that about half of these guys will be busts as OLBs, as many of the better pass rushing DEs making the transition have little or no experience in coverage and many of the LBs with covering skills aren't great pass rushers. Something's gotta give.

I live Maybin as a boom-or-bust project player, but he's not worth the gamble at 10 IMO. I believe he will ultimately transition in the NFL better as a 4-3 pass rushing DE than a 3-4 OLB. With that being said, I'm not sold on Brown at 10 either and Orakpo I have questions about, so hopefully he'll be off the board before the Niners pick.

[abaddon41_80]

Originally Posted by YAYareaRB

Well there you go.. you might be the only one who believes that.

I firmly believe that Maybin is a better prospect at 4-3 DE or 3-4 OLB than Brown and a better 3-4 OLB prospect than Orakpo. Maybin >>> Brown.

[YAYareaRB]

Originally Posted by abaddon41_80

I firmly believe that Maybin in a better prospect at 4-3 DE or 3-4 OLB than Brown and a better 3-4 OLB prospect than Orakpo. Maybin >>> Brown.

Well when it comes to 3-4 OLB I think both Brown and Orakpo are better than Maybin.

I think Orakpo is the best of the 3. He possesses a wide range of pass rushing technique, sheds blocks better, and consistently brings it off the end. Maybin plays exactly like Manny Lawson, something I don't want.

[king2am]

Originally Posted by YAYareaRB

Well when it comes to 3-4 OLB I think both Brown and Orakpo are better than Maybin.

I think Orakpo is the best of the 3. He possesses a wide range of pass rushing technique, sheds blocks better, and consistently brings it off the end. Maybin plays exactly like Manny Lawson, something I don't want.

I'm not a big fan of Maybin, and would rather have Orakpo or Brown before him.

However...I do NOT believe that Orakpo possesses a wide range of pass rushing techniques. I believe that belongs to Brown

[abaddon41_80]

Brown is the most NFL ready of the 3 but he also has the lowest ceiling. He already has a wide range of pass rushing moves and his body is pretty much maxed out. I see no potential for him to be anything more than he is now.

Orakpo and Maybin are different. Both have only okay pass rushing moves right now but, with proper coaching, could become All Pro players.

[Brent]

I think Maybin should have stayed in college. He's undersized and he's going to get pushed around by OTs. I think Sack-po is damn near reached his ceiling. I think Brown is short but the better of those three.

However, I dont think Brown is worth #10 any more. The best value is that late-1st/early 2nd round area.

[farfromforgotten]

Originally Posted by Brent

However, I dont think Brown is worth #10 any more. The best value is that late-1st/early 2nd round area.

Agreed. I'm not sold on any of those pass rushers in the top 10.

I was trying to think of how many prospects there are in this draft that I feel are worth a top 10 pick. Here is what I came up with (in no order):

Matthew Stafford
Michael Crabtree
Jason Smith
Eugene Monroe
Andre Smith
BJ Raji
Aaron Curry

Those are really the only ones I'm completely sold on as being worth a top 10 pick. I would then add Malcolm Jenkins and Jeremy Maclin. And I would have to add Mark Sanchez to be able to complete that list.

Thats how I see it anyways.

[Brent]

I like Maclin but I worry that he's kind of one dimensional, in that he is only a deep threat. If we cant land one of the top 4 OTs or Raji, I would love it if they took Crabtree (assuming he is there). I think he could be an amazing #1 or at least a ridiculously good possession WR.

There was a quote I saw on the cover of the ESPN magazine from him that I liked: "I could run a 4.4 in crutches" haha.

[abaddon41_80]

Andre Smith
Brian Orakpo
Eugene Monroe
Matt Stafford
Aaron Maybin

Those are my 5 favorite prospects in the draft, in that order. I know that Stafford and Monroe are not dropping to 10 and there is a very small chance that Orakpo will. Smith might or might not.

[Brent]

Originally Posted by abaddon41_80

Andre Smith
Brian Orakpo
Eugene Monroe
Matt Stafford
Aaron Maybin

Those are my 5 favorite prospects in the draft, in that order. I know that Stafford and Monroe are not dropping to 10 and there is a very small chance that Orakpo will. Smith might or might not.

While I respect your opinion, I just do not feel in anyway comfortable with taking Maybin that high, let alone in the first 20 picks.

[abaddon41_80]

Originally Posted by Brent

While I respect your opinion, I just do not feel in anyway comfortable with taking Maybin that high, let alone in the first 20 picks.

I realize that most people don't agree with people and look at Maybin as a 'boom or bust', undersized, one-year wonder but I think he has more potential than any prospect in the past 5 years.

[phlysac]

He's the most similar "athletically" to DeMarcus Ware of any 3-4 OLB prospect since.

[thediggler3030]

Originally Posted by phlysac

He's the most similar "athletically" to DeMarcus Ware of any 3-4 OLB prospect since.

Yeah I agree.

I don't understand the Maybin hate either. I think the steroid rumors really hurt people's perceptions of him. As well as the fact that Scott hates him...

He isn't my number one choice because I don't think he will contribute as a starter right away. I would rather Andre Smith or B.J. Raji or maybe even Malcolm Jenkins. But Maybin has the most long term potential out of every first round 3-4 OLB prospect.

I don't think its a negative that he is raw, not with the players we have now. The fact that he is so undeveloped means we could be getting a huge discount. Drafting Maybin and allowing Haralson to start for another year while platooning would be a good scenario to be in for both the long and short term.

