McNabb or Kolb going to Raiders?

[LonghornsLegend]

Originally Posted by Thumper

I want Kevin Kolb to be the best QB in Eagles history and I'd say he is off to a fairly good start

LOL. This is funny.


It would be nice if we could stop harping so much on those 2 little starts like they are going to tell you how his entire 15 year career will be.


Besides you use that type of argument when it helps you, but discredit it other times. Countless times you've talked about how Miles Austin only put up dominant stats vs KC and ATL, weak teams that skewed his stats in the best WR in the NFC East threat, but it's ok to talk about how Kolb dominated the Chiefs though?


Your such a homer you don't even realize it, because when it's your own players it's ok right?


After the KC game if I had made an idiot comment like "Well I want Miles Austin to be the best WR in Cowboys history and he's off to a fairly good start because nobody in history did what he did in a single game" you would of tore it apart and had a good laugh about it.


But if it's somebody for Philly that hasn't proved jack ****, the homerism just comes out of you like a broken fire hydrant.

[Morton]

Will Kevin Kolb turn out to be Aaron Rodgers or will he be Cody Carlson?

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/footb...rospects_N.htm

Warren Moon discusses McNabb in the article linked above. Now here is a great example of a player who played for a team that, at one time, was in a similar predicament as the Eagles right now: maintaining an aging Pro Bowl QB on the roster while a young backup was being "groomed" behind him. In the early 1990s the Houston Oilers had a young QB they drafted in the third round of the 1988 draft (from Texas, no less, just like Kolb) named Cody Carlson sitting behind future Hall of Famer Warren Moon.

When Moon turned 37, the Oilers traded him to the Vikings and gave Cody an opportunity to start, after showing flashes of competency in previous seasons (throwing for 65% in some relief games, etc). Unfortunately, he completely bombed as a starter in 1994: 44% accuracy, 4 interceptions and only 1 touchdown in 5 starts. The Oilers didn't have another winning season again until Steve McNair was drafted in 1994 and eventually matured into a good quarterback in 1999. Meanwhile, Moon continued to put up Pro Bowl numbers for the Vikings, throwing for 4000+ yards in his first two starts for them.

http://www.pro-football-reference.co...C/CarlCo00.htm
http://www.pro-football-reference.co...M/MoonWa00.htm

On the other hand, you have situations like Brett Favre and Aaron Rodgers, in which the young backup QB comes in after a future Hall of Famer departs, and plays like yet another future Hall of Famer.

The question we have to ask ourselves is: Will Kevin Kolb turn out to be Cody Carlson, or will he be Aaron Rodgers?

[Morton]

Originally Posted by LonghornsLegend

After the KC game if I had made an idiot comment like "Well I want Miles Austin to be the best WR in Cowboys history and he's off to a fairly good start because nobody in history did what he did in a single game" you would of tore it apart and had a good laugh about it.


But if it's somebody for Philly that hasn't proved jack ****, the homerism just comes out of you like a broken fire hydrant.

For the record, Miles Austin is, arguably, now one of the top 5 wide receivers in the NFL after his 2009 campaign.

Those two starts against weak teams sometimes actually mean that, well, the player really is good, as has been proven in the case of Miles Austin, and may be proven again with Kolb (or they may not, obviously).

But in the case of Miles Austin, I hate the Cowboys and I will go ahead and tell you that there is a good chance that Miles can go on to have a Hall of Fame career if he continues to play as he did in 2009.

[Thumper]

Originally Posted by LonghornsLegend

But if it's somebody for Philly that hasn't proved jack ****, the homerism just comes out of you like a broken fire hydrant.

Notice I said I want him to be and that he is off to a good start, I never said he would be and I doubt it will happen either. I'm just saying that to counter Morton who said that he will want McNabb to be more successful than Kolb.

[Thumper]

Originally Posted by Ness

Well you pretty much endorsed that Philadelphia is a city full of dirtbags. I think a lot of people would find it hard to fit in there. Maybe that city doesn't deserve a title.

Sounds like Terrell Owens would fit right in there. Oh wait...he was axed by the fans because of being the type of person you pretty much described that Philadelphia would actually prefer.

The fans didn't chase him out of Philly, they love TO. Andy Reid and the Eagles kicked him out. If it was up to Philly fans TO would be an Eagle and McNabb would be long gone.

[Gay Ork Wang]

Originally Posted by Morton

For the record, Miles Austin is, arguably, now one of the top 5 wide receivers in the NFL after his 2009 campaign.

Wait what?

[Splat]

Originally Posted by Morton

But in the case of Miles Austin, I hate the Cowboys and I will go ahead and tell you that there is a good chance that Miles can go on to have a Hall of Fame career if he continues to play as he did in 2009.

