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Old 04-21-2009, 01:55 PM    (permalink
E-Man
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Originally Posted by senormysterioso View Post
Exactly, there needs to be like an independent ESPN analyst oversight watchdog committee or something, so when they say stuff like that they can go find archive footage of them saying something directly contradictory right after.

The only thing that drives me more nuts is when an analyst gets about 95 things wrong but one of his asinine predictions happens to come true following the "even a broken clock is right twice a day" law, but he proceeds to brag about it and talk it up for months after.
See I have no problem with someone being wrong. It's eventual that predictions get wrong, but an expert should know that their word isn't gospel. When you act like a prediction you make is absolute then you can't be taken serious as an expert. If you believed that Reggie Bush was going to be an all time great back that's fine. When you act like it's already happened, and that anybody who disagrees with you is a nut you lose all credibility. As much as they blew up Houston as the dumbest franchise ever, they need to blow themselves up as the dumbest analysts ever for acting like they did. Anyone with logic should have known that every draft produces a great back, but 6'7 290 pound DEs that run a 4.66 don't come around very often.

As for the Vince Young talk I actually think he's going to end up starting at some point this year. Kerry Collins is old, and I see him getting banged up this year. That'll give Vince a chance to start, and what he does with it probably will determine his future. I know the Titans are pretty much done with him now, but if he shows some decent production they may keep him. Of course is Kerry never gets hurt like I think then Vince will ride the bench all year unless Collins messes up really really bad.
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Old 04-21-2009, 05:12 PM    (permalink
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I always said VY would bust. Sure, he had some initial success, but teams caught on and he simply wasn't ready.
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Old 04-21-2009, 06:34 PM    (permalink
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I dont see why everyone gave up on young. every ******* year when these developmental type come out people say that they need to sit behind a vet for a few years, and thats exactly what the **** young is doing. He had never been a backup but he never went in the media and bitched about it. Everyone thinks cutler is the second coming yet he has a negative record as a starter and vince is 18 and 11. He has leadership and talent. Dont think Kerry isn't teaching him how to play as well. Its not like collins was the best qb in the nfl either like everyone seems to think he was. Collins is the one that is more of a bust of the two, he never threw for 2500 yards for carolina, and the titans were 27th in passing last year
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Old 04-21-2009, 06:42 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by BBD
But he's done with the Titans. Thats all there is to know, or care about.
That's just not true at all. He has too much favor with Titans owner Bud Adams for it to be absolute. I believe Fisher is sincere when he says that Young will be given an apportunity to gain his job back. Whether or not that will ever happen remains to be seen.
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Old 04-21-2009, 09:03 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bigbluedefense View Post
He'll get a 2nd chance elsewhere.

But he's done with the Titans. Thats all there is to know, or care about.


Theres a slight chance he gets another chance 2 years from now, but the cap hit it would take to keep him on the roster, I just don't see it happening. A poster before made a great point about him. Once he tried to turn himself into a pocket passer, thats when his career went down hill. He needs to just let his natural ability dictate games instead of forcing himself into a role that he'll never succeed in.
I'm not so sure he flat out tried to be more of a pocket QB himself. It was a combination of Chow's offense and his early quad injury that probably factored more than any personal decision. He still led the NFL in QB rushing yards IIRC. But there's no question the playcalling wasn't as VY focused as it was in 06. Chow clearly viewed scrambling as a bit of a gimmick and basically said as much after his firing. But you can't really blame Chow entirely - Vince had to start QB'ing a more NFL proven style of offense sooner or later. That means more reads, and until a QB improves his ability to read a D, that means more time hanging onto the ball and more time before a scrambling QB like VY would decide to run it, so he simply didn't have the same lanes. Also, LenDale White was the starting RB in 07 - PA, PA rollouts etc just isn't as effective when the RB averages 3.x YPC.

He may be done in Tennessee but that's probably more because the team has outgrown him than anything. In hindsight a QB in 2006 was probably not going to ever work too well, let alone the one even his most vocal supporters clearly outlined would take a good 3-4 seasons to mature as an NFL QB. The Titans are clearly a team best suited for a veteran game manager. Vince should have sat at least 1 year also.

