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Old 10-25-2009, 11:29 PM    (permalink
SickwithIt1010
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Originally Posted by Shiver View Post
I'm going to have to say yes right now. Gonzalez, Witten, K2, Cooley all have more recognition, but no TE is playing better than Vernon Davis right now. This is the Vernon Davis' I expected when he came out of Maryland and right now the only TE I would take over him is Gates.
i hear you right there, i knew that Vernon was going to be a playmaker....just didnt expect it to take this long.
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Old 10-25-2009, 11:30 PM    (permalink
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Martz not only didn't use him, but no one in the Nolan regime lit a fire under him. Ever since the "you can't win with 'em" speech Davis has been remarkable. He is even a Team Captain!
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Old 10-25-2009, 11:34 PM    (permalink
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Nolan didn't do anything right LOL. Glad he's doing well as a DC in Denver, but that guy should never be in charge of a team or in the front office. What a disaster.
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Old 10-26-2009, 12:05 AM    (permalink
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I'll gladly eat the crow, but what the **** did you expect us to say? He DID have stone hands the past 3 years. He DID drop passes constantly and they COULDN'T target him as much because he was a drop machine. It's awesome that he's improved his hands. He's now a weapon that we CAN use. He's EARNED it.
Well you could have been smart and realized that he had (and pretty much still doesn't) have any consistently good quarterback throwing him the ball. Terrell Owens also drops balls. But that doesn't mean you stop throwing him the rock, because he still makes plays. The only people that were correctly utilizing Davis were Norv Turner and Jimmy Raye.
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Old 10-26-2009, 12:12 AM    (permalink
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Davis leads the league in TD receptions
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Old 10-26-2009, 12:16 AM    (permalink
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Well you could have been smart and realized that he had (and pretty much still doesn't) have any consistently good quarterback throwing him the ball. Terrell Owens also drops balls. But that doesn't mean you stop throwing him the rock, because he still makes plays. The only people that were correctly utilizing Davis were Norv Turner and Jimmy Raye.
Uh, the crappy QB throwing him the ball theory is bogus. He had crappy QB play in the past. He dropped the ball. He has crappy QB play this year. He's not dropping the ball. There is no corrolation there. And I already pointed out that Martz gave up on him and I said that was lame. I'm not seeing what your point is.
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Old 10-26-2009, 08:08 AM    (permalink
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I think everything with VD was about getting consistency and rhythm. He just had to adjust. In college he was used to being the man and being targeted every single play, in the league when TE's only get select chances he was having a problem keeping the same intensity even when he doesn't get the ball that when he did he wasn't ready or concentrating. I'm so glad he's finally putting it together on the receiving end but one thing you can never knock on him is his blocking. I have no problem saying he should be in the pro bowl over Cooley. It's a shame though he won't make the pro bowl, because even despite having no running game with Gore out, no WR's, and no QB and still has more receptions, yards, and 2 more TD's than them combined, than both Tony Gonzalez and Jason Witten, the problem is that no way he gets voted in by the fans nor the media over those two.
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Old 10-26-2009, 08:50 AM    (permalink
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Vernon is the greatest!
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Old 10-26-2009, 10:09 AM    (permalink
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I think everything with VD was about getting consistency and rhythm. He just had to adjust. In college he was used to being the man and being targeted every single play, in the league when TE's only get select chances he was having a problem keeping the same intensity even when he doesn't get the ball that when he did he wasn't ready or concentrating. I'm so glad he's finally putting it together on the receiving end but one thing you can never knock on him is his blocking. I have no problem saying he should be in the pro bowl over Cooley. It's a shame though he won't make the pro bowl, because even despite having no running game with Gore out, no WR's, and no QB and still has more receptions, yards, and 2 more TD's than them combined, than both Tony Gonzalez and Jason Witten, the problem is that no way he gets voted in by the fans nor the media over those two.
I think most pro bowl voters are familiar with Vernon Davis because of where he was drafted in the 1st, and if continues to put up these crazy numbers and no other TEs come close, I think it would be hard to ignore him.

900+ yds and 10+Tds for a TE are hard to pass over for any voter.
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Old 10-26-2009, 10:29 AM    (permalink
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I think most pro bowl voters are familiar with Vernon Davis because of where he was drafted in the 1st, and if continues to put up these crazy numbers and no other TEs come close, I think it would be hard to ignore him.

900+ yds and 10+Tds for a TE are hard to pass over for any voter.
Try impossible, this is not so common, especially the TDs.
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Old 10-26-2009, 11:42 AM    (permalink
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Uh, the crappy QB throwing him the ball theory is bogus. He had crappy QB play in the past. He dropped the ball. He has crappy QB play this year. He's not dropping the ball. There is no corrolation there. And I already pointed out that Martz gave up on him and I said that was lame. I'm not seeing what your point is.
That's like saying if you have a bad quarterback that you are still going to get big numbers. Notice how when Alex Smith came in yesterday Vernon Davis suddenly exploded? That's because he had better play. He still doesn't have the greatest hands, but he's been thrown to way more often, so the drops don't seem very apparent. He's practically already gained his yardage from last season. The same thing is happening with Buffalo in terms of what I'm talking about. Owens is looking terrible due to bad quarterback play.
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Old 10-26-2009, 11:52 AM    (permalink
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Soooooo, um, Alex Smith is all of a sudden a good QB? He has a stronger arm than Shaun Hill. Maybe that's what you're getting at. But let's be real. If yesterday's game happened in previous years, VD would have dropped AT LEAST one of those TD passes.

