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View Poll Results: Who's the best WR?
DeSean Jackson, Eagles 67 72.04%
Miles Austin, Cowboys 15 16.13%
Steve Smith, Giants 6 6.45%
Santana Moss, Redskins 1 1.08%
Mario Manningham, Giants 3 3.23%
Other 1 1.08%
Voters: 93. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 01-05-2010, 07:22 PM    (permalink
Supporting Caste
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Originally Posted by Go_Eagles77 View Post
DeSean has been more consistent game by game.
Haha, no. Listing games Austin didn't hardly play in isn't exactly fair.
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:25 PM    (permalink
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ok, so he couldn't beat out big roy and crayton and was the #3 reciever, so that means I'm just wrong. Nice. And because there was pressure (which also means blitzes causing open WR's AND WR's not getting open) means that just doesn't count. Sooo Austin is immune to everything, even though he was shut down by GB, the first Washington game, and couldn't beat out big roy and crayton til later on. Can you say Jerry Rice incarnate?
and for the last time. I HAVE NOT MENTIONED JACKSON, NOR AM I GETTING INVOLVED IN SAID DJAX/AUSTIN DEBATE.
i used caps, maybe you'll comprehend it this time...but probably not.
Austin only started because Roy Williams got hurt. It is not a reflection of Austin at all, more of a reflection of the incompetence of our coaches.

Austin had a couple of down games, but even the most elite receivers will not be dominant every game. Point is Austin was able to burn good pass defenses and Jackson wasn't.
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:25 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Supporting Caste View Post
Haha, no. Listing games Austin didn't hardly play in isn't exactly fair.
As I believe scottyboy posted, why isnt it fair? Because he couldnt get a start over Roy or Crayton?
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Jesse realizing Walt was Santa Claus could really shake things up.
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I don't know how old you are, but if you can get to 24/25 without getting arrested or killed, you've done well for yourself lol.
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:26 PM    (permalink
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This is a joke and is really making me question how much of Jackson you have seen. He's one of the best route runners in the NFL and runs every route as good if not better than Miles Austin. The guy routinely catches crossing routes and takes them up field for huge chunks of yardage. He is very good at finding holes in zones all over the field and believe it or not gets most of his catches that way, not from post routes. The whole "all DeSean does is run go routes" is starting to approach the old "Brian Westbrook can't run inside" bull**** in terms of stupid myths about eagles players. It seems like you're basing your entire argument on his 2 games against Dallas this year and stats that don't tell the whole story.
which is why he only had 3 receptions inside the red zone all year... Ok.
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:33 PM    (permalink
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MilesAustin4MVP has been re-banned. It's quincyyyy. Surprised at all?
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:40 PM    (permalink
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does anyone else think Supporting caste is really MilesAustin4mvp?
I would illustrate the ways this is a stupid question, but I would only be proving to Scottyboy that I was totally guilty.
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:42 PM    (permalink
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I would illustrate the ways this is a stupid question, but I would only be proving to Scottyboy that I was totally guilty.
well neither of you fully grasp this whole "reading comprehension" thing, so I'd totally believe if it was you.
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BTW, if it's 3rd and 97... I'm throwing a screen pass to Brian Leonard and he will convert.
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:43 PM    (permalink
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I would illustrate the ways this is a stupid question, but I would only be proving to Scottyboy that I was totally guilty.
I'm basing this off of the man love both of you have for Austin.
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Jesse realizing Walt was Santa Claus could really shake things up.
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I don't know how old you are, but if you can get to 24/25 without getting arrested or killed, you've done well for yourself lol.
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:43 PM    (permalink
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As I believe scottyboy posted, why isnt it fair? Because he couldnt get a start over Roy or Crayton?
Because to compare performances you need to refer to more than one performance.
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:44 PM    (permalink
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well neither of you fully grasp this whole "reading comprehension" thing, so I'd totally believe if it was you.
Oh, yeah. Good one.

