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Old 09-20-2010, 06:23 PM    (permalink
Splat
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I'm pretty much in favor of sitting any rookie QB a year unless you don't have any other choice or he just flat out earns the job.
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Old 09-20-2010, 06:25 PM    (permalink
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Clausen will prove his haters wrong.
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Old 09-20-2010, 06:26 PM    (permalink
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Clausen will prove his haters wrong.
In the long run I agree but not this year.
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Old 09-20-2010, 07:12 PM    (permalink
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The QB on their roster who will retire with the most impressive career isn't Moore or Clausen. Tony Pike will be the starter by week 3 next season.
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Old 09-20-2010, 07:18 PM    (permalink
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I'm pretty much in favor of sitting any rookie QB a year unless you don't have any other choice or he just flat out earns the job.
I disagree completely. Unless it's a situation like Favre/Rodgers or McNabb/Kolb where there's a good long time veteran starter then throw the high draft pick in right away.
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Old 09-20-2010, 07:23 PM    (permalink
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I disagree completely. Unless it's a situation like Favre/Rodgers or McNabb/Kolb where there's a good long time veteran starter then throw the high draft pick in right away.
For every Marino and Big Ben who played great as a rookie, there are several David Carr's who get beat up so badly early in their careers that they become gun shy later on.

It's really a situation by situation basis for me. Someone like Clausen who played a lot in college in a pro style system (ducks and looks around for YFS) on a pro team where they can (if they get out of their own way with playcalling) run the ball well behind a good-great o-line, I say play him.
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Old 09-20-2010, 07:37 PM    (permalink
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Clausen will prove his haters wrong.
No he won't.
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Old 09-20-2010, 07:46 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Miaoww View Post
Besides the one of Quinn grabbing that guy's crotch.
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On man, I've never seen that one. That one would be worse.

You have now. What is it with Notre Dame QBs and embarrassing pictures?




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Old 09-20-2010, 07:58 PM    (permalink
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This isn't a bad move by any stretch. Clausen has improved every day he's been under centre and he's been a great team mate, not even a whisper or declension despite Florio suggesting otherwise.

This season is going to tank and it's largely due to the labour issues the Panthers haven't spent any money on upgrading the areas they sorely needed to.

It sucks but it's life.

The team as a whole is the youngest in the NFL IIRC and the Panthers may have been competitive if everything came together and still might but it's just not there.

The move is a good one, it'll force the coaching staff into smarter game plans something that was obviously lacking the past two weeks and hopefully provide a spark for the offensive line to play better than they did in past weeks. The Offensive line hasn't been great but Moore was holding the ball too long making them look worse than they are, Moore is something I can't explain he looked great last year, did everything right, he's faltering now.

My support is behind Clausen and I'm happy to support him for 2 years at least behind center before I declare "he won't prove anyone wrong" like some mouth breathers like to. He's in a familiar offense with good run game support he can't do any worse than Moore did the first two weeks. Cincinnati has a good secondary so it's a big test, but based on his familiarity with the offense Carolina uses (he used the same on at Notre D) he shouldn't need as much coddling as most rookies.
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Old 09-20-2010, 08:02 PM    (permalink
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For every Marino and Big Ben who played great as a rookie, there are several David Carr's who get beat up so badly early in their careers that they become gun shy later on.

It's really a situation by situation basis for me. Someone like Clausen who played a lot in college in a pro style system (ducks and looks around for YFS) on a pro team where they can (if they get out of their own way with playcalling) run the ball well behind a good-great o-line, I say play him.
You can just as easily argue that David Carr sucked ass from the start. It's no coincidence that the guy who replaced him when he finally got hurt ended up moving the ball really well, and that Matt Schaub is now lighting it up. Sure, the offensive line has gotten better, but most of the time when there are consistent, season-long or more protection issues, at least half of the blame has to lie with the quarterback. Maybe he's not mobile enough to step up in the pocket, maybe he isn't making reads quickly enough, maybe he doesn't have enough faith in his protection and leaves the pocket too early(as a former OL that was a big pet peeve. I can't block the DE in front of me if he knows where the QB is and I don't). For whatever reason, it seems to be the case. Look at the improvement in Dallas' offense after switching to Romo from Bledsoe. Look at how much better Philly's offense looked with Vick running it than Kolb.

Even on the Bears, look at how bad that offensive line is and then look at how few sacks have been given up so far. Jay is insane at avoiding sacks. Orton isn't even that bad at it, but the difference is huge and can be seen easily.

Anyway I agree with GB, I think that some guys have it, and some guys don't. I'd rather find out right away and cut my losses after 2-3 years than have him sit for 2, then all of a sudden he's only started for a season or 2 and it's time to renew his contract but we're not sure if he's ever gonna fix his stuff.
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Old 09-20-2010, 08:29 PM    (permalink
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You can just as easily argue that David Carr sucked ass from the start. It's no coincidence that the guy who replaced him when he finally got hurt ended up moving the ball really well, and that Matt Schaub is now lighting it up. Sure, the offensive line has gotten better, but most of the time when there are consistent, season-long or more protection issues, at least half of the blame has to lie with the quarterback. Maybe he's not mobile enough to step up in the pocket, maybe he isn't making reads quickly enough, maybe he doesn't have enough faith in his protection and leaves the pocket too early(as a former OL that was a big pet peeve. I can't block the DE in front of me if he knows where the QB is and I don't). For whatever reason, it seems to be the case. Look at the improvement in Dallas' offense after switching to Romo from Bledsoe. Look at how much better Philly's offense looked with Vick running it than Kolb.

