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Old 08-11-2013, 12:01 PM    (permalink
dan77733
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Originally Posted by VAfy-ya
Its Dan....pumping the brakes on over-reaction isn't a option :)

Jenkins will be fine. Its a process and with some WRs, the process takes longer because they don't shine until they understand the concepts of scheme and get comfortable with playbook and knowing their assignments. Jenkins is one of those guys. He got off to a slow start in college. He's a slow starter. It was reported last year that he was having problems with the playbook and that's the main reason why he saw limited snaps as rookie. The NFL game isn't just about physical ability. These offenses are complicated and there are a lot of on-the-fly adjustments, post snaps for WRs to incoperate. Its one of the reason they liked Collie. He's a heady player along with possessing some physical ability. AJ is still thinking the game a little too much. Once he gets comfortable with his assignments, he will shine. Its not uncommon. VD struggle with learning the playbook and concepts his first couple of years too.
If anything, im under-reacting. I never said physical. I said focus and concentration which Jenkins doesnt seem to have. The main reason why he didnt play a lot last season was because there were a bunch of receivers better than him in front of him. This year, aside from Boldin, its mid round draft picks, injured players and undrafted free agents who are outshining Jenkins. Sorry, you can use any excuse you want but the bottom line is that he needs to step up and earn the starting spot opposite Boldin.

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Originally Posted by VAfy-ya
I said when he was drafted that Jenkins should be ready to contribute significantly, heading into his 3rd year. He's right on schedule, IMO. Crabtree's injury has no significance on his time-table for success. You can't say, well he needs to step up now because Crabtree went down and MM is hurt. Doesn't work like that. They knew AJ was a project when they drafted him. That's why you make other moves, like trading for Boldin or signing a Austin Collie...to offset injuries. That's like saying if Gore gets hurt, Lattimore should be ready to step up and play NOW, knowing full well they drafted him with the intent on sitting him for a year and letting his injuries fully heal. You have to continue bringing AJ along at the pace you set forth from the beginning. If you deviate from the plan, the time-table you already laid out, then you sacrifice throwing a guy out too soon, and having him hurt his confidence and the team's chances to win a game. First round pick or not, you can't force it on him before he's ready.
I know that when Jenkins was drafted, he was drafted for the future, not the present. We traded for Boldin because with Williams and Manningham coming off injuries and the rest being average at best, we needed another receiver to start opposite Crabtree. We acquired Boldin months before Crabtree got injured.

Crabtree's injury does change things because now, expectations are higher and Jenkins is failing to meet those expectations thus far. Plans change and when they do, players that have to step up must do so. Seriously, Jenkins is being outshined by an undrafted free agent. Sorry but if im the only one that sees that as a problem and a disappointment, there's a problem on this board.

HUGE difference between Jenkins and Lattimore. Lattimore was drafted injured, Jenkins was not. Lattimore was a 4th round compensation draft pick. Jenkins was a first rounder. Lattimore isnt expected to practice until next off-season. Jenkins has been through two full off-seasons and hasnt shown a damn thing. Also, due to injuries at WR with Crabtree, Williams and Manningham, RB is a deeper position for us. Gore, James, Hunter coming back, Hampton and Dixon if necessary. After Boldin, WR is a cluster****.

You need to stop sugar coating and protecting Jenkins. I'm not asking him to put up Crabtree like numbers. Just show something to where im not writing a book about him in a negative way. That's not asking a lot at all.

