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Old 05-25-2009, 08:56 PM    (permalink
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Staley also shut down Joey Porter.. His only sack of the game came against Sims to end the game.
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Old 05-25-2009, 10:24 PM    (permalink
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Staley had a hell of a year last year. By the end, he was looking like an all-pro at LT.
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Old 05-26-2009, 12:18 AM    (permalink
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Staley had a hell of a year last year. By the end, he was looking like an all-pro at LT.
Yeah Joe is the last guy you need to worry about on our line. If Rachal continues to improve and Baas stays healthy our whole interrior will be spectacular.
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I dunno even half of those guys why did we sign them jeez.
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Old 05-26-2009, 12:56 AM    (permalink
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And Eric Heitmann is FAR, FAR, FAR from over the hill. He's only 29.
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Old 05-26-2009, 02:21 AM    (permalink
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I'm really liking their o-line for the 1st time in a decade. Only Staley regressed last yr & got benched for what, 2 games? In past yrs. the whole starting front 5 regressed, & with Kwame Harris pass blocking the blind side at LT their QBs got slammed around like pinballs.

Heitmann was an UDFA they signed b/c he was local (Stanford) but had the size & versatility to play all 5 o-line spots to be a needed swingman, I believe he has done all 5 too, & now he's over the hill. He replaced Newberry at C & by that time the mileage had caught up to Newberry, his knees were held together with rubber bands & glue.

Now I think Heitmann is looking the worse for wear, time to work last yr's 4th rd. pick Cody Wallace into the center slot. Wallace is very fb-savvy & was offensive captain at Texas A&M, I think he will fit the bill once he learns NFL blocking schemes & that can only come with the reps & experience. Rachal is a younger, bigger, better Justin Smiley in the opposite G spot, a better pass protector than they had thought.
Not to beat a dead horse... But they drafted Heitmann in the 7th round, he wasn't an undrafted free agent
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Old 05-26-2009, 02:24 AM    (permalink
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Scott gave our draft a B+.

I'm glad, cause I had heard him speaking pretty negatively on that radio show he does. So I'm glad he came around.

I think a lot of analysts didn't like our draft on face because we didn't fill our passrush or OT needs. But they aren't giving the team credit value-wise.
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Old 05-26-2009, 02:53 AM    (permalink
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And the B+ could be higher or lower depending on what we do with the Panthers first rounder next year.
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Old 05-26-2009, 03:00 AM    (permalink
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And the B+ could be higher or lower depending on what we do with the Panthers first rounder next year.
We gotta address our pass rush "issue"
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Old 05-26-2009, 09:19 AM    (permalink
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A lot of analysts are idiots cause they said we didn't address our WR "issue" last year, and gave us bad draft grades for drafting a lot of interior "non sexy" players like Balmer, Rachal, and Wallace. We also picked up Morgan in the 6th, who could be a star, or at least start.

So didn't they almost exceed expectations then, by not only drafting need, but also getting other player like Balmer and Rachal who has a huge upside? A lot of people thought Wallace was the best center in that draft, and they took him in the middle rounds.

I wouldn't say last year was an A+ draft (it's too early to tell) but if our top need (from the "analysts" perspective) was WR and we ended up with Morgan (who did have an impact his rookie season) then the Niners get credit for that. But with draft grades, it's all about if teams took their perceived need(s) early in the draft. It's a joke.
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Old 05-26-2009, 09:22 AM    (permalink
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It's a joke.
Grading drafts should be about value at this point and not addressing needs.
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Old 05-26-2009, 09:34 AM    (permalink
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Grading drafts should be about value at this point and not addressing needs.
I would say perceived value. As no draft pick has begun to actually fulfill their value, you must come to the conclusion they were drafted on their perceived value. Grading drafts at this point requires a dual scale (value AND need).
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Old 05-26-2009, 09:39 AM    (permalink
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I would say perceived value. As no draft pick has begun to actually fulfill their value, you must come to the conclusion they were drafted on their perceived value. Grading drafts at this point requires a dual scale (value AND need).
That's what I meant by value. Where are you drafting them in relation to what their grades are. However, we dont know how each team grades a player though it would be interesting if after a draft a team would show what their board looked like.
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Old 05-26-2009, 10:00 AM    (permalink
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I stand corrected, somebody got benched, maybe it was an OG, Baas replaced by Snyder or Rachal or vice versa, IDK who or when, somebody look it up. Anyway I do remember Singletary settled the o-line down, consistency from wk. to wk. & stability across the board was what the whole team needed & Singletary seems to have supplied that.

He had to get their attention 1st in a chaotic locker room, so he did his notorious depantsing to remind them of their poor play & W-L rcd, then he did the hard things that needed doing, like bitchslapping egomaniac Vernon Davis publicly when he dropped passes, then slowly bringing a disgruntled Alex Smith back into the fold from his injury after Nolan threw him under the bus to save his own job (didn't work, did it?) Singletary became the strong anchor this drifting, flaky team really needed last season.

