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Old 12-19-2010, 11:10 PM    (permalink
vikes_28
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I have a feeling favre is going to start.
I take this back. Webb is for sure starting.....
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Old 12-21-2010, 04:34 PM    (permalink
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We are going to sign Rhett Bomar.


Meh...
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Old 12-21-2010, 09:12 PM    (permalink
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Can you guys tell me about Ray Edwards? Is he going to be allowed to become a FA? Is he worth top money?
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Old 12-21-2010, 09:34 PM    (permalink
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Can you guys tell me about Ray Edwards? Is he going to be allowed to become a FA? Is he worth top money?
No.(10 char)
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Old 12-21-2010, 10:02 PM    (permalink
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Edwards is a solid player, but he definitely benefits from playing alongside Jared Allen and Kevin Williams. He's gonna be a FA after this year, and I don't see any way we bring him back with all the other guys we gotta pay. He got screwed by the CBA running out that caused him to become a RFA, because he would have got big money after the playoffs that he had last year. He's strong against the run, and is a solid pass rusher. He's what he is at this point and will basically be the guy he's been the past couple years (8.5 sacks last year and 6.5 in 12 games so far this year, having missed 2 games due to a high ankle sprain). He seems to be a guy who will manage to get to the upper single digits in sacks, but won't ever see double digits. He's also a hot head, who has gotten several personal foul penalties and has to be among the top 5 or 10 most fined guys over the past 2 seasons due to that. He's also good for about an offsides a game as he tries to jump the snap count. He also seems like a guy that refs keep an eye out for as he got called for a roughing the passer penalty last night when the QB was knocked into him by Kevin Williams, and has had other iffy ones called on him.

All in all, no he's not worth the top money, but he'd be a good player for a team like the Bucs, who need a couple pass rushers and all around DEs to target.
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Old 12-22-2010, 08:31 AM    (permalink
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Jason Lacanfora of NFL Network just reported that Bill Parcells might end up in Minnesota as a "football guru" next year.

He might be overrated as a coach, but he's a solid assembler of talent.

Maybe hasn't done that great in Miami, but I think he found Cameron Wake in the CFL....
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Old 12-22-2010, 10:32 AM    (permalink
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Jason Lacanfora of NFL Network just reported that Bill Parcells might end up in Minnesota as a "football guru" next year.

He might be overrated as a coach, but he's a solid assembler of talent.

Maybe hasn't done that great in Miami, but I think he found Cameron Wake in the CFL....
Oh man, Parcells picking defensive linemen for the Vikings?

I'm soiling my pants.
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Old 12-22-2010, 01:55 PM    (permalink
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Jason Lacanfora of NFL Network just reported that Bill Parcells might end up in Minnesota as a "football guru" next year.

He might be overrated as a coach, but he's a solid assembler of talent.

Maybe hasn't done that great in Miami, but I think he found Cameron Wake in the CFL....
I'd love that, but my biggest and really only concern is that he has (at least that I can remember) always ran the 3-4 as both a coach and '"football guru", and well we have very few pieces for the 3-4 (only ones I can think of are Kevin Williams at DE and Chad and EJ at ILB; Allen would not fit as was partially the reason for him leaving KC), and it would be a terrible move for us if we did change to the 3-4.

