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Old 11-02-2010, 12:32 PM    (permalink
bantx
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And when the run game is back and we get most of our receivers back it'll be another reason to say he's not amazing. Haters gonna hate.
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Old 11-02-2010, 12:42 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Paranoidmoonduck View Post
I don't buy either argument. Rodgers has a bunch of potential, but has largely failed to have the kind of success we all expected him to have this year. I think he'll be a great QB down the road, but I couldn't even come close to calling him better than Rivers right now.

And while Roethlisberger has the superbowl rings, Rivers is clearly the better regular season quarterback. Clearly.
Who gives a ****?

You make your name in the postseason as a qb. And Ben is clearly the superior post season qb.

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Originally Posted by gpngc View Post
The Roethlisberger argument can be made with a straight face because of the winning, but if you logically think about all the factors in evaluating the two players, Rivers is clearly better.

Big Ben does have two Super Bowls - I'm not knocking him at all, he's a fine QB (although he played terribly in the first one). But Rivers never had the defense, running game, and just overall Pittsburgh awesomeness helping him.
Oh revisionist history. How I love thee.

Rivers had what was considered the most talented team in the league for a 3 year stretch and underperformed with them every time. Last year, he had the best team in the AFC and was 1 and done in the playoffs.

I think Rivers is a great qb, but he's severely overrated on this forum. Until he does something worth a crap in the playoffs, he's nothing more than this generation's Dan Fouts to me.

The sad thing is, I'm gonna come off as a hater in this post, but it just annoys me how fantasy football has effected our perceptions of quarterbacks.

And btw, calling him Fouts is not an insult. Fouts was a HOFer.
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Old 11-02-2010, 12:48 PM    (permalink
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I can recall a certain kicker who i will blame on the 1 and our last playoff run. And the other play off run when he played through with no LT or Gates and a torn ACL, and ****** ******* playcalls.
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Old 11-02-2010, 01:09 PM    (permalink
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Is it just me or does anyone else hates Rivers arm?

Aside from his weird chicken wing side arm, he clearly does not have any zip on any of his passes and that kills me. I give him all the credit for having the accuracy but he just does not wow me with his strength. I wonder what everyone else thinks about this.
It's you. In fact, the only thing I don't hate about Rivers is his arm. I hate his douchey face, his wonky delivery, his southern boy drawl, his big yappin' mouth and more, but I don't hate his arm.
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Old 11-02-2010, 01:46 PM    (permalink
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Whatever the generation, what ultimately separates QBs is winning the Lombardi, or at least get to a SB.
Rivers needs to really make a deep run in the playoffs to be more than just a talented, statistically dominant regular season QB.

History tends to blur over guys like Rivers, but remembers guys like Roethlisberger, Brees and Brady forever, even if Rivers is the 'equal' or 'better' QB.

The numbers Rivers puts up per season do remind me of Marino, however. The Bolts need to find a way to get over the hump, and the sooner Norval is no longer the HC, the sooner SD wins a SB.
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Old 11-02-2010, 03:25 PM    (permalink
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Who gives a ****?

You make your name in the postseason as a qb. And Ben is clearly the superior post season qb.
Ben also clearly had the superior teams and always had to throw less than Rivers has in the playoffs. I understand why someone would pick Ben as being the more accomplished QB to this point, but it's hard to call someone with a 64 QB rating in the Superbowl an amazing postseason QB, and if I had to pick between the two, I would pick Rivers.
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Old 11-02-2010, 03:26 PM    (permalink
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Who gives a ****?

You make your name in the postseason as a qb. And Ben is clearly the superior post season qb.



Oh revisionist history. How I love thee.

Rivers had what was considered the most talented team in the league for a 3 year stretch and underperformed with them every time. Last year, he had the best team in the AFC and was 1 and done in the playoffs.

I think Rivers is a great qb, but he's severely overrated on this forum. Until he does something worth a crap in the playoffs, he's nothing more than this generation's Dan Fouts to me.

The sad thing is, I'm gonna come off as a hater in this post, but it just annoys me how fantasy football has effected our perceptions of quarterbacks.

And btw, calling him Fouts is not an insult. Fouts was a HOFer.
I don't even know where to start with this thread but bashing revisionist history and then saying Rivers hasn't done anything in the playoffs is extremely hypocritical.
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Old 11-02-2010, 03:34 PM    (permalink
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Um, huh? Are you being serious?
This is exactly what I thought when I read that comment.
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Old 11-02-2010, 07:42 PM    (permalink
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Who gives a ****?