Regardless though he's had one good rookie season (19TDs for any rookie QB, passing and running, is never bad), a poor 07 season (with a non-NFL quality OC, Bobby Wade, Roydell Williams and LenDale White helping....nuff said) and a wash of an 08 season. He's still an open book and he hasn't been on an offense yet with a more NFL proven OC, or where he wasn't the #1 focus of the D - 08 would have changed that. The incident in week 1 means he's to blame for that, but that incident in itself doesn't mean he can't develop into a better QB.
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Old 04-21-2009, 11:30 PM    (permalink
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USC shouldn't have been in that game in the first place.
Oh please, the ball came out. The play was reviewed. They made the right call:

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Old 04-22-2009, 05:17 PM    (permalink
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It should have been a penalty on Bush the next play. A non-lineman can't push a ball carrier forward. I'm pretty sure thats what he was referring to.
thought you could push not pull
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Old 04-22-2009, 05:33 PM    (permalink
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how'd you quote something that hadn't happened? omg

and I think you CAN push a ball carrier
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Old 04-22-2009, 05:49 PM    (permalink
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I thought some of you would appreciate this: when I was stretching after my run at the Rec today, I saw the closed captioning on ESPN and they were talking about who will turn out better, at this point, Leinart or Young and one of the guys goes, "Vince Young will be good, I think he's a play or two away from greatness" I think that was Marcellus Wiley or one of the others. I dont know, but I saw that and started laughing.
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Old 04-22-2009, 05:50 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by OzTitan
I'm not so sure he flat out tried to be more of a pocket QB himself. It was a combination of Chow's offense and his early quad injury that probably factored more than any personal decision. He still led the NFL in QB rushing yards IIRC. But there's no question the playcalling wasn't as VY focused as it was in 06. Chow clearly viewed scrambling as a bit of a gimmick and basically said as much after his firing. But you can't really blame Chow entirely - Vince had to start QB'ing a more NFL proven style of offense sooner or later. That means more reads, and until a QB improves his ability to read a D, that means more time hanging onto the ball and more time before a scrambling QB like VY would decide to run it, so he simply didn't have the same lanes. Also, LenDale White was the starting RB in 07 - PA, PA rollouts etc just isn't as effective when the RB averages 3.x YPC.

He may be done in Tennessee but that's probably more because the team has outgrown him than anything. In hindsight a QB in 2006 was probably not going to ever work too well, let alone the one even his most vocal supporters clearly outlined would take a good 3-4 seasons to mature as an NFL QB. The Titans are clearly a team best suited for a veteran game manager. Vince should have sat at least 1 year also.

Regardless though he's had one good rookie season (19TDs for any rookie QB, passing and running, is never bad), a poor 07 season (with a non-NFL quality OC, Bobby Wade, Roydell Williams and LenDale White helping....nuff said) and a wash of an 08 season. He's still an open book and he hasn't been on an offense yet with a more NFL proven OC, or where he wasn't the #1 focus of the D - 08 would have changed that. The incident in week 1 means he's to blame for that, but that incident in itself doesn't mean he can't develop into a better QB.
QFT. Great post, Oz.

I'm very happy Chow is gone. He may be an excellent QB coach, but I did not like him as a OC. The whole "WR by comittee" thing crapped out, and I hated his playcalling. Ugh...I'm so glad 'Dinger came back.

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised to see VY play this season, and not when the game isn't on the line like agaist Detroit on ThanksGiving or Week 17 against the Colts.
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Old 04-22-2009, 06:05 PM    (permalink
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Oh please, the ball came out. The play was reviewed. They made the right call:

It should have been a penalty on Bush the next play. A non-lineman can't push a ball carrier forward. I'm pretty sure thats what he was referring to.
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Old 04-22-2009, 09:30 PM    (permalink
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Another Vince Young thread! Hadn't had one of these in a while! Where's Shiver?

Aside from dropping the 3rd person, I don't see anything wrong with his comments. He says he's gonna keep his mouth shut and work hard, which means he's lost his mind, heart, and testicular fortitude?


Lurking..... I am just waiting for the opportune moment.
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Old 04-22-2009, 09:48 PM    (permalink
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how'd you quote something that hadn't happened? omg

and I think you CAN push a ball carrier
No, a non lineman can't push a ball carrier forward. I know that for a fact. Remember the Ice Bowl? When Starr snuck into the endzone?
The running back (#30) said he put his hands up to show the refs he wasn't helping Starr into the endzone by pushing him. That rule hasn't changed since then. There should have been a penalty on Bush.

The Pac-10 commissioner said a penalty could have been called, but that it is so rarely enforced that the non-call was also correct. I tend to agree with that. Technically it is a penalty, but when it doubt let them play.
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