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Old 03-21-2007, 09:40 AM    (permalink
DeathbyStat
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Default Willis+Woodley=Great Draft Combo

Could we potentally take Willis in the first and Woodley in the second?
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Old 03-21-2007, 10:18 AM    (permalink
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willis ran in the upper 4.3's at his pro day...

pretty damn amazing, though it'll be adjusted, still a 4.4

having said that, im not quite sure he'd be a great fit in the 3 - 4 at ilb, i havnt seen much of him on film, but what i have seen is that he isnt a great shed the block and thump guy, which is what you need for the 3 - 4

he is a hell ofa athlete though, i wish i could see more video of him that proves me wrong
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Old 03-21-2007, 11:00 AM    (permalink
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He think willis could speed rush off the edge if one of our 3-4 ends held the block fo him.
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Old 03-21-2007, 11:12 AM    (permalink
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whos he, tomlin?

he may be able to play OLB in the 3 - 4, that would be one hell ofa speed rush off the edge, though he doesnt really have the ideal height you look for
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Old 03-21-2007, 11:48 AM    (permalink
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Willis might actually work out longterm but I don't see Woodley at all. He's too small for both end and olb in the nfl, and I don't think he has coverage skills at all.
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Old 03-21-2007, 12:57 PM    (permalink
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Willis might actually work out longterm but I don't see Woodley at all. He's too small for both end and olb in the nfl, and I don't think he has coverage skills at all.
his coverage skills yeah but he isnt too small for olb
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Old 03-21-2007, 01:08 PM    (permalink
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He's not very fluid in the hips either. He's best suited as a DE, even though he is a bit undersized.
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Old 03-21-2007, 02:32 PM    (permalink
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whos he, tomlin?

he may be able to play OLB in the 3 - 4, that would be one hell ofa speed rush off the edge, though he doesnt really have the ideal height you look for
Sorry I meant I think not he thinks
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Old 03-21-2007, 02:34 PM    (permalink
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Scouts are saying that their impressed with his change of direction while running.
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Old 03-21-2007, 02:49 PM    (permalink
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ive always liked woodley and his motor, if we think he can play OLB then im all for it
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Old 03-21-2007, 08:48 PM    (permalink
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Default Lamarr Woodley on Steelers Radar

I don' t have a subscription, but Jim Wexell says that the Steelers are keenly interested in Lamarr Woodley from Michigan as an OLB in the 3-4 and his pro-day last week sold them even further.

http://story.scout.com/a.z?s=68&p=2&...%2f628466.html

is anyone a member to this site?

Basically says the Pro-day has sold Tomlin and Colbert on Woodley after reviewing his game tape.
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Old 03-22-2007, 09:31 AM    (permalink
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I am a huge Michigan fan, so: Please for the love of God do NOT draft Woodley!!!!!!!! If Tomlin and Colbert are sold after watching his game tape, they clearly didn't watch the OSU and USC games. Were Woodley disappeared. Yes, Woodley is a good guy. Yes, Woodley gives great effort. Yes, Woodley has heart. All of which are fine. But he is to small 6-1 and about 260 to play DE, he doesn't have the qucikness to play OLB. He was moved to DE at Michigan, because he doesn't cover well. There are better options out there than Woodley. Both at DE and OLB.
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Old 03-22-2007, 09:54 AM    (permalink
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all my objections against woodley are the same ones I had against another UM player, Larry foote. Not big or fast enough for the NFL level. The first couple years I thought the steelers were wasting a roster spot by keeping him. Last year I thought Foote was our defensive MVP! So although I am not high on Woodley, who knows?
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Old 03-22-2007, 12:41 PM    (permalink
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I am a huge Michigan fan, so: Please for the love of God do NOT draft Woodley!!!!!!!! If Tomlin and Colbert are sold after watching his game tape, they clearly didn't watch the OSU and USC games. Were Woodley disappeared. Yes, Woodley is a good guy. Yes, Woodley gives great effort. Yes, Woodley has heart. All of which are fine. But he is to small 6-1 and about 260 to play DE, he doesn't have the qucikness to play OLB. He was moved to DE at Michigan, because he doesn't cover well. There are better options out there than Woodley. Both at DE and OLB.
Woodley's timed speed compares favorably with every other DE/OLB tweener in the draft. His timed speed and stats compare very favorably with Shawn Merriman at the combine and at Maryland. The 3/4 OLB is more of a Rush Backer position and does not require great cover skills, and he has time to develop those he does need.
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Old 03-22-2007, 08:02 PM    (permalink
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Woodley has good timed speed. he does not change directions well at all. He doesn't have much in the way of moves. Woodley doesn't need to agin weight to play OLB. He should lose weight. But he simply is not quick enough. But at 6-1 gaining weight to play DE does work well either.
One of the mistakes we have made is getting rid of the OLB that is better at coverage. haggans is our rush LB. He isn't very good in coverage either. If we are sticking with the 3-4 Woodley will not have time to develop. He will ahve to play right away. This just isn't a good option.
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Old 03-23-2007, 12:21 AM    (permalink
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Woodley has good timed speed. he does not change directions well at all. He doesn't have much in the way of moves. Woodley doesn't need to agin weight to play OLB. He should lose weight. But he simply is not quick enough. But at 6-1 gaining weight to play DE does work well either.
One of the mistakes we have made is getting rid of the OLB that is better at coverage. haggans is our rush LB. He isn't very good in coverage either. If we are sticking with the 3-4 Woodley will not have time to develop. He will ahve to play right away. This just isn't a good option.
Well of course your entitled to your opinion, but I disagree with you whole heartedly.
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Old 03-23-2007, 10:24 AM    (permalink
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deleted. Not my teams forum, not my place to say anything. Sorry for taking up the space.
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Old 03-23-2007, 11:57 AM    (permalink
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deleted. Not my teams forum, not my place to say anything. Sorry for taking up the space.
well if you know a lot about him go ahead and tell us what you think, judging by your sig you are obviusly a michigan fan so you probably have seen a lot more of him then us