He is a great talent evaluator, and would also help restore some order to the mess that this franchise has become. One thing to note in Miami is that he took that team from 1-15 and one of the worst teams ever to an 11-5 playoff team the next year, now the team hasn't been able to take the next step, but he did turn things around immediately.
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Old 12-22-2010, 04:05 PM    (permalink
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Interesting, I heard a report like this a few weeks on other message boards but I chalked to up to internet rumor. I'm not sure how I feel about it. I guess it depends on what his role would be. Will he hire a GM? Will he be the GM? One thing is sure, and that is that this team needs a true football mind at the top of the ladder and not a guy who is a real estate guru with a pretty bad ass mustache.
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Old 12-22-2010, 07:32 PM    (permalink
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I don't want Bill Parcells, if he comes he is going to switch the Vikes to a 3-4 defense. Than the Vikes would have to re-build almost the entire defense rather than just the secondary.
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Old 12-23-2010, 12:16 PM    (permalink
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What does everyone think of Kellen Moore in the late rounds as a potential starter down the line? He is smart and accurate, I think he would be a great fit in the WCO. Guess we will have to see who our new coach is first, though...
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Old 12-23-2010, 12:44 PM    (permalink
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What does everyone think of Kellen Moore in the late rounds as a potential starter down the line? He is smart and accurate, I think he would be a great fit in the WCO. Guess we will have to see who our new coach is first, though...
No thanks. No arm, no mobility. Part of the reason our offense sucks this year is the lack of a deep ball.
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Old 12-23-2010, 12:45 PM    (permalink
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I don't want Bill Parcells, if he comes he is going to switch the Vikes to a 3-4 defense. Than the Vikes would have to re-build almost the entire defense rather than just the secondary.
Don't want Parcells either. He can make a terrible team decent, but can he make a decent team great? Hasn't proved that to me yet. I like Spielman. I just think we need a legitimate quarterback.
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Old 12-23-2010, 05:47 PM    (permalink
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I would like the move if Parcells came in as a consultant and a not a GM. It would be perfect if he helped Ziggy find a GM and consulted on who to hire as a head coach and organized a chain of command. Basically I would want him to be the architect of the organization but not necessarily make decisions like who to draft or what defense to run etc. I kind of laugh when I see the way our front office is setup, it's a joke. I mean what the hell is a triangle of authority? There needs to be a chain of command where everyone works together but no one person has complete control. The coach's boss is the GM, the GM's boss it the president etc. I would also like to keep Spielman around as the player personal guy as he seems to do a pretty good job with the draft.
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Old 12-23-2010, 05:55 PM    (permalink
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No thanks. No arm, no mobility. Part of the reason our offense sucks this year is the lack of a deep ball.
This. Plus the fact that he's left handed is another negative. It may not seem like it should be a big deal, but IMO he's at best gonna be a solid #2, and that would completely screw with your offense, different for protection (RT is now the blind side), different for rollouts and scrambling, different for receivers, etc.

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Don't want Parcells either. He can make a terrible team decent, but can he make a decent team great? Hasn't proved that to me yet. I like Spielman. I just think we need a legitimate quarterback.
I see your point with this, but how much of that was his fault in Miami and how much was players and coaching, and since Miami was really the only place he's done that, we won't know. I also like Spielman, and he's done a great job, but it seems like we want to get a big name to try and create a buzz, especially with the stadium and everything else, and Parcells definitely knows his ****.

Also, I'm not so sure that all it will take for us is a legit QB. This team has some big time holes in several spots. We're well set at the skill positions with Rice, Harvin, AD, Shiancoe, and even Gerhart, but the OL as a whole was brutal this year. McKinnie has fallen off even more and has now become a 6'8" 340 pound piece of **** who can't do anything well, and isn't even average at anything anymore. Hutch has fallen off and has suffered through injuries these past couple years, and just hasn't been his old self; Sullivan was solid when he was in there early on, which wasn't much as he had a couple nagging injuries, but he has now forgotten how to snap the ball. Herrera was IMO our best OL for quite a bit of the time he was healthy, and that's far from a good thing; Loadholt has regressed so far this year that I don't have much for hope for him anymore. DeGeare may be a replacement for Hutch, he has looked solid, but who knows.