Heitmann was indeed a 7th rounder, still a draft afterthought from Stanford who would have gone undrafted if not for Bill Walsh (still a consultant to the team in 02) being wired into the Stanford Athletic program on a 1st name basis, they recommended him for the versatility mentioned. That Stanford magic doesn't always work, the same hits & misses rule applies -- see Kwame Harris & his whiff pass blocking technique that gets QBs killed. I believe I'll stick with my original assessment, Cody Wallace is a "pure" center, has quicker feet & is younger with no injury history, they need to work him into that o-line this season at some point.

I agree with our madirishman friend here too, Wallace, Snyder, Baas, & Rachal were all nonsexy picks the pundits shrugged over in their draft analyses, too much furor & bullstuff over trading away next yr's #1 with the NE Pats to move up for Joe Staley, but look at how that o-line has turned around 100% from the Dennis Erickson & even the godawful Terry Donahue regimes. The biggest building block on a complete team rebuild is now about 80% functional & good to go.

But 5 OCs in 5 yrs under 3 HCs, uhhh, that has to be a major destabilizing factor & can't be good for any NFL offense..... I am now vindicated in my 2008 assessment that bringing Martzball in was a major error, they just didn't have the personnel even with Bruce in SF, & that local playerJT O'Sullivan from UC-Davis who was Martz' hand-picked QB from Detroit just isn't an NFL quality QB. Martz has now dicked up 3 teams in 3 NFL cities by my count, could be more, one of the most overrated coaches in recent NFL history. I still lol at Bellichick making him & the Rams look like Sheep by catching them unawares with the ancient Lonesome End gadget play that went for a TD vs. St. Louis just b/c NE noticed that Martz didn't have his head in the game... damn, a HS coach would be fired over getting tricked like that. Anybody else recall that?

Hell yes, getting Carolina's #1 in 2010 upgraded the 9ers draft to a B+, whether evaluated for value or perceived value, for once the present & future looks better than the recent past on this team.

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Old 05-26-2009, 10:01 AM    (permalink
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A lot of analysts are idiots cause they said we didn't address our WR "issue" last year, and gave us bad draft grades for drafting a lot of interior "non sexy" players like Balmer, Rachal, and Wallace. We also picked up Morgan in the 6th, who could be a star, or at least start.

So didn't they almost exceed expectations then, by not only drafting need, but also getting other player like Balmer and Rachal who has a huge upside? A lot of people thought Wallace was the best center in that draft, and they took him in the middle rounds.

I wouldn't say last year was an A+ draft (it's too early to tell) but if our top need (from the "analysts" perspective) was WR and we ended up with Morgan (who did have an impact his rookie season) then the Niners get credit for that. But with draft grades, it's all about if teams took their perceived need(s) early in the draft. It's a joke.
Yeah, ability to fill needs is a huge component of draft grades. If we drafted Michael Oher, Everette Brown, and Rashad Johnson in rounds 1-3 (assuming no trade) we'd have gotten a slam dunk A+. But i'd take Crabtree+2010 1st+ Coffee over that any day.
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Old 05-26-2009, 10:06 AM    (permalink
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I just read Scott's draft grade article and he raised a interesting point- nice set of prospects, but how many will start besides Crabtree?

I see McKillop starting 2 years down the road. Coffee is in a RB by committee so its basically a default starter. Pascoe, Taylor, Francois, Davis all seem to be good backups rather than starters. Im hoping one of these 4 can step up into a starter role sometime down the road. Seems like this draft was more for adding depth though.

How many of these guys (including UDFA's Boone, Sheets, etc) could everyone see eventually starting (not rookie year)?

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Old 05-26-2009, 10:22 AM    (permalink
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That's what I meant by value. Where are you drafting them in relation to what their grades are. However, we dont know how each team grades a player though it would be interesting if after a draft a team would show what their board looked like.
That would be pretty cool to analyze.
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Old 05-26-2009, 04:59 PM    (permalink
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I just read Scott's draft grade article and he raised a interesting point- nice set of prospects, but how many will start besides Crabtree?

I see McKillop starting 2 years down the road. Coffee is in a RB by committee so its basically a default starter. Pascoe, Taylor, Francois, Davis all seem to be good backups rather than starters. Im hoping one of these 4 can step up into a starter role sometime down the road. Seems like this draft was more for adding depth though.

How many of these guys (including UDFA's Boone, Sheets, etc) could everyone see eventually starting (not rookie year)?
Drafts aren't all about who can start this year either. The best teams often have one rookie starting at the most. If a team is in rebuilding mode, like Miami or Kansas City last year for example, then you can judge how many players they got in the Draft that will start, so they could start building a young nucleus. But for teams like the Niners, who have accumulated talent over the years, it's almost impossible to find guys passed round two that will start as a rookie. They may down the road, or step in due to injury, but often they are going to be role players, develop, and then take over.