as long as what you say isnt "omg omg woodley is the bestest ever"
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Old 03-23-2007, 12:06 PM    (permalink
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Woodley has good timed speed. he does not change directions well at all. He doesn't have much in the way of moves. Woodley doesn't need to agin weight to play OLB. He should lose weight. But he simply is not quick enough. But at 6-1 gaining weight to play DE does work well either.
One of the mistakes we have made is getting rid of the OLB that is better at coverage. haggans is our rush LB. He isn't very good in coverage either. If we are sticking with the 3-4 Woodley will not have time to develop. He will ahve to play right away. This just isn't a good option.
I agree. I'd like to see us hold off until day 2 to pick up OLB prospects.

I'd like to see Tim Shaw, and a guy like Brian Robison/Brian Smith/Jason Trusnik/Marques Murrell/Jacob Ford/Mike McFadden.

Shaw can do coverage, play ILB/OLB in either 3-4/4-3 alignments.

Robison (Or other guys) can learn behind someone and come in on pass rushing situations and ST's.

I like Trusnik/Murrell and McFadden as UDFA's or 7th rounders.


I think Shaw, Robison as drafted, then sign Trusnik and McFadden... I think we'll work through camp and have an excellent young lb core in waiting.


Although I do want to sign almost all the guys from GVSU that are eligible..

Cullen Finnerty, QB
Ryan Fowler, WR
Mike McFadden, OLB
Derrick Jones, DE/OLB (6'4 272lbs 4.71 40')
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Old 03-24-2007, 03:11 PM    (permalink
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well if you know a lot about him go ahead and tell us what you think, judging by your sig you are obviusly a michigan fan so you probably have seen a lot more of him then us

as long as what you say isnt "omg omg woodley is the bestest ever"
OMG, WOODLEY IS TEH ROXXORZ!!! No just kidding. Seriously though, I'll give you my impression of Woodley, and I'll try to reference it to the post that said please don't take Woodley.

First off, Michigan really only went back to a 4-3 defense this year, so of course Woodley would be moved back to DE. Clearly he's not a 4-3 OLB, but the move back to DE had almost nothing to do with his inability at the position, and almost everything to do with the change in defensive philosophy brought in by Ron English IMO.

As far as disappearing in the OSU and USC games, he did have 4 tackles in the OSU game, and he was getting pressure, Smith was just getting the ball out of his hand because the secondary was having problems with OSU's speed. But I'll admit that he really had no impact in that game. As far as USC, he had 3 tackles and a sack. Not great, but not terrible either. And considering that was Michigan's ONLY sack in that game, I don't think it's completely awful.

And really, if you're looking at him as an 3-4 OLB, you have to look at him in that situation. He played OLB in '04 and '05.

'04 numbers at OLB
11 games played, 70 tackles, 16 TFL, 4 sacks, 4 pass break ups, 3 forced fumbles.

And let's not forget the '04 Rose Bowl against Texas when he had 11 tackles and 4 tackles for loss.

'05 numbers at OLB
9 games played(slight injury), 48 tackles, 12 TFL, 5 sacks, 1 pass break up, 1 fumble recovery and 3 more forced fumbles.

So in 2 season as an 3-4 OLB, he averaged 59 tackles, 14 TFL, 4.5 sacks, 2.5 PBU's, and 3 forced fumbles. I don't think that's too terrible honestly. In fact I always thought he was a better OLB than DE.