On defense, Allen is still a top pass rusher, and Kevin Williams is still a beast, but Pat is gone, and while I like the guys we have in Guion, Evans, and Kennedy, are any of them guys that you'd wanna have as starters, b/c to me they're much better as rotational guys, but as your worst DL that's not bad; Edwards should be as good as gone, and I like Robison, he's a good solid all around player, but he's also a FA. Everson Griffen has looked real good when he's gotten time, but he's far from a sure thing. LB we should be ok at unless Greenway leaves. EJ is a very good MLB, and I know Leber is a FA and he's a solid player, but could easily be upgraded. I wouldn't mind seeing Erin get a shot, he looked good earlier in the year when Leber got hurt, but he'd still be a question mark. At CB you've got a lot of question marks. Winfield has been very good this year, but is aging and will have to be replaced in the not to distant future. Griffin looked very good when he played, but having torn both ACLs in the last year you can't expect anything from him, even though it is much easier to come back from that now. Asher Allen has been tore apart this year, but he could still make a solid nickel back and he's only in his 2nd year. I have hope for Cook, as he was never healthy, but he didn't show a whole lot this season, despite beasting it in preseason. Walker and Sheppard are nothing more than veteran backups and I don't think either has a contract beyond this year. Now we get to the mess that is S. Madeiu Williams is without a doubt the worst starting S in the NFL. I do have to say that Abdullah has looked solid this year, but he struggles covering the sidelines, and is still a below average starter. After that, Tyrell is a lost cause, Sanford hasn't been given a shot, probably for good reason, and Frampton is a ST.

Now you take a peak at the guys whose contracts will be up in the next couple seasons and you've got a mess. Just this year, we've got Rice, Greenway, Edwards, Leber, Robison, and I believe a couple others (yea, T-Jack and Favre, but who cares). Next year you got IIRC AD, Shiancoe, and EJ. We also can't be too far off from having to give Kevin and Jared new deals either, and I don't know how we can sign all of those guys, or even just all of the key guys, as there are pretty much half the starters on that list, and the other half are either old or need to be replaced.

I try to be optomistic, and I see all the talent on this team, but I'm not anywhere near sure that this is just a restock and go, and you'll be contending after a year, maybe two. This could be a several year rebuilding process.
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Old 12-23-2010, 06:30 PM    (permalink
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Our franchise is in really ****** shape, guys. First off, we don't have a stadium. Second, we don't have a quarterback. Third, we don't have a secondary. Fourth, we don't have an offensive line. This isn't a one year rebuilding process. I am fearful for a variety of reasons, but my biggest fear is that AP will end up being like Steven Jackson, an awesome back rotting on a bad team, which we could end up being for a few years. I would like to see a new coach, not Frazier be the head coach. I am fine with Frazier at defensive coordinator, but I am not a fan of his as a head coach. Who do you guys want to see as head coach? I would love Gruden. If not him, a defensive minded coach would be a preference. A coach who will bring something creative to the table on defense, and love to pound the ball on offense. I am sick of this cover 2 ******** and would love a different scheme, but I definitely don't think we can afford to switch to the 3-4. If we could bring someone from the Giants organization in to run our defense that would be a dream come true. A big problem with our team is the fact that half of our starters are awesome, Pro-Bowl caliber players, while the other half shouldn't see an NFL start. Rice, AP, Harvin, Shiancoe, Greenway, EJ, Kevin Williams, and Jared Allen are all good as ****. So how do we go about resigning all of these guys (basically all have contracts expiring this year or after next) and still build up the rest of our team? We have will have to pick and choose who to resign. How do we prioritize? I think we can all agree based on how terrible we looked when he was gone that Sidney Rice has to be a top priority. AP is the best back in the league, an obvious priority, and Chad Greenway can anchor our defense for the next 8 years. None of these guys are expendable. I don't know how we could afford to lose any of our big name free agents over the next two years. So while we don't know how this will play out, we need to focus on the draft. I think we can all agree that our biggest need is quarterback. We cannot afford to **** up on this first round pick. If Locker or Mallet fall to us, what do we do? Do we take Locker with all his question marks? Do we take Mallet and all his question marks? We can't pass on them if they are there, but we are definitely taking a huge gamble with the future of our franchise. We need a sure thing at quarterback. This relates to why I want Gruden. The dude straight up knows quarterbacks. I don't know who better to coach up a Mallet or a Locker than Gruden. But let's say we can't get a top quarterback, then what? We need offensive line help and secondary help the next most. Unless we can get our hands on PP or Prince, the offensive line has to be the next highest priority. Sherrod is likely to be the top rated tackle, and even if we have to take him as high as 9 or 10, I think that has to be the choice. McKinnie needs to be off this team asap. Dude is a ******* bum. We have to give Loadholt another year, whether we like it or not. We just don't have the picks to invest in another RT. So let's say we got Sherrod at #10 in the draft, what do we do in the second? Do we take a second round quarterback, even though they never work out? Ponder would be a nice pick, but can we spend a second rounder on a quarterback who probably won't work out? Can we afford that gamble? I don't know. We need secondary help quite badly as well, so we can't afford to **** up a prime pick like a second rounder. Would Winfield switching to safety be a good move, or should he remain at corner? Who else do we have at corner? Griffin is awesome, but he has two torn ACLs. Asher Allen is fine as a DIME back, and I have always hated Chris Cook and hold no hope for him. We have nothing at corner. We have nothing at safety. We have nothing at offensive line. We have even less at quarterback. We need defensive line help, since Edwards will probably bolt, and Robison may not be a great starter, and he might also be gone. Considering all of our holes on the roster, we can't afford to spend a premium pick on the defensive line, even though the trenches are supremely important. But then we have a different problem on hand. We have always been a BPA team, since having good players can only benefit your team. But when there are so many holes on the roster, can we afford to spend a first rounder on a guy like Bowers or Fairley as BPA when we clearly need help in other areas so much more? I have always advocated BPA when it comes to the draft, but the more I think about it, we just don't have the luxury of taking BPA. We need help in some very important areas, and those may need to be reached for in order to address them. BPA would be more feasible if we had a third round pick, as that is another premium pick we could use to draft a hopeful starter (good one, Chilly). But with only two premium picks this year, I think we have to address two of our three biggest holes no matter what, leaving no room for a defensive lineman, or even a LB like Travis Lewis. The fact of the matter is, the only way we are going to be in contention any time soon is if we are quite lucky in player development. We need guys like Degreare, Erin Henderson, Loadholt, Chris Cook, Everson Griffin, rookie quarterback X, rookie offensive lineman/cornerback/safety Y, and our late round picks to all pan out if we want to contend anytime soon.