Even on the Bears, look at how bad that offensive line is and then look at how few sacks have been given up so far. Jay is insane at avoiding sacks. Orton isn't even that bad at it, but the difference is huge and can be seen easily.

Anyway I agree with GB, I think that some guys have it, and some guys don't. I'd rather find out right away and cut my losses after 2-3 years than have him sit for 2, then all of a sudden he's only started for a season or 2 and it's time to renew his contract but we're not sure if he's ever gonna fix his stuff.
I tend to agree with this sentiment. Word is that Fox win lose or draw this season is leaving and it's apparently mutual the brass doesn't want him 100% and he doesn't want to be there 100%.

He gives Clausen a shot and the organization finds out of he can play or not. If he can and he plays well even if his stat line isn't great they can promote Davidson, and either promote Scherer (QB coach) or another guy from that NE offense tree.

Clausen sucks terribly gut everyone not on the defensive side of the ball and use the first round pick next year (likely a top 10 anyway) to draft whomever the hell they want at QB. The offensive line has talent even if they haven't done well without Otah as yet and a good set of running backs anyway.

Carolina if nothing else has talent on both sides of the ball and solid pieces to build around so if all else fails they can bring in someone who only has to put it together and find that QB and it's ok, if that QB is on the roster then might as well find out now in a season that's already tanking.
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Old 09-20-2010, 09:20 PM    (permalink
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I wish Clausen g/l, but I am sure glad the Rams took Bradford.
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Old 09-20-2010, 09:32 PM    (permalink
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With Rookie QBs I think the only proven is that it's something of a crapshoot. See how either looks in 3 years before making judgment imo.
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Old 09-20-2010, 09:55 PM    (permalink
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What the ****? That is gross, if you are the starting QB at Notre Dame that should get you kicked off the team and/or capital punishment.
Well someone did give him a shiner on campus............
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Old 09-21-2010, 12:09 AM    (permalink
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For every Marino and Big Ben who played great as a rookie, there are several David Carr's who get beat up so badly early in their careers that they become gun shy later on.

It's really a situation by situation basis for me. Someone like Clausen who played a lot in college in a pro style system (ducks and looks around for YFS) on a pro team where they can (if they get out of their own way with playcalling) run the ball well behind a good-great o-line, I say play him.
Weis' ND offense mightve toed the line more than some would think when in comes to pro principles, but in fairness the Carolina offense is basically a high school offense. Run, run, run, run, lob the ball to the 1 good receiver on your team, run.
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Old 09-21-2010, 12:26 AM    (permalink
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Weis' ND offense mightve toed the line more than some would think when in comes to pro principles, but in fairness the Carolina offense is basically a high school offense. Run, run, run, run, lob the ball to the 1 good receiver on your team, run.
Well that is what you'd think they'd do. Doesn't seem to be the case though.....Maybe that changes with a rookie in at QB.
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Old 09-21-2010, 12:42 AM    (permalink
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We ran on first down on the first 9 possessions against the Bucs. They pass when they lose the lead. Now, the OC has the intelligence of a high schooler so he abandons the run too early but the preference is to go to ground 60+% of the time

In Moore's starts last year the breakdown was:

20 pass, 33 run
30 pass, 24 run (loss)
33 pass, 40 run
20 pass, 46 run
23 pass, 37 run
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Old 09-21-2010, 02:48 AM    (permalink
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This year it hasn't been close to that which is a shame. I think they're missing Otah more than we know and the line, whatever the stat sheet says has been shuffled a rotated a little bit on game day.

From the centre left it's solid as a rock but from the RG to RT position it's lacking a little firepower, Otah should help change that but we'll have to wait and see.
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Old 09-21-2010, 03:07 AM    (permalink
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You have now. What is it with Notre Dame QBs and embarrassing pictures?





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Old 09-21-2010, 05:07 AM    (permalink
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I wish Clausen g/l, but I am sure glad the Rams took Bradford.
well yes they're obviously not of the same caliber. That's like saying I wish some second round DT all the best but I'm glad the Lions drafted Suh.
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Old 09-21-2010, 08:13 AM    (permalink
Addict
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wait all three of us? yeah. i can't wait till we're proved wrong either. that would SO serve us right for not licking the nuts of every notre dame qb who comes out.

otherwise, all the morons who think that he's better than brady quinn can make the same excuses they made for quinn until it's finally clear that he's garbage as a player.

ad hom sure is fun.
there is a difference between not licking nuts and blind, irrational hate. Which is what many show at this point.

hyperboles are a great amount of fun as well.
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Old 09-21-2010, 08:24 AM    (permalink
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to be fair, i was hyperbolizing to enhance the ad hom.
you've just blown my mind.
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Old 09-21-2010, 09:07 AM    (permalink
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Soooo yeah....Jimmy gonna win.
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Old 09-21-2010, 10:19 AM    (permalink
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well yes they're obviously not of the same caliber. That's like saying I wish some second round DT all the best but I'm glad the Lions drafted Suh.
Huh. I must have watched two different QBs in college then. I'd have taken Clausen over Bradford.
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Old 09-21-2010, 10:21 AM    (permalink
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Huh. I must have watched two different QBs in college then. I'd have taken Clausen over Bradford.
which is why you aren't employed by an NFL team.
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