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Old 12-06-2010, 09:04 PM    (permalink
BeerBaron
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I don't necessarily agree with that. The Jets make it work. You just have to be able to evaluate players no mater what position they are.
They need more time as well. Iupati has shown flashes of being an animal, he just needs some seasoning. As for Davis...well he doesn't have to play Chris Long every week....that's a plus.
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Old 12-06-2010, 09:07 PM    (permalink
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I don't necessarily agree with that. The Jets make it work. You just have to be able to evaluate players no mater what position they are.
The Jets drafted the best LT prospect in the draft and then took a great center prospect late in the first round. The rest of their line are journeymen and later round picks. That's quite different from what the 49ers have done.
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Old 12-06-2010, 09:11 PM    (permalink
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The Steelers might give the Bears and Texans a run for their money. Pouncey probably puts them at 30 though.
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Old 12-06-2010, 09:13 PM    (permalink
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The Chiefs system hides their flaws, I'm not saying they are not a good line they are but I would not put them top 5 by any means.
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Old 12-06-2010, 09:16 PM    (permalink
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The Jets drafted the best LT prospect in the draft and then took a great center prospect late in the first round. The rest of their line are journeymen and later round picks. That's quite different from what the 49ers have done.
Woody was a first rounder. Even though he wasn't drafted by the Jets, he's been good wherever he's been as far as I know. 3 of their starters on the line were drafted in the first: 4th, about 30th, and about 19th (not gonna look it up). San Fran drafted Staley 29th, Iuapati 17th, and Davis 11th.

I get that when your favorite team does something well, it's easy to think, "This is how you do it" but there are plenty of ways to build a team and to build an offensive line.
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Old 12-06-2010, 09:18 PM    (permalink
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They need more time as well. Iupati has shown flashes of being an animal, he just needs some seasoning. As for Davis...well he doesn't have to play Chris Long every week....that's a plus.
Iupati will be a beast, not sure about Anthony Davis though. They are a good run blocking unit but they can't pass protect very well. Pretty typical with a young line. IIRC their RT is pretty good too, at least above average, and young so I would expect them to sniff the top 5 in a few years.
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Old 12-06-2010, 09:19 PM    (permalink
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David Stewart and Michael Roos are still top tackles, but are having down years for their standards. Our interior o-line doesn't even look like it has a NFL quality starter in it. LeRoy Harris can't handle LBers, Eugene Amano can't hold a block to save his life and Jake Scott looks like he is the twilight years of his career.
This. The bookend OT's are great, but the inside is an abortion. Eugene Amano gets blown back 3 yards every play, Harris looks lost at times, and Jake Scott is nothing but average.

I think a stud C would fix things dramatically. It would certainly help Harris.
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Old 12-06-2010, 09:23 PM    (permalink
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I get that when your favorite team does something well, it's easy to think, "This is how you do it" but there are plenty of ways to build a team and to build an offensive line.
That's hardly where I'm coming from. I've been saying this even when the Chiefs oline was trash, you don't need to invest a ton of high draft picks to build an oline. RTs and Gs don't need to be taken in the first round, not unless you're already a really talented team that can afford luxury picks.

And Woody was a journeyman free agent, the Jets invested no draft picks in him. Which is only reinforces my point.
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Old 12-06-2010, 09:25 PM    (permalink
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I'd say zone blocking or at least some aspects of it are essential in todays NFL. Without it, your team is going to get eaten up by stunts, linebackers moving around, DB blitzes, etc. I can't imagine trying to block some of the defensive formations I've seen in the last few years with only 1 down lineman and 5 linebackers. Plus lines that are built for zone tend to be better in pass protection and that's what is driving NFL teams these days.
Thanks for this post. Very informative, sir.
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Old 12-06-2010, 09:33 PM    (permalink
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Every offensive line looks like it sucks because most teams pass the ball too damn much. The Bears have looked passable for the past month because there's been some actual balance and DE's aren't pinning their ears back every play.

As far as I can tell, the best o-lines are the Ravens, Jets, Browns, Jaguars, Falcons, Pats roughly in that order.
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Old 12-06-2010, 09:55 PM    (permalink
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I think the Bears can safely claim the worst, though Redskins are also pretty damn woeful.

Vikings are pretty middle of the pack, comfortably in the bottom 10 for pass protection but probably in the top 15 for run blocking.

Titan's line hasn't been nearly as good as in years past but is still pretty solid when I've seen it. Ravens are solid but again, not as good as last year. Patriots are doing a good job but a lot of that is the QB. Chiefs have been good. Jets are also strong but again not as good as last year for mine.

Something I notice with a lot of the top OLs is that they come from run heavy teams or at worst fairly well balanced teams. The teams where the lines have struggled are pass heavy. Not a coincidence, run blocking assignments are far easier, run blocking itself is easier. Passing stupid amounts puts the OL at a serious disadvantage.
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Old 12-06-2010, 09:56 PM    (permalink
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Wrong thread...
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Old 12-06-2010, 10:34 PM    (permalink
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Falcons should be in the top 3 of everybody's list. A bunch of no name guys just outdoing everybody infront of them in every aspect. Matt Ryan's emergence goes hand in hand with their emergence.
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Old 12-06-2010, 10:40 PM    (permalink
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http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol

Advanced Stats are trying to give a empirical rank but you really need to watch games to be sure.
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Old 12-06-2010, 10:51 PM    (permalink
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Every offensive line looks like it sucks because most teams pass the ball too damn much. The Bears have looked passable for the past month because there's been some actual balance and DE's aren't pinning their ears back every play.
Um, no. Cutler is still getting pressured, hit, and sacked left and right. You think it looks passable because 9 sacks in a half has distorted reality for you.
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Old 12-06-2010, 10:55 PM    (permalink
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That's hardly where I'm coming from. I've been saying this even when the Chiefs oline was trash, you don't need to invest a ton of high draft picks to build an oline. RTs and Gs don't need to be taken in the first round, not unless you're already a really talented team that can afford luxury picks.