I apologize for the lengthy, poorly organized, 1100+ word rant. But man, we are kind of ****** for the next 3 years. We just need to tighten our belts and face the fact we won't be contending for a Super Bowl for 4 or 5 years, if all goes well.
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Old 12-23-2010, 06:59 PM    (permalink
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Awesome post, you pretty much perfectly articulated my thoughts on this team. I would like to get away from the cover 2 for a few reasons. First off we have no qb and a stud running back and the cover 2 is most effective when you're playing with a decent lead. We have seen what happens when you're behind a few scores, the opponent's offense can pick up easy yardage and keep the clock ticking while moving down the field by attacking the soft spots of the cover 2. If we were a team like the Colts that could score very quickly and build up a lead it would be a great defense as the opponents will be playing catchup and that's when you unleash the pass rush on them and wreak havoc, see the Dallas playoff game as a perfect example of this.

So basically on defense we are built to protect a lead and on offense we have the personnel to pound the run but not necessarily score a ton of points. It doesn't really make much sense to me. We also have some big ass corn fed ************* on our offensive line that look like their only purpose in life is to maul the **** out of people. So how do we use them? We run a finesse ***** ass run block scheme and ask them to pass protect 30+ times a game. I mean seriously? Wtf.

I would love to see us grab a quarterback in the first round but I don't know how likely it is that we are able to do so. If we can't get one I would loooove to get Amukamura in the 1st and Deunta Williams in the second. This would start the rebuilding process of our secondary and we could add to it in the future via free agency and the draft. By building a strong secondary we could be a lot more aggressive up front with blitzes and stunts. We already have a great DT and DE so if we could toss in some blitzes without having to worry about getting raped over the top we could have a sick defense that could force turnovers. On offense we could take advantage of Adrian Peterson and pound the ball and find a solid quarterback that we won't have to rely on to throw for 4,000 yards, just move the ball a bit. All he would have to do is not **** up and make a few plays and use play action to his advantage.