You make your name in the postseason as a qb. And Ben is clearly the superior post season qb.



Oh revisionist history. How I love thee.

Rivers had what was considered the most talented team in the league for a 3 year stretch and underperformed with them every time. Last year, he had the best team in the AFC and was 1 and done in the playoffs.

I think Rivers is a great qb, but he's severely overrated on this forum. Until he does something worth a crap in the playoffs, he's nothing more than this generation's Dan Fouts to me.

The sad thing is, I'm gonna come off as a hater in this post, but it just annoys me how fantasy football has effected our perceptions of quarterbacks.

And btw, calling him Fouts is not an insult. Fouts was a HOFer.
Rivers has 3 playoff wins to his credit (2008 Indy win he lead not one but two game winning drives)... shouldn't that qualify as something?

And lets be honest - outside of 2006, the defense has been average at best.
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Old 11-02-2010, 08:06 PM    (permalink
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Rivers has 3 playoff wins to his credit (2008 Indy win he lead not one but two game winning drives)... shouldn't that qualify as something?

And lets be honest - outside of 2006, the defense has been average at best.
All truths.

And he's not even mentioning how many playoff games Rivers gave them a chance to win but were blown because Kaeding is awful in the clutch.

If you watch Big Ben every week and Rivers every week I don't see how you can possibly come to the conclusion that Ben is better than Rivers.

??????????
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Old 11-02-2010, 08:53 PM    (permalink
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lies....best physical passer maybe, but roethlisberger and rodgers>rivers as a QB
holy **** never post again.
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Old 11-02-2010, 09:15 PM    (permalink
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i really dont see what is so offensive about that....people seriously get butt hurt about rivers. if you are making a list of the top 5-6 QBs all three would probably fall in the 4-6 range after manning, brees and brady.

theres more to being a QB than stats...at one point aaron brooks was putting up big numbers, physical numbers that rivaled the best QBs in the league...he was still a ****** QB. this isnt fantasy football

im not calling rivers ****** by any means, but im not sure the thought of taking ben or rodgers over him should warrant death threats lol
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Old 11-02-2010, 09:17 PM    (permalink
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i really dont see what is so offensive about that....people seriously get butt hurt about rivers. if you are making a list of the top 5-6 QBs all three would probably fall in the 4-6 range after manning, brees and brady.

theres more to being a QB than stats...at one point aaron brooks was putting up big numbers, physical numbers that rivaled the best QBs in the league...he was still a ****** QB. this isnt fantasy football

im not calling rivers ****** by any means, but im not sure the thought of taking ben or rodgers over him should warrant death threats lol
not deaththreats dude but to say that Rivers is a better physical passer than B Roeth or Rodgers is pretty bad. Both of those guys are specimens, which is just about the opposite of how Rivers gets the job done.
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Old 11-02-2010, 09:49 PM    (permalink
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Who gives a ****?

You make your name in the postseason as a qb. And Ben is clearly the superior post season qb.



Oh revisionist history. How I love thee.

Rivers had what was considered the most talented team in the league for a 3 year stretch and underperformed with them every time. Last year, he had the best team in the AFC and was 1 and done in the playoffs.

I think Rivers is a great qb, but he's severely overrated on this forum. Until he does something worth a crap in the playoffs, he's nothing more than this generation's Dan Fouts to me.

The sad thing is, I'm gonna come off as a hater in this post, but it just annoys me how fantasy football has effected our perceptions of quarterbacks.

And btw, calling him Fouts is not an insult. Fouts was a HOFer.
Don't play it and I still think there's no better under 30 QB. Rivers is just a baller. Iunno why San Diego hasn't won anything of significance, but it's certainly not because of him...
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Old 11-02-2010, 10:10 PM    (permalink
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San Diego has been their own worst enemy for years. They kill them selves with big mistakes.
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Old 11-02-2010, 10:44 PM    (permalink
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The sad thing is, I'm gonna come off as a hater in this post, but it just annoys me how fantasy football has effected our perceptions of quarterbacks.
That is definitely coming off as hating because Rivers is 4/4 with division championships since becoming the starter and has never lost in December.
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Old 11-02-2010, 11:13 PM    (permalink
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Barely anyone arguing for Rivers is bringing up statistics and yet so many people against him are bringing up fantasy football...

If you watch how he plays and HOW he accumulates the stats that you all are bringing up you would realize that he's a phenomenal quarterback and better than Rodgers/Ben.