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Originally Posted by VAfy-ya
I just re-watched the first half of the Broncos game and I will say this...Lemonier and Aldon will be the most feared passing rushing duo in the league, in two years. Lemonier has the two most important traits you look for in a pass-rusher. A quick-twitch burst, off the line and he plays violently, with his hands and how he attacks O-Lineman. Even against the Broncos 2nd string O-Line, you can just see it. Give him a year or two to improve his technique and Tomsula to work his magic and he's going make Brooks expendable. And I like Brooks a lot but Lemonier just jumped off the screen. And that's hard to do, as a rookie pass-rusher who didn't have amazing stats. But the effort and skills are there. He's going to be a good one.
Agree and I wouldnt be surprised if Brooks gets released in February to save cap room that would go towards Kaepernick and Aldon.
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Old 08-11-2013, 12:48 PM    (permalink
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Brooks is awesome. I'll be ******* pissed if they release him, unless he is completely terrible this year. He's not going anywhere.
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Old 08-11-2013, 01:06 PM    (permalink
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Brooks is awesome. I'll be ******* pissed if they release him, unless he is completely terrible this year. He's not going anywhere.
Agreed but his salary increases next season to where if released, we would save $3.00m in cap room. I like Brooks but re-signing Aldon is far more important and if Brooks has to be sacrificed for that to happen, so be it.
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Old 08-11-2013, 01:27 PM    (permalink
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Technically, I didnt say that Moore out shined him, you did. You said that Moore has been more impressive despite having less snaps. That says it all right there.
Sorry, Dan. I never said any such thing.

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From what I understand, he was dealing with hamstring issues since late in OTAs. Once he returned, healthy, he was impressive enough to surpass everyone sans, Marlon Moore. Yet he saw more snaps with the ones than Moore did.
I said he surpassed everyone sans Moore. Meaning on the depth chart. Moore started. However, Jenkins got more snaps with the ones than Moore did.

I never said outshined, you used the exact words. I never asserted that Moore outplayed Jenkins, at all.
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Old 08-11-2013, 02:18 PM    (permalink
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Agreed but his salary increases next season to where if released, we would save $3.00m in cap room. I like Brooks but re-signing Aldon is far more important and if Brooks has to be sacrificed for that to happen, so be it.
Uhhh, they can find $3M somewhere else. Releasing very good pass rushers to save $3M is just stupid.
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Old 08-11-2013, 02:31 PM    (permalink
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Once again Dan, you totally missed the point. Point blank, AJ is not ready to be a significant factor at WR. And just because you want him to doesn't mean its going to happen or that he isn't earning his keep. Simply put, he's a role player at the moment, hoping to expand that role as the season progresses. One of the first things Baalke said after they drafted Jenkins was that he's sumpremely talented but he's not ready yet. He wasn't ready last year. He's improved and will probably show flashes but won't be ready this year either. ITS A PROCESS! And just because you don't have the patience to understand the process is not my problem. I'm not sugar-coating anything, I'm telling you excatly what's going on. Believe what you want.

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Old 08-11-2013, 02:48 PM    (permalink
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Uhhh, they can find $3M somewhere else. Releasing very good pass rushers to save $3M is just stupid.
Meh, Brooks is a ok pass-rusher and the numbers back that up. Its his all around game where he really shines. One thing about Brooks is I think he could slide inside if we needed him to. But he's a little too finesse as a pass-rusher for my tatse though. Basically a looping, speed-rusher. Lemonier is more well-rounded in that regard. Once Cowboy leaves, Aldon's going to need another guy on the other side to keep teams from sliding protection to his side. I think Lemonier could be that guy. He has all the tools. Brooks' contract escalators increase heading into the 2015 season. Lemonier should be ready by then to push him for a starting position. He could make Brooks expendable. As for now, Brooks is clearly the superior player. But don't sleep on Lemonier. He may make it hard for Fangio not to play him in some capacity as the season progresses.
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Old 08-11-2013, 03:43 PM    (permalink
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I'm a little jealous of the Bills' young upside at WR...

TJ Graham
Robert Woods
Marquis Goodwin
Da'Rick Rogers
Marcus Easley
Demarco Sampson

2 of those guys will probably be cut.
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Old 08-11-2013, 03:49 PM    (permalink
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I would love to keep Brooks, Smith, Willis, and Bowman together as long as possible. It's like we have the new age dome patrol out there.
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Oh, my bad. Didn't realize SWDC was the pinnacle of class and grace.
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Old 08-11-2013, 04:24 PM    (permalink
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I'm a little jealous of the Bills' young upside at WR...