Dunno if any of this makes sense. It's just one of the ideas I have on what I would if I ran the show. It's fun to play fantasy gm sometimes :D
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Old 12-23-2010, 07:03 PM    (permalink
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I would love to completely revamp the secondary, but I don't know if we can afford to ignore the offensive line. Maybe our line could be better with a better scheme, but our line just isn't good.
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Old 12-23-2010, 07:08 PM    (permalink
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I agree that the offensive line is lacking in talent, but using those guys in a zone blocking scheme is like putting a square peg in a round hole. I think if we switched to a more traditional run blocking scheme it would at least help out a little. There are a lot a of holes on this team and if whoever is in charge of fixing this mess ***** up early on it could be a long time until we are relevant again.
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Old 12-23-2010, 07:12 PM    (permalink
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I agree that the offensive line is lacking in talent, but using those guys in a zone blocking scheme is like putting a square peg in a round hole. I think if we switched to a more traditional run blocking scheme it would at least help out a little. There are a lot a of holes on this team and if whoever is in charge of fixing this mess ***** up early on it could be a long time until we are relevant again.
Truth. You are definitely right about the scheme. Also, with the league being more and more *****, I mean more passing friendly, the secondary is more important than ever. We need some talent back there. If we can't get a first round QB, I would be fine with Amukamara than Deunta, and then spending a late rounder on a developmental QB and bringing in a veteran. But if we can't get PP, Prince, or a top QB, I think reaching on an offensive lineman has to happen. I don't know if Brandon Harris is worth a top 15 pick, but he might be an X factor in this situation. How does Harris compare to Joe Haden in terms of level of a prospect?
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Old 12-23-2010, 07:24 PM    (permalink
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I'm not familiar with any of the corners that are ranked after PP and Prince. From what I have been hearing though Harris is leaning towards going back to school. If he does come out I think he could really help his stock during private workouts and the combine.
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Old 12-23-2010, 07:29 PM    (permalink
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Some good posts here, which brings me to something that I wanted to post the other day. Me and prock were the GMs of the Vikings in the forum mock, and here is what we did:

Draft Picks:
1st- #9 -- Ryan Mallett QB Arkansas
2nd- #44 -- Lee Ziemba OT Auburn
3rd- #78(f/OAK) -- DeAndre McDaniel S Clemson
5th- #140 -- Brandon Fusco OL Slippery Rock

Veterans:
Acquired Bob Sanders
Traded Bryant McKinnie

Trades:
Vikings send picks #12 and #108 to the Redskins for pick #9
Vikings send Bryant McKinnie and pick #148 to the Raiders for picks #78 and #142
Vikings send pick #142 to the Colts for Bob Sanders

I was very pleased with how this turned out. We got a franchise QB, yea we had to give up a fourth to do it, but the Skins might have taken him, and I know for a fact that the Titans would have took him if we didn't move up with the Skins. I like Ziemba a lot, especially if we're gonna be a power run team, which is what we planned on. McDaniel is my favorite (not #1) S in this draft, despite his bad Senior season, and we were very happy to get him with the 3rd we got for McKinnie (which we felt we had to take, just too much value for a pile of ****, especially with a guy who we feel can take over for him at LT). Fusco is a versatile guy who can play every position but LT, but played a lot of C at Slippery Rock, so yea there will be a bit of a transition period going from D2 to the NFL. Bob Sanders is very injury prone as we all know, but when he's on the field, he's an all pro caliber player, and was well worth the risk of a fifth round pick.