He's more accurate, he makes better decisions, and he's better in the clutch.
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Old 11-02-2010, 11:15 PM    (permalink
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That is definitely coming off as hating because Rivers is 4/4 with division championships since becoming the starter and has never lost in December.
And THREE times in TWO of his playoff losses he set his team up for a FG to win/tie the game and all three attempts were missed.
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Old 11-02-2010, 11:18 PM    (permalink
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Not to mention that San Diego, like the Patriots, can throw any random body out to catch a pass and they'll look good. Rivers is one of those guys who has that kind of command of the ball, the position, and the offense.
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Old 11-02-2010, 11:18 PM    (permalink
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and he's better in the clutch.
thats just criminal to say that
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Old 11-02-2010, 11:31 PM    (permalink
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And the year he's having without his #1 reciever and the past few games without floyd and a hurt gates still having great games. People will find ways to say how it was because so and so
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Old 11-02-2010, 11:40 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by K Train View Post
thats just criminal to say that
I was going to say the same thing, lol.

If there's one thing that you can't say Rivers beats Roethlisberger at, it's at being clutch. Everything else, I understand. But not that. He might be good at it like Roethlisberger, but not better.

Roethlisberger has 18 career comeback wins, including the one in the Superbowl. Ben is extremely clutch. Sure, he might not do it always, but he does it very often. Packers fans witnessed it last year, Ravens fans witnessed it two years ago, and many others have too. He's extremely clutch.

Rivers has 11 comeback wins.
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Old 11-02-2010, 11:57 PM    (permalink
bantx
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One can argue that he had a defense to help him come back and Rivers didn't. But I won't get into that.
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Old 11-02-2010, 11:58 PM    (permalink
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^And that two of Rivers chances to come back were ruined by Kaeding.

But the clutch thing was aimed more at Rodgers.

Big Ben is extremely clutch, but so is Rivers. And Rivers is better at everything else....
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Old 11-03-2010, 12:23 AM    (permalink
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And the year he's having without his #1 reciever and the past few games without floyd and a hurt gates still having great games. People will find ways to say how it was because so and so
People do the same thing to Peyton Manning, go back and check that thread from the beginning of the year. 'its not that hes good, its that collie and garcon are better than they thought, so and so thought he was a very underrated prospect blah blah blah.' im sure tamme is another guy everyone thought was sick and its still his weapons that are making him great. Some of the playoff loses are his fault and bad games, but people just remember those and forget the vanderjagt miss in the dome and the drops and dissappering acts by Harrison.

look ill admit it, i dont like rivers as a person, he bitches on the field a lot and i especially hate him after that INT last year against the jets when he got in the refs faces screaming at them that they were wrong. then they show the replay...it was a pick. it pissed me off to no end that he freaked like that and was clearly wrong, rubbed me the wrong way permanently really. I also thought he was very overrated and benefited from big targets and gates (still do to some degree but thats wearing off a bit). I also hate his girlyass throwing motion.

But hes proven this year that when his team sucks he can carry them and give them a chance. Hes not quite there yet (they somehow keep losing despite him throwing it all over gods 40 acres) but hes reaching that elite level and while i dont like him as a person you gotta give the player props.

Now better than Big Ben, Rodgers, and (**** it, im throwing him in there too) Eli? Idk its tough to rate them because theyre all pretty damn close (yes eli too, watch him, especially in the clutch, very consistent player). as far as WHO PLAYING BETTER RIGHT NOW AND WHOD ID RATHER HAVE THROWING THE BALL FOR MY TEAM:
Peyton/Brady, Rivers, Eli, Brees, Rodgers, Ryan, Ben. (calm down)<---thrown in because everyones gunna be like "qb from my favorite team is too low blah blah stat homer homer blah." i think this is howd id put it off the top of my head but gotta think about it a little more might come back to this. just sayin, im tired. (ryan orton flacco henne hasselback cutler schaub vick i know i gotta think a lot more and see where they all fall)

To me, Rivers' play puts him in the convo for 3rd with Brees all things considered and basing it off right now, id say brees hasnt looked himself until this past week so we'll see if that keeps up, very close though.

And yes im serious about eli, i know im gunna catch hell for it but ive been very very impressed with his play this year dude looks fantastic. I know hes had a lot of picks on the stat sheet but the majority (and thats no exaggeration) have hit recievers in the hands and theyve just tipped it into the air for grabs. If you dont go by the stat sheet and just watch them play, this is how i see it.

Last edited by hockey619 : 11-03-2010 at 12:26 AM.
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