And Woody was a journeyman free agent, the Jets invested no draft picks in him. Which is only reinforces my point.
The Jets may not have invested any draft picks in Woody, but they did invest 25 million in him, so I'm not sure you can really call him a "journeyman".

As for not drafting offensive linemen high, the Jets drafted a left tackle and a center in the first round. I STILL think one of the biggest draft blunders this decade by the Jets was to not keep going in that direction.

Marcus McNeil was right there in the second round, taken directly after Kellen Clemens.

Then again, I will admit I was enamored with that OL draft that year.

Just the same, if your offensive line is swiss cheese, I don't see a problem taking an elite guard prospect or a right tackle in the first round. Just not in the top ten.
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Old 12-06-2010, 10:55 PM    (permalink
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http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol

Advanced Stats are trying to give a empirical rank but you really need to watch games to be sure.
Chicago 29th run blocking and 32nd in pass blocking? Woo-hoo! Go Bears!
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Old 12-06-2010, 10:57 PM    (permalink
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http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol

Advanced Stats are trying to give a empirical rank but you really need to watch games to be sure.
supports what i've seen myself from tennessee's offensive line this year, better pass blocking than run blocking, mostly because of the bookend tackles, and even the pass blocking is probably (haven't checked this) lower than it has been in previous years because even the two aforementioned tackles are having down years for their standards.

the interior of this line is a ****ing trainwreck, and you don't have to be very knowledgeable about oline play to see that, clear as day. our two starting guards look average on their best days, and eugene amano is one of the worst centers in the league, easily.
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Old 12-06-2010, 11:02 PM    (permalink
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The Chiefs have a solid line this year but probably aren't as good as the stats indicate.

We absolutely need a future C (I would eat a small baby to have a prospect like Pouncey in KC) and our RT situation hasn't been great. We did just draft Asamoah who is going to fill in when Waters calls it quits, so we're good there, but it could definitely be improved.
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Old 12-06-2010, 11:08 PM    (permalink
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The Chiefs have a solid line this year but probably aren't as good as the stats indicate.

We absolutely need a future C (I would eat a small baby to have a prospect like Pouncey in KC) and our RT situation hasn't been great. We did just draft Asamoah who is going to fill in when Waters calls it quits, so we're good there, but it could definitely be improved.
That's how I feel about the Jags. Monroe's turning into a nice player and Manuwai is finally getting back into form after tearing his ACL a couple years ago.

We could definitely use an upgrade over Meester, though. And the jury is still out on Eben Britton, I'm not sure if he's better suited for tackle or guard.
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Old 12-07-2010, 12:00 AM    (permalink
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The Outsiders Stats pretty much back up what I said, so good by them!

Also... it would seem that Hutch is having a better season than I give him credit for based on those stats. That is about the only anomaly that I see compared to what I've watched.
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Old 12-07-2010, 12:02 AM    (permalink
OzTitan
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Originally Posted by DoughBoy View Post
Titans o-line should be nowhere near the top 5, let alone number 1.
Yeah, NFI what that's about. Pass blocking is ok, but run blocking is just bad.
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Old 12-07-2010, 12:13 AM    (permalink
wordofi
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Originally Posted by TheFinisher View Post
Obviously the Cowboys and how they were built is quite simple, just ignore drafting OL in the top 2 rounds for an entire decade.
They drafted Gurode in the second round back in 2002.
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Old 12-07-2010, 01:19 AM    (permalink
Crickett
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Originally Posted by wordofi View Post
They drafted Gurode in the second round back in 2002.
And Al Johnson in 2003. I'm not sure why given that they were both centers.
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Old 12-07-2010, 01:44 AM    (permalink
ESVAburnout
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ESVAburnout is so wise,  like a miniature Buddha covered with hairESVAburnout is so wise,  like a miniature Buddha covered with hairESVAburnout is so wise,  like a miniature Buddha covered with hairESVAburnout is so wise,  like a miniature Buddha covered with hairESVAburnout is so wise,  like a miniature Buddha covered with hairESVAburnout is so wise,  like a miniature Buddha covered with hairESVAburnout is so wise,  like a miniature Buddha covered with hairESVAburnout is so wise,  like a miniature Buddha covered with hairESVAburnout is so wise,  like a miniature Buddha covered with hairESVAburnout is so wise,  like a miniature Buddha covered with hairESVAburnout is so wise,  like a miniature Buddha covered with hair
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Originally Posted by ViperVisor View Post
http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol

Advanced Stats are trying to give a empirical rank but you really need to watch games to be sure.
I think you're obsessed with that girl in you sig/ava.
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