So what would you guys think of a draft like that?
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Old 12-23-2010, 07:40 PM    (permalink
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I'm not as down on McKinnie as a lot of other people are, I feel like at worst he is an average LT. So I don't see why we would dump him only to replace him with a rookie who could be a complete bust. I could see drafting a LT to eventually replace McKinnie but I don't like the move of getting rid of him before you know what you have in his replacement. I REALLY like McDaniel in the third, I think that is about where he should be drafted. He is a good tackler and had a ton of interceptions his junior year. I'm not that high on Mallett but I feel like he could develop into a solid quarterback, but i have concerns about his commitment and dedication to learning the position. He isn't asked to do much in Petrino's offense but he executes it perfectly and it's obvious all the physical tools are there, it's just a matter of the mental aspect with him. Can he read a defense? Can he handle adversity? Playing quarterback is about 20% physical and 80% mental/decision making. I don't know much about the tackle from Auburn but I have heard he is pretty solid and I think he has been a 4 year starter, I'll keep an eye on him during the NC game. I'm not really a Bob Sanders fan and I think he has a massive contract, although I could be wrong. I would much rather grab his teammate Bethea in FA if the price is right.
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Old 12-23-2010, 07:49 PM    (permalink
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I'm not as down on McKinnie as a lot of other people are, I feel like at worst he is an average LT. So I don't see why we would dump him only to replace him with a rookie who could be a complete bust. I could see drafting a LT to eventually replace McKinnie but I don't like the move of getting rid of him before you know what you have in his replacement. I REALLY like McDaniel in the third, I think that is about where he should be drafted. He is a good tackler and had a ton of interceptions his junior year. I'm not that high on Mallett but I feel like he could develop into a solid quarterback, but i have concerns about his commitment and dedication to learning the position. He isn't asked to do much in Petrino's offense but he executes it perfectly and it's obvious all the physical tools are there, it's just a matter of the mental aspect with him. Can he read a defense? Can he handle adversity? Playing quarterback is about 20% physical and 80% mental/decision making. I don't know much about the tackle from Auburn but I have heard he is pretty solid and I think he has been a 4 year starter, I'll keep an eye on him during the NC games. I'm not really a Bob Sanders fan and I think he has a massive contract, although I could be wrong. I would much rather grab his teammate Bethea in FA if the price is right.
Alright, I definitely understand that. Both of us have just gotten so sick of McKinnie this year, and I can't really even say that I'd consider him average at anything, definitely not pass blocking, and if I'm gonna start a rookie QB, I don't want him to be the one protecting him. Ziemba has been a our year starter at LT and the fact that it's been in the SEC will help the transition along very well. The biggest knock on him is that he's got short arms, and his feet may not be that quick, but I figured that with a power run scheme that both of those would be very minimal problems. I've been so impressed with how he's played that I was comfortable with taking the deal for McKinnie, which everyone said was a steal, but I do have to say that I did have some concerne about taking McKinnie out and plugging in an unproven rookie. I would have rather had a guy that I can trust to be healthier, and maybe at a better price (IDK what Sanders contract is like) as a FA too, but we didn't do a FA in this at all, it was just draft and trades; you could consider any of your team's FA as resigned or not.
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Old 12-23-2010, 10:07 PM    (permalink
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I'd love to maybe draft Prince or get Patrick Peterson in the first. Then a good safety in the second. Also, we could pick up a seasoned vet in free agency to lead the secondary. tbh, I don't think there are many issues with the front 7. I know, Pat Williams is going to retire, and Edwards is more than likely going to leave, but it seems like with a rotation of guys at UT, and NT, it seems like we'd be just fine. I'm pretty sure that's what Frazier has been doing since he took over to keep the big guys fresh. Jimmy Kennedy has shown me a lot. Def a keeper.

The offensive line...Meh. We have to keep in mind, that we are down two starters this year. Or O-line consists of 1 rookie, and 1 career back up. John Sullivan is iffy, but we could always pick up a guy like Matt Birk in the later rounds. I would really like to see if our Oline got better when our starters were healthy again.

The QB is probably the biggest and my least favorite issue to think about. I'm so afraid of a guy like Mallett being like Jamarcus Russell, but then I think about how awesome it would be for him to turn out like Peyton Manning. Jake Locker and Andrew Luck both have potential to bust just like Joey Harrington did.

I have a feeling if Gruden becomes our coach, he'll pick up 30 ****** QB's and pick which one he likes best and name him starter. i mean, if he can win with that QB, fine, but if he can't, he'll be out of Minnesota again in a heart beat. John Fox intrigues me, he's been a good coach, but at the same time, he's never really had an amazing season with the Panthers aside from the one when he took them to the SB.

The stadium issue just pisses me off...and I'm not even a citizen of Minnestoa.
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