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Old 11-30-2011, 11:54 AM    (permalink
bigbluedefense
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To be fair, what is Coughlin supposed to say? If he criticizes his coaches, it's "anarchy in NY" and he gives the impression that he threw them under the bus.

And it's not like the players gave their all either. That was a very half ass effort on defense.

But I agree, it's time for a change.
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Old 11-30-2011, 12:53 PM    (permalink
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I don't know what the question was but don't put it on the players like that when a 5 year old would have had a better defensive gameplan.
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Old 11-30-2011, 12:58 PM    (permalink
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I honestly think it's Coughlin who wants Cover 2. All his coordinators outside of Spags were Cover 2 guys for us, and even in Jacksonville, Del Rio was a Cover 2 guy under him.
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Old 11-30-2011, 01:42 PM    (permalink
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I honestly think it's Coughlin who wants Cover 2. All his coordinators outside of Spags were Cover 2 guys for us, and even in Jacksonville, Del Rio was a Cover 2 guy under him.
I don't buy that. He's an offensive guy so I don't know why he would dictate scheme and also why would he let the one guy with no DC experience run the system of his choosing? It's a coincidence and when Coughlin first got here we had the personnel more suited for a Cover 2.
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Old 11-30-2011, 03:35 PM    (permalink
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I don't buy that. He's an offensive guy so I don't know why he would dictate scheme and also why would he let the one guy with no DC experience run the system of his choosing? It's a coincidence and when Coughlin first got here we had the personnel more suited for a Cover 2.
Yeah. I'm just a sad panda right now.

:(
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Old 11-30-2011, 03:49 PM    (permalink
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I'm so glad you all agree because I am fully prepared to come in here and straight up RANT about how sick I am of our coaching staff! I want EVERYONE GONE if we don't make it to round 2 of the playoffs!

Coughlin- Sorry buddy, you've had a nice long run, but too many 1st round exits and late season collapses.

Killdrive- God I hate this man, have for years! That PhD WR playbook needs to go. Plus, he's a *****, plain and simple. 3rd and 10+ yards to go, down 21-3...Draw play up the middle for no gain. Bro, you serious? You've gotta air it out there. We've got a big lead? Let's sit on it and let them get right back into this game by calling the same ****** plays over and over because you won't run up the score. When was our last blowout win?

Perry- Cover 2 sucks, 3rd down package with 3...that's right 3 down linemen and a soft zone sucks, we have one of the best DLs in the league and you put 3 of them out there to give up a first down on 3rd and 99.

ST coach- I don't even wanna know this piece of ****'s name, but get him out. Our special teams has sucked for years now.

Strength & Conditionig people- How is it that we're always injury plagued? These guys must suck at their jobs.

Brandon Jacobs- You've turned into a shell of yourself, you're now a Giant puss- bag who can't bulldoze people for ****, gives no effort and crys all day. Get the f*ck off my team!

DJ Ware- You're just bad bro, plain and simple. Gimme Bradshaw, Scott and Brown or a Rookie over AB, BJ, and Going No-Ware any day of the week.

Please Rams fire Spags! And Giants, sign him as our DC/HC in waiting and Grueden or Cowher as our HC till you feel Spags is ready. Thanks!
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Old 11-30-2011, 04:56 PM    (permalink
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I loved watching the Saints offense! Now that's a big boy offense. Now stall outs like we do since this system was created. You didn't see Jimmy G go left, and the ball go right.. You didn't see any WRs run the wrong routes. Not only that, the system is aggressive! I would LOVE to be part of a staff like that.

We don't care about your feelings, about sparing your ego. At the end of the day, we will score, and KEEP SCORING! So you better be prepared because I won't call off the hounds!

On top of that, i respect our offense, and that's why I called the fake FG. Not that I think we could make it, but because I don't respect your offense AND your defense. You can't run the ball, you can't pass protect, and you stall out a lot. That's your offense! Your D stinks! So I will call a fake FG because I know we can score all night when the chips are down!

And oh by the way, our defense may not be sick, but we fit our aggressive nature and will keep blitzing you! So be prepared to put on your big boy