Yeah, you guys are probably right.
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:46 PM    (permalink
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Because to compare performances you need to refer to more than one performance.
I'm not sure that sentence even makes sense.
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Jesse realizing Walt was Santa Claus could really shake things up.
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I don't know how old you are, but if you can get to 24/25 without getting arrested or killed, you've done well for yourself lol.
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:51 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by MilesAustin4MVP View Post
Draft boards are not based on need at all. They are based on round grades. Rafael Vela of blogging the boys usually has a post on this every year as a primer for the draft. A scout team will grade so many players as first rounders (usually around 20) then so many players as second rounders and so on. From what I remember our finally board will usually have around 150 draftable players. So it doesn't have anything to do with need. How do you decide if a OL has a higher grade than say a DL? You figure out which one is better.

And Austin gets deep also, but he can do a lot more things. And you can find receivers like Jackson all the time. Like Roddy White and Devery Henderson and so on. Some are better than others but it is not like Jackson is unique, although he is really good at it, but that is all he does.
So if these players have all the same grade, lets say first round, and your the colts and have peyton manning (lets say he plays 4 or 5 more years), and sam bradford is left in the first round, do you draft him? or do you draft a safety like reshad jones who may not be graded as a first rounder but antoine bethea left in FA and bob sanders is chronically injured, do you pass up bradford or do you risk the chance of playing with two backup safeties? or a mid round rookie?

And just in case you be a smart ass and say well reshad jones would be ranked a 1st rounder, well would it not be right to say that the colts GM put him as a higher rank because they would be willing to give that pick for him because they need that position?

And no, deciding who is "better" between an OL and DL is dumb, who is more valued? who would give more impact in the long term, short term? who would improve what you have already on your team? Theres more to it then "figuring out who is better".
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:53 PM    (permalink
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I'm basing this off of the man love both of you have for Austin.
Ok. Well, based on all the man love all you DeSean Jackson manlovers have for your manlover DeSean Jackson, all you DeSean Jackson manlovers are probably the same person.
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:54 PM    (permalink
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I'm not sure that sentence even makes sense.
Two compare two objects you need to refer to more than one object.
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:57 PM    (permalink
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If DeSean Jackson is not a #1 WR, then neither is Randy Moss, Steve Smith (Car), Greg Jennings, Roddy White and countless other WRs in this league.

Some of the things Ive read in this thread are unbelievable.
Well, I agree partly. People refer to #1 WRs differently. Some call the highest paid WR, the #1 WR. Some people call the player with the most Targets the #1 WR. Most draftniks refer to #1 WRs as the guys who have complete skills. Some just call their best WR their #1 receiver. etc etc. So it's easy to see why a mix up by definition could occur.

In reality, a #1 WR is for the most part, meaningless to NFL teams. It's a label outsiders use. Fans...media types... people in general... we all love to "Label" things. We label things so we can relate it to something. But in the NFL, each receiver has their own route tree. The best WR on one team could be the split end, on another team, it could be the flanker.

Personally, I don't label Jackson a #1, because in my mind, a #1 WR can do it all. Randy Moss goes deep, but his height allows him to be a short to medium possession receiver or red zone target, unlike Jackson. Steve Smith is also a complete WR. He catches anything in his direction and they throw to him in all directions. Jennings and White are more similar to Jackson though. Jackson has some rounding out of his game still yet to do. I don't call him complete, but I do call him exceptionally rare.
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Old 01-05-2010, 08:15 PM    (permalink
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which is why he only had 3 receptions inside the red zone all year... Ok.
If you're reading this, here you go naming stats as a basis of your argument and proving you never actually watch him play. I never said he's a great redzone receiver, no ****! The guy's 5'9 175 pounds soaking wet. WTF does that have to do with me saying he can and does run all the routes? The threat of him going deep definitely contributes to his ability to get so open in the first levels of the defense on crossing, slants, out, and comeback routes. The shorter the field, the less of a factor he becomes. If you honestly believe all DeSean can do is go deep and is a non-factor otherwise you really don't belong in this discussion. Jerry Rice said he's one of the best route runners he's ever seen as well as the fastest WR he's ever seen. I think he knows a little more about the receiver position than you.
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Old 01-05-2010, 08:20 PM    (permalink
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If you're reading this, here you go naming stats as a basis of your argument and proving you never actually watch him play. I never said he's a great redzone receiver, no ****! The guy's 5'9 175 pounds soaking wet. WTF does that have to do with me saying he can and does run all the routes? The threat of him going deep definitely contributes to his ability to get so open in the first levels of the defense on crossing, slants, out, and comeback routes. The shorter the field, the less of a factor he becomes. If you honestly believe all DeSean can do is go deep and is a non-factor otherwise you really don't belong in this discussion. Jerry Rice said he's one of the best route runners he's ever seen as well as the fastest WR he's ever seen. I think he knows a little more about the receiver position than you.
Pshhh no one knows more about Miles austin than the dude who has Miles austin 4 mvp as his forum name.
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Jesse realizing Walt was Santa Claus could really shake things up.
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I don't know how old you are, but if you can get to 24/25 without getting arrested or killed, you've done well for yourself lol.
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Old 01-05-2010, 09:04 PM    (permalink
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If DeSean Jackson is not a #1 WR, then neither is Randy Moss, Steve Smith (Car), Greg Jennings, Roddy White and countless other WRs in this league.