I think Taylor and Davis have the least chance to become starters, but you never know. Coffee, McKillop and Pascoe could start in the coming years depending on what happens with the players in front of them. Boone and sheets have talent but I would say Sheets will be a utility player in the league at best, never carrying a full load.
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Old 05-26-2009, 06:51 PM    (permalink
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Drafts aren't all about who can start this year either. The best teams often have one rookie starting at the most. If a team is in rebuilding mode, like Miami or Kansas City last year for example, then you can judge how many players they got in the Draft that will start, so they could start building a young nucleus. But for teams like the Niners, who have accumulated talent over the years, it's almost impossible to find guys passed round two that will start as a rookie. They may down the road, or step in due to injury, but often they are going to be role players, develop, and then take over.

I think Taylor and Davis have the least chance to become starters, but you never know. Coffee, McKillop and Pascoe could start in the coming years depending on what happens with the players in front of them. Boone and sheets have talent but I would say Sheets will be a utility player in the league at best, never carrying a full load.
Sorry, i meant starters down the line. I don't expect anyone outside of Crabtree to start in 09.
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Old 05-26-2009, 09:14 PM    (permalink
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I just read Scott's draft grade article and he raised a interesting point- nice set of prospects, but how many will start besides Crabtree?

I see McKillop starting 2 years down the road. Coffee is in a RB by committee so its basically a default starter. Pascoe, Taylor, Francois, Davis all seem to be good backups rather than starters. Im hoping one of these 4 can step up into a starter role sometime down the road. Seems like this draft was more for adding depth though.

How many of these guys (including UDFA's Boone, Sheets, etc) could everyone see eventually starting (not rookie year)?
How many teams have more then 2 or 3 starters from a given draft anyway? Go back 3 or 4 years and even look at the good teams and you will only find that good drafts produce 2 or 3 guys who are good NFL starters. Does he expect them to draft 7 starters? Day 2 players are usually backups. Their are maybe what 10 day 2 guys that turn out to be good to pro-bowler caliber players in a given year. Maybe thats even a little high. I dont think he gave enough credit for getting Carolinas 1st either. Who could the Niners have picked at that spot that would have been huge impact players? I was sitting there trying to talk myself into Ev. Brown but I wasnt jumping on my couch and yelling at the TV for him. Everyone says next years draft is deeper anyway. Im not sold on Carolina as a contender either. Not in that division with that QB.
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Old 05-26-2009, 09:21 PM    (permalink
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Drafts aren't all about who can start this year either. The best teams often have one rookie starting at the most. If a team is in rebuilding mode, like Miami or Kansas City last year for example, then you can judge how many players they got in the Draft that will start, so they could start building a young nucleus. But for teams like the Niners, who have accumulated talent over the years, it's almost impossible to find guys passed round two that will start as a rookie. They may down the road, or step in due to injury, but often they are going to be role players, develop, and then take over.
They still think we're bad enough to warrant starting rookies.
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Old 05-26-2009, 09:22 PM    (permalink
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Getting a 1st round pick next year is great. We're all draft junkies here, and now we have 2 selections in the 1st round to play with? We could trade back and collect more picks ala NE, trade up for a top player, trade a pick for a top vet, or just keep the picks and add 2 (potential) studs. Love getting that 1st round pick and excited to see what happens with it.

Other news, Greg Ellis may be released. If he's released, who wants to sign him? 20.5 sacks the last 2 years. Not sure if he'd want to come here, especially as he would probably be a backup here rather than a starter.

http://www.nflgridirongab.com/2009/0...-rusher-ellis/

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Old 05-26-2009, 09:32 PM    (permalink
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Interesting story on Lawson. This is why im one of the few that was happy when the Niners didnt draft a pass-rusher high in the draft.

http://www.contracostatimes.com/49ers/ci_12440229
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Old 05-27-2009, 09:22 AM    (permalink
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They still think we're bad enough to warrant starting rookies.
Well, that's why they are idiots. If through all their "research" on the Niners, these analysts think that they still are in complete rebuilding mode, then it proves my point that they are idiots.
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Old 05-27-2009, 09:29 AM    (permalink
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Interesting story on Lawson. This is why im one of the few that was happy when the Niners didnt draft a pass-rusher high in the draft.

http://www.contracostatimes.com/49ers/ci_12440229
Interesting story, I just hope he can actually produce this year.
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Old 05-27-2009, 02:22 PM    (permalink
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With Walt's age, this injury will pretty much put him on the shelf for good. This injury is often an issue the following year for players, let's hope he can heal with youth. With his absence, and Bly's 1 year contract, CB will almost certainly be a top need next year. Tarell Brown has got to play well, M hud will see more of the field, Shawntae needs to recover well, and what happens with R. Smith? Split reps at CB and S, he's been at SS. Anybody hear about R.Smith's minicamp?
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