I also think every 3-4 OLB is a boom/bust type player because most of them (Brown and Orakpo included) are switching positions.

[phlysac]

Agreed. People tend to forget that DeMarcus Ware was considered a reach by some (picked 11th.) He was considered an undersized athlete that got by on speed. He also was a player that gained 20lbs in between his final game and the Combine. Both Ware and Maybin weighed in at 6'4" 250. Ran ~4.6 and had a ~40" vertical. Maybin actually registered faster times and better jumps than Ware. While Maybin's negative of only starting one full season is legitmate, it isn't far different from those that were concerned with Ware converting from 4-3 OLB early in his career to DE his final 2 years while playing against lesser competition.

[Madirishman]

Everyone agrees that Maybin has a lot of upside, but that means he has a long way to go, especially in coverage. I wouldn't call it "hate" with him at all, but "skepticism" would definitely be there, as it should be with the type of project player he is and lack of experience he has. With all the above facts, drafting him with the 10th pick is a bit of a reach, and will only be worth it if he turns out to be a stud pass rusher.

More and more, it looks like the Niners should trade back a few spots if one of the top 6-8 players aren't left. I'm thinking the Jets are a great possibility to be a trade partner if Sanchez is still on the board at 10.

[phlysac]

That's what I'm confused about. If any of the guys were "can't miss" they wouldn't be available at pick #10. Upside has to be a very integral part of the equation. Many people list lack of experience in coverage as a knock on Maybin. The fact is that is a concern of every 4-3 DE turned 4-3 OLB in the history of the NFL. Fortunately, Maybin has limited experience in coverage at Penn Sate. More experience than Orakpo and Brown, in fact.

[Madirishman]

Originally Posted by phlysac

That's what I'm confused about. If any of the guys were "can't miss" they wouldn't be available at pick #10. Upside has to be a very integral part of the equation. Many people list lack of experience in coverage as a knock on Maybin. The fact is that is a concern of every 4-3 DE turned 4-3 OLB in the history of the NFL. Fortunately, Maybin has limited experience in coverage at Penn Sate. More experience than Orakpo and Brown, in fact.

True, and that is why I think that taking one of the elite OTs at 10 (if available) is the best way to go. There still may be one of the "tweeners" available in Round 2 who would have less pressure to perform right away (and less money invested) than a 1st Round Pick, giving him the chance to develop and reach that potential upside.

[WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?]

Originally Posted by 49ersfan_87

I remember reading somewhere that out of all the visits last year, the only player we drafted was Josh Morgan.

They also like to bring in a lot of prospects so they have player profiles on these guys down the road when they hit free agency.

[WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?]

Two draft tidbits from Maiocco's twitter:
http://twitter.com/MattMaiocco

Random draft thought: I just can’t see 49ers selecting Jeremy Maclin, Aaron Maybin, Everette Brown or Malcolm Jenkins with the No. 10 pick.
1:05 PM Apr 8th from web

Random draft thought: This is the first time since 2005 that trading down in the first round might be an option as 49ers draft strategy.
about 17 hours ago from web

I acutally wouldn't mind seeing Scotty Mac trade down, snag a few extra picks, and then package those picks and jump back into round one again.

[abaddon41_80]

Originally Posted by Madirishman

Everyone agrees that Maybin has a lot of upside, but that means he has a long way to go, especially in coverage. I wouldn't call it "hate" with him at all, but "skepticism" would definitely be there, as it should be with the type of project player he is and lack of experience he has. With all the above facts, drafting him with the 10th pick is a bit of a reach, and will only be worth it if he turns out to be a stud pass rusher.

More and more, it looks like the Niners should trade back a few spots if one of the top 6-8 players aren't left. I'm thinking the Jets are a great possibility to be a trade partner if Sanchez is still on the board at 10.

I disagree with that. Out of all the top 3-4 OLB prospects (Orakpo, Brown, Maybin, Ayers, Barwin), Maybin has shown the best coverage abilities. He actually dropped back in coverage a quite a few times last year and showed a lot of ability.

[Madirishman]

Originally Posted by abaddon41_80

I disagree with that. Out of all the top 3-4 OLB prospects (Orakpo, Brown, Maybin, Ayers, Barwin), Maybin has shown the best coverage abilities. He actually dropped back in coverage a quite a few times last year and showed a lot of ability.

I would love to see the evidence on this, as I like Maybin as a prospect. Everything I've seen and read, he is inexperienced in the passing game especially.

[abaddon41_80]

I watched a few Penn State games (Iowa, OSU, Michigan State) and I saw him drop back into coverage at least a few times in all of those games. Scott's analysis of him even mentions

Has displayed some ability and promise in coverage

[Brent]

Originally Posted by abaddon41_80

I watched a few Penn State games (Iowa, OSU, Michigan State) and I saw him drop back into coverage at least a few times in all of those games. Scott's analysis of him even mentions

Has displayed some ability and promise in coverage

I thought he disappeared against Oregon State. Late teens or early 20s, I'd have no problem with taking Maybin but at 10? I think it's just too high.

[YAYareaRB]

Originally Posted by Brent

I thought he disappeared against Oregon State. Late teens or early 20s, I'd have no problem with taking Maybin but at 10? I think it's just too high.

The whole USC defense disappeared against Oregon State.

[abaddon41_80]

Originally Posted by Brent

I thought he disappeared against Oregon State. Late teens or early 20s, I'd have no problem with taking Maybin but at 10? I think it's just too high.

Ohio State, not Oregon State.