Some of the things Ive read in this thread are unbelievable.
Comparing Smith or any of the above to DeSean is pretty incredible given Jackson does not make catches in traffic nor does he have the track record of such.

You, like other GMen fans, simply over rate b/c your D sucks and he killed you.
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Old 01-05-2010, 09:05 PM    (permalink
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MilesAustin4MVP has been re-banned. It's quincyyyy. Surprised at all?
What has he done to merit that?
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Old 01-05-2010, 09:09 PM    (permalink
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What has he done to merit that?
Quincyyyyy was banned, he can't come back, no matter who his alter-ego is.

It's THAT simple, don't question mods...
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Old 01-05-2010, 09:10 PM    (permalink
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Comparing Smith or any of the above to DeSean is pretty incredible given Jackson does not make catches in traffic nor does he have the track record of such.

You, like other GMen fans, simply over rate b/c your D sucks and he killed you.
...or the fact that he had at least 8 touchdowns of 50 yards or more and was arguably the most explosive player in the nfl only possibly behind Chris Johnson....
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Old 01-05-2010, 09:15 PM    (permalink
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...or the fact that he had at least 8 touchdowns of 50 yards or more and was arguably the most explosive player in the nfl only possibly behind Chris Johnson....
Well since this thread is about best, the criteria you present is not conclusive to me he is the best. He catches lots of bombs .... great. Great punt returner. Not a #1 WR b/c he just not tough enough.

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Old 01-05-2010, 09:18 PM    (permalink
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Quincyyyyy was banned, he can't come back, no matter who his alter-ego is.

It's THAT simple, don't question mods...
Um, yup. Go Eagles.
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Old 01-05-2010, 09:32 PM    (permalink
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Well since this thread is about best, the criteria you present is not conclusive to me he is the best. He catches lots of bombs .... great. Great punt returner. Not a #1 WR b/c he just not tough enough.
well since this was in response to us giants fans overrating him because he killed our sucky defense, i was just validating that he not only didn't just do it against us, and that he obviously isn't being overrated because there is a reason why he went to the pro bowl, theres a reason why he had these long plays (which weren't all long bombs i.e. reverse vs redskins).

So a #1 WR has to be tough? Calvin Johnson is constantly injured, is he not a #1 on his team? I'm not saying Desean is, because i don't think any of the recievers on the eagles are #1 recievers, but really just role players.

Honestly, this is getting childish, miles austin is not god, he has become a very good player, and he has potential to become a legit #1, but Desean is a more explosive, harder to matchup with, greater threat all round which really makes him the better reciever.
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Old 01-05-2010, 09:43 PM    (permalink
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No matter what, you have a right to your opinion and everyone else has the right to their own. Despite a very long argument, opinions haven't changed, but one thing is certain, by the vote of NFLDC Desean Jackson was chosen as the best receiver in the NFC East. And the only way to declare one better than the other besides if they were in identical situations, is a vote.
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