This made me laugh.

[Morton]

Originally Posted by *** Ork Wang

Wait what?

http://footballoutsiders.com/stats/wr

4th highest DYAR ranking of any WR in 2009, 5th highest DVOA ranking.

1320 yards and 11 touchdowns last year despite being mostly ignored for the first few games of the season.

As an unbiased football fan (I'm an Eagles fan but I am unbiased in regard to talent on other teams) you'd be crazy not to rank Austin in the top 5 WRs last year.

[Morton]

Originally Posted by Thumper

Notice I said I want him to be and that he is off to a good start, I never said he would be and I doubt it will happen either. I'm just saying that to counter Morton who said that he will want McNabb to be more successful than Kolb.

I don't want McNabb to be more successful than Kolb if the Eagles decide to start Kolb as their starter in 2010. I want whoever is quarterbacking the Eagles to be successful, period.

I was just bringing up some interesting situations from the past to draw comparisons to the current situation.

I would love Kolb to put up 4000+ yards and get a Pro Bowl bid next year, and pull a 1999 Kurt Warner, but I know that the chances of that happening are slim to none, and based on past history, he will more than likely be an average starter at best simply because finding elite quarterbacks in the NFL is incredibly hard.

[Splat]

Do you have any idea how many players have blew up one year and then nothing to average after that? Not saying that is what will happen with Austin but he has in no way earned a top five spot yet.

When Jamaal Charles became a starter only Chris Johnson rushed for more yards the rest of the season and you don't see me calling Jammaal a top five back.

[Morton]

I'd be willing to wager large sums of money that both Jamaal Charles and Miles Austin will be in the talks for top 5 at their respective positions at the end of the 2010 season, and both will be in the Pro Bowl next year.

Just my opinion.

I mean, hell, as an Eagles fan, I hope you're right about Austin and he turns into a one-year-wonder. But from what I've seen of him in games, I have a hard time picturing him just falling off the map in 2010.

[yo123]

Originally Posted by Morton

http://footballoutsiders.com/stats/wr

4th highest DYAR ranking of any WR in 2009, 5th highest DVOA ranking.

1320 yards and 11 touchdowns last year despite being mostly ignored for the first few games of the season.

As an unbiased football fan (I'm an Eagles fan but I am unbiased in regard to talent on other teams) you'd be crazy not to rank Austin in the top 5 WRs last year.

That's the worst ******* site I've ever seen in my entire life. If you're going to use stats to make your point make sure the ones your using don't put Robert Meachum, Mike Wallace, Jason Avant, and Brian Hartline in the top 30.

[tjsunstein]

Originally Posted by Morton

For the record, Miles Austin is, arguably, now one of the top 5 wide receivers in the NFL after his 2009 campaign.

Who is going to argue that?

Andre Johnson
Larry Fitzgerald
Randy Moss
Brandon Marshall
Vincent Jackson
Calvin Johnson
Reggie Wayne

So which of these receivers is he better than?

[thenewfeature06]

Originally Posted by tjsunstein

Who is going to argue that?

Andre Johnson
Larry Fitzgerald
Randy Moss
Brandon Marshall
Vincent Jackson
Calvin Johnson
Reggie Wayne

So which of these receivers is he better than?

None of them haha. He is not a top 5, arguably a top 10. And just off the top of my head I could probaby have 10 wideouts over him.

[mellojello]

Originally Posted by Thumper

McNabb is a hard worker...they don't care that McNabb runs some diabetes foundation, is father of the year and is probably one of the nicest guys they will ever meet, they just don't care.

Philly is a different world, its a shark tank, you have to be mean and bite back to survive and its the reason Philly loves AI and doesn't like McNabb.

You make Philly fans sound like the gold-digging girl who already has a good man, thinks she's hotter than she really is, but is looking for a guy with more money.

[Morton]

Originally Posted by tjsunstein

Who is going to argue that?

Andre Johnson
Larry Fitzgerald
Randy Moss
Brandon Marshall
Vincent Jackson
Calvin Johnson
Reggie Wayne

So which of these receivers is he better than?