Honestly, I don't even know what we're arguing anymore. He had stone hands in the past. There isn't really a debate on that, is there?
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Old 10-26-2009, 12:00 PM    (permalink
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Alex Smith isn't "all of a sudden" a good QB. He's been one for awhile, he just got thrown under the bus because Nolan sucks, then swept under the rug when ****-ass Shaun Hill managed to not completely suck. Smith bided his time, stayed in shape, and worked hard while he waited for another chance.

With a good QB and another receiving option, the 49ers might be better than just the best team in the NFC West...
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Old 10-26-2009, 12:37 PM    (permalink
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His physical potential is unmatched....but he needs to get some better work ethic and a better attitude to make something of himself in the league. There are plenty of athletes out there that will actually work hard.
The work ethic is coming along now that singletary is coach
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Old 10-26-2009, 12:40 PM    (permalink
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Alex Smith isn't "all of a sudden" a good QB. He's been one for awhile, he just got thrown under the bus because Nolan sucks, then swept under the rug when ****-ass Shaun Hill managed to not completely suck. Smith bided his time, stayed in shape, and worked hard while he waited for another chance.

With a good QB and another receiving option, the 49ers might be better than just the best team in the NFC West...
I atleast know that Smith is book smart. I think there were some queestions about his football smarts though. He has always had the physical tools though (strong arm, pretty fast, good size). Its to early to tell if he will redeem himself. Many players in his situation do well for a short time because they have no where to go but up.
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Old 10-26-2009, 12:55 PM    (permalink
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With a good QB and another receiving option, the 49ers might be better than just the best team in the NFC West...
Vernon Davis is tearing it up, Crabtree had a solid debut, and I've always been high on Josh Morgan, who played well yesterday. Add in Frank Gore and we have teh weaponzz!

Now we just need a QB to get their act together.
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Old 10-26-2009, 01:44 PM    (permalink
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I just think it's funny that Alex Smith gets in there and, for the first time in his career, has people to throw to...and it's some big surprise that he produced? Unfortunately, I foresee someone inflating Tebow's stock because of Smith's probable success.
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Old 10-26-2009, 02:17 PM    (permalink
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This thread is great for the lulz.
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Old 10-26-2009, 02:23 PM    (permalink
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and i disagree with the tweener label. it's not like these guys are OTs lining up and running routes: no one would ever mistake vernon davis (6'3" 250) for joe staley (6'5" 315). they're heavy wide receivers. which doesn't make them tweeners at all. whereas a guy like eric green was far more similar to his offensive tackles (6'5" 280ish, vs. 6'5" 290ish) and was more of a "tweener": a guy who blocked like an OT and could occasionally leak out and make a play (example chosen out of thin air, may not be the most apt).
I agree with you here, although the tweener label can still be used, but with the WR/TE position, not the OT/TE position like you're arguing against.

TEs have essentially become strong WRs with blocking skills, not so much quick OTs that have receiving skill.
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Old 10-26-2009, 02:45 PM    (permalink
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Alex Smith is the truth. VD 15+ tds.

But really TEs are blowing up this year. 15 TEs on pace for over 50 catches. Only 4 did it in 2003.

good article to read over: http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/wire?...nfl&id=4540834
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Old 10-27-2009, 11:29 AM    (permalink
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Soooooo, um, Alex Smith is all of a sudden a good QB? He has a stronger arm than Shaun Hill. Maybe that's what you're getting at. But let's be real. If yesterday's game happened in previous years, VD would have dropped AT LEAST one of those TD passes.

Honestly, I don't even know what we're arguing anymore. He had stone hands in the past. There isn't really a debate on that, is there?
He played like a good quarterback in the last game, and that is when Davis all of a sudden exploded and was making catches. With better quarterback play, targets will put up better production. It's as simple as that. I already said he didn't have the greatest hands, but that doesn't mean he was never a bad player. He caught more than his fair share of balls.
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Oh, my bad. Didn't realize SWDC was the pinnacle of class and grace.
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Old 10-27-2009, 11:41 AM    (permalink
d34ng3l021
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I am still not sold on Alex Smith and Vernon Davis. Were the Texans playing legit defense or just soft zone to conserve a victory when they were up 21-0?
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Old 10-27-2009, 12:45 PM    (permalink
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Smith dropped the ball into Davis' hands through double coverage on at least two of those TDs from what I saw.
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Old 10-27-2009, 01:11 PM    (permalink
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I am still not sold on Alex Smith and Vernon Davis. Were the Texans playing legit defense or just soft zone to conserve a victory when they were up 21-0?
They were still playing the same defense they were all game.
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Old 10-27-2009, 05:33 PM    (permalink
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I am still not sold on Alex Smith and Vernon Davis. Were the Texans playing legit defense or just soft zone to conserve a victory when they were up 21-0?
I'd have a hard time believing that Kubiak would have his team play a lot softer...especially with a change at quarterback. He's been around this league long enough to know that you have to play intense the entire game.
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Oh, my bad. Didn't realize SWDC was the pinnacle of class and grace.
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