And let's not forget, Woodley has basically played a different position all 4 years at Michigan(he actually played the rush backer position in '05) so he hasn't really had the chance to learn the ins and outs of any position. He just makes plays on instinct right now. If he actually got a set position and was able to get some coaching on that position, I think he could be an absolute monster. And I would also think his willingness to play a different position evey year shows what type of player and teammate he is.

That's obviously my personal opinion on him, and I am certainly not trying to say he has no flaws. He is pretty weak in coverage at this point. Sometimes he struggles to read the play. He has decent speed for his size, but he's not going to blow you away. I think his change of direction is better than he's been given credit for, but I agree that it's not exactly "elite"

So anyway, take all of that for what it's worth. Just my opinion.
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Old 03-24-2007, 03:35 PM    (permalink
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OMG, WOODLEY IS TEH ROXXORZ!!! No just kidding. Seriously though, I'll give you my impression of Woodley, and I'll try to reference it to the post that said please don't take Woodley.

First off, Michigan really only went back to a 4-3 defense this year, so of course Woodley would be moved back to DE. Clearly he's not a 4-3 OLB, but the move back to DE had almost nothing to do with his inability at the position, and almost everything to do with the change in defensive philosophy brought in by Ron English IMO.

As far as disappearing in the OSU and USC games, he did have 4 tackles in the OSU game, and he was getting pressure, Smith was just getting the ball out of his hand because the secondary was having problems with OSU's speed. But I'll admit that he really had no impact in that game. As far as USC, he had 3 tackles and a sack. Not great, but not terrible either. And considering that was Michigan's ONLY sack in that game, I don't think it's completely awful.

And really, if you're looking at him as an 3-4 OLB, you have to look at him in that situation. He played OLB in '04 and '05.

'04 numbers at OLB
11 games played, 70 tackles, 16 TFL, 4 sacks, 4 pass break ups, 3 forced fumbles.

And let's not forget the '04 Rose Bowl against Texas when he had 11 tackles and 4 tackles for loss.

'05 numbers at OLB
9 games played(slight injury), 48 tackles, 12 TFL, 5 sacks, 1 pass break up, 1 fumble recovery and 3 more forced fumbles.

So in 2 season as an 3-4 OLB, he averaged 59 tackles, 14 TFL, 4.5 sacks, 2.5 PBU's, and 3 forced fumbles. I don't think that's too terrible honestly. In fact I always thought he was a better OLB than DE.

And let's not forget, Woodley has basically played a different position all 4 years at Michigan(he actually played the rush backer position in '05) so he hasn't really had the chance to learn the ins and outs of any position. He just makes plays on instinct right now. If he actually got a set position and was able to get some coaching on that position, I think he could be an absolute monster. And I would also think his willingness to play a different position evey year shows what type of player and teammate he is.

That's obviously my personal opinion on him, and I am certainly not trying to say he has no flaws. He is pretty weak in coverage at this point. Sometimes he struggles to read the play. He has decent speed for his size, but he's not going to blow you away. I think his change of direction is better than he's been given credit for, but I agree that it's not exactly "elite"

So anyway, take all of that for what it's worth. Just my opinion.
thats some good stuff and i appreciate the insight,

it seems like we are decently interested in woodley, and all in all i think his motor makes up for his less than ideal size, though what concerns me is his coverage abilities

if we grab him in the 3rd i would be happy with that
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Old 03-24-2007, 10:22 PM    (permalink
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I have heard scouts say he is actually a better pass rush in a stand up role in the 3-4. I also understand that he is not the best in coverage, neither is Shawn Merriman or many pure rush backers.
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Old 03-29-2007, 02:04 PM    (permalink
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Woodley played with his hand on the ground since his freshman year. Weither you call that a DE or OLB doesn't matter. He does not cover well. To compare him to a 3-4 LB, he is a less talented version of Haggans. He isn't as tall, nor is he as fast. I like the guy, but he is a classic example of a good college player that may not make it as a pro.
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Old 03-29-2007, 02:07 PM    (permalink
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Woodley is one of those classic great college players who doesn' do anything in the NFL. Hate to say it, but its true.
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Old 03-29-2007, 02:16 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by richdg View Post
Woodley played with his hand on the ground since his freshman year. Weither you call that a DE or OLB doesn't matter. He does not cover well. To compare him to a 3-4 LB, he is a less talented version of Haggans. He isn't as tall, nor is he as fast. I like the guy, but he is a classic example of a good college player that may not make it as a pro.
No, he was a true OLB in the 3-4 in '04 and a rush backer in the 3-4 in '05. He might have had his hand on the ground once in a while, moreso in '05(actually I would say most of the time in the '05 season) but he was a stand up LB. I'm not saying he'll be a superstar, I'm simply saying he has experience as a true OLB in the 3-4. Would he be better as a rush backer, like a Merriman Role, just let him get after the QB? Absolutely.
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