Stats in 2009:

Andre Johnson: 101 receptions, 1576 yards, 15.5 Y/R, 550 YAC, 9 TDs
Larry Fitzgerald: 97 receptions, 1092 yards, 11.3 Y/R, 312 YAC, 13 TDs
Randy Moss: 83 receptions, 1264 yards, 15.2 Y/R, 346 YAC, 13 TDs
Brandon Marshall: 101 receptions, 1120 yards, 11.1 Y/R 510 YAC, 10 TDs
Vincent Jackson: 68 receptions, 1167 yards, 17.2 Y/R, 226 YAC, 9 TDs
Calvin Johnson: 67 receptions, 986 yards, 14.7 Y/R, 339 YAC, 5 TDs
Reggie Wayne: 100 receptions, 1264 yards, 12.6 Y/R, 440 YAC, 10 TDs

Miles Austin: 81 receptions, 1320 yards, 16.3 Y/R, 585 YAC, 11 TDs

As you can see, Austin has more YAC (yards after contact) than any of the receivers on your list. He generates higher Y/R (yards per reception) than every receiver on your list except for Vincent Jackson. Only Moss and Fitzgerald scored more touchdowns than Austin last year. Only Andre Johnson has more total yards than Austin.

All this, and you have to remember that he wasn't even a starter until week 5.

Austin is clearly an elite young WR, and arguably in the top 5 WRs of the NFL in 2009, and could easily get even better in 2010. It's scary, to be honest. If I owned a team, I'd rather have him as my #1 WR than any other WR in the NFL right now, no joke.

[Morton]

And again, I have to remind people that I HATE the Dallas Cowboys.

But facts are facts, and Austin is probably the one of the top 5 all-around WRs in the NFL right now.

[Splat]

Originally Posted by Morton

Austin is clearly an elite young WR, and arguably in the top 5 WRs of the NFL in 2009, and could easily get even better in 2010. It's scary, to be honest. If I owned a team, I'd rather have him as my #1 WR than any other WR in the NFL right now, no joke.

I think most Cowboys fans would even disagree with you.

[2KD@VIS]

The main problem with the eagles is andy reid. If they would stop throwing the ball 1000 times a game and being so predictable on defense maybe they could win something. I hope they trade Mcnabb, then they will see what they had. Hope they get a serious running becuz kevin will be corn on the kolb. Trade Vick 2 while there at it, philly is gonna suck this year save this post, i'll eat crow if i'm wrong.

[Thumper]

Originally Posted by 2KD@VIS

The main problem with the eagles is andy reid. If they would stop throwing the ball 1000 times a game and being so predictable on defense maybe they could win something. I hope they trade Mcnabb, then they will see what they had. Hope they get a serious running becuz kevin will be corn on the kolb. Trade Vick 2 while there at it, philly is gonna suck this year save this post, i'll eat crow if i'm wrong.

I honestly think you're right, I think next year if Kolb starts the Eagles will go 6-10, maybe worse if you look at the crazy hard schedule they have next year. But, the same thing happened with Aaron Rodgers and I really expect Kolb to have growing pains but I also expect him to really grow into the starting role in year #2.

[Babylon]

Originally Posted by Thumper

I honestly think you're right, I think next year if Kolb starts the Eagles will go 6-10, maybe worse if you look at the crazy hard schedule they have next year. But, the same thing happened with Aaron Rodgers and I really expect Kolb to have growing pains but I also expect him to really grow into the starting role in year #2.

I think with getting guys healthy and a strong draft they'll be better than .500 with Kolb at QB and i dont even like the Eagles.

[Thumper]

Originally Posted by Babylon

I think with getting guys healthy and a strong draft they'll be better than .500 with Kolb at QB and i dont even like the Eagles.

No way. The Eagles schedule next year is crazy hard. The Eagles play the Colts, Vikings, Cowboys (2x), Packers, Giants (2x), Texans, Falcons, 49ers, Titans, Bears, Jaguars, Redskins (2x), Lions. That schedule has 11 games that will be with potential playoff teams, next year's schedule is no joke.

[Sniper]

But we would have Kolb, AND HE TOTALLY THREW FOR A GAZILLION YARDS VS. TWO BOTTOM-10 SECONDARIES AND HAD A COMPLETION % OF OVER A ZILLION PERCENT!!!!!!!!!

CHAMPIONSHIPZ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Babylon]

Originally Posted by Sniper

But we would have Kolb, AND HE TOTALLY THREW FOR A GAZILLION YARDS VS. TWO BOTTOM-10 SECONDARIES AND HAD A COMPLETION % OF OVER A ZILLION PERCENT!!!!!!!!!

CHAMPIONSHIPZ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

All i was saying was at least 9-7. Donovan makes that much differance?

[Thumper]

Originally Posted by Sniper

But we would have Kolb, AND HE TOTALLY THREW FOR A GAZILLION YARDS VS. TWO BOTTOM-10 SECONDARIES AND HAD A COMPLETION % OF OVER A ZILLION PERCENT!!!!!!!!!

CHAMPIONSHIPZ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Really?