TJ Graham
Robert Woods
Marquis Goodwin
Da'Rick Rogers
Marcus Easley
Demarco Sampson

2 of those guys will probably be cut.
Sampson and Easley probably, and neither is a upgrade over what we have currently. I just don't see what you see....
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Old 08-11-2013, 06:11 PM    (permalink
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Sorry, Dan. I never said any such thing.

I said he surpassed everyone sans Moore. Meaning on the depth chart. Moore started. However, Jenkins got more snaps with the ones than Moore did.

I never said outshined, you used the exact words. I never asserted that Moore outplayed Jenkins, at all.
Fine...you didnt say out shined, you said surpassed everyone EXCEPT Moore. Same damn thing. Bottom line is that Jenkins has been out shined and surpassed by Moore. No difference.
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Old 08-11-2013, 06:13 PM    (permalink
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Uhhh, they can find $3M somewhere else. Releasing very good pass rushers to save $3M is just stupid.
I agree but if Lemonier can become the situational pass rusher that Aldon was in 2011, I wouldnt be surprised to see Baalke release Brooks and start Lemonier in 2014. Thats all im saying. Nothing more and nothing less.
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Old 08-11-2013, 06:16 PM    (permalink
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Once again Dan, you totally missed the point. Point blank, AJ is not ready to be a significant factor at WR. And just because you want him to doesn't mean its going to happen or that he isn't earning his keep. Simply put, he's a role player at the moment, hoping to expand that role as the season progresses. One of the first things Baalke said after they drafted Jenkins was that he's sumpremely talented but he's not ready yet. He wasn't ready last year. He's improved and will probably show flashes but won't be ready this year either. ITS A PROCESS! And just because you don't have the patience to understand the process is not my problem. I'm not sugar-coating anything, I'm telling you excatly what's going on. Believe what you want.
Process my ass!!! If a 7th rounder like Marques Colston can make an impact as a rookie, why cant a 1st rounder like Jenkins do the same thing? Hell, im not even asking for an impact. I'm just asking for him to step up and show that he's actually worth a roster spot. Is that really asking too much?

As for Baalke saying that Jenkins not being ready, that was a year and a half ago and im sorry, I dont see any difference between then and now so how the hell has he improved? He hasnt to me. The guy is being outplayed by an undrafted free agent for God's sake. Come on.
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Old 08-11-2013, 06:18 PM    (permalink
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Meh, Brooks is a ok pass-rusher and the numbers back that up. Its his all around game where he really shines. One thing about Brooks is I think he could slide inside if we needed him to. But he's a little too finesse as a pass-rusher for my tatse though. Basically a looping, speed-rusher. Lemonier is more well-rounded in that regard. Once Cowboy leaves, Aldon's going to need another guy on the other side to keep teams from sliding protection to his side. I think Lemonier could be that guy. He has all the tools. Brooks' contract escalators increase heading into the 2015 season. Lemonier should be ready by then to push him for a starting position. He could make Brooks expendable. As for now, Brooks is clearly the superior player. But don't sleep on Lemonier. He may make it hard for Fangio not to play him in some capacity as the season progresses.
Agree 100%. Lemonier will be used this season like Aldon was in 2011. If Lemonier can show that he can be a starter, I wouldnt be surprised to see Brooks not on the roster come opening day 2014.
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Old 08-11-2013, 06:35 PM    (permalink
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Fine...you didnt say out shined, you said surpassed everyone EXCEPT Moore. Same damn thing. Bottom line is that Jenkins has been out shined and surpassed by Moore. No difference.
Dan. I'm not trying to attack you. You've got me on your case because your reading comprehension is wrong right now.

He surpassed everyone except Moore on the depth chart. He has. Fact.

He hadn't yet surpassed Moore on the depth chart but he was getting more reps.

Nowhere, except in your imagination does anything I ever said allude to Moore outshining Jenkins, or outperforming Jenkins, currently.

Moore was top of the depth chart because he has been healthy throughout TC.


Regardless...

I apologize for arguing about it. We both agree Jenkins needs to step up. If he does, everything will come out in the wash.
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Old 08-11-2013, 07:02 PM    (permalink
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Dan. I'm not trying to attack you. You've got me on your case because your reading comprehension is wrong right now.

He surpassed everyone except Moore on the depth chart. He has. Fact.

He hadn't yet surpassed Moore on the depth chart but he was getting more reps.

Nowhere, except in your imagination does anything I ever said allude to Moore outshining Jenkins, or outperforming Jenkins, currently.

Moore was top of the depth chart because he has been healthy throughout TC.
I didnt say you were attacking me.

You say right here that Jenkins has surpassed everyone except Moore. I'M saying that Jenkins has been out shined by an undrafted free agent despite having less snaps. Healthy or not, Jenkins shouldnt be behind an undrafted free agent. Seriously, come on. Doesnt matter how you look at it but thats not good if you're a Jenkins fan or like me, just want him to step his game up.
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Old 08-11-2013, 07:04 PM    (permalink
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No apology needed. I just want Jenkins to step up because right now, he's looking more Rashaun Woods than Crabtree and thats not good.
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Old 08-11-2013, 08:05 PM    (permalink
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No apology needed. I just want Jenkins to step up because right now, he's looking more Rashaun Woods than Crabtree and thats not good.
Except you were one of MANY whom wanted Crabtree off the team a few years ago, too.

It's common amongst Niners' fans it seems.

VD couldn't be cut fast enough.
Crabtree was a diva who was at best a #3.

I'm not saying that Jenkins is like them. I'm just saying that there is very little patience.
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Old 08-11-2013, 08:31 PM    (permalink
VAfy-ya
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Dan having little patience? Never would have thought...not in my wildest dreams...unfathomable....simply can't be true...
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Old 08-11-2013, 09:46 PM    (permalink
dan77733
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Except you were one of MANY whom wanted Crabtree off the team a few years ago, too.

It's common amongst Niners' fans it seems.

VD couldn't be cut fast enough.
Crabtree was a diva who was at best a #3.

I'm not saying that Jenkins is like them. I'm just saying that there is very little patience.
I dont remember saying that I wanted Crabtree gone. In fact, him holding out allowed the team to sign him to a very team friendly six year deal. And if I did say that, then find the post(s) and re-post them.

No way in hell did I ever say I wanted Davis gone. Thats for sure. And in fairness, Crabtree WAS a diva for his first three seasons and if it wasnt for the QB switch to Kaepernick, he would probably be the same.

I'll admit that me having patience is pretty much non-existent. I get impatient very quickly. I believe that being patient leads to wasting time in life regardless of what its related to.

In regards to Jenkins, im not patient with him because he's getting an opportunity to win the starting spot opposite Boldin and he's not taking advantage of it. Its also because of his draft status. Im sorry but when it comes to first rounders, I have little to no patience. I want to see production and results, not excuses.
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Old 08-11-2013, 09:47 PM    (permalink
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Dan having little patience? Never would have thought...not in my wildest dreams...unfathomable....simply can't be true...
I know you're being sarcastic but its true. I'm a very impatient person. Pretty much between little to non-existent.
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Old 08-12-2013, 03:41 PM    (permalink
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AJ Jenkins apparently getting less reps. At least at the practice on Sunday. Only saw one pass come his way and that was towards the end on 7 on 7's. From Colt McCoy.
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Oh, my bad. Didn't realize SWDC was the pinnacle of class and grace.
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Old 08-12-2013, 04:00 PM    (permalink
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Here's a question -

How's Quinton Patton doing?
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Old 08-12-2013, 07:44 PM    (permalink
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Here's a question -

How's Quinton Patton doing?
He has been hurt. Hand injury. Wears a blue "Non-Contact" jersey. I don't know if he's caught any passes all TC.
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Old 08-12-2013, 07:48 PM    (permalink
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He has been hurt. Hand injury. Wears a blue "Non-Contact" jersey. I don't know if he's caught any passes all TC.
That's a shame. Both he and AJ have been one of my favorite WRs coming out the last two years. Hopefully he can get healthy and AJ can get his head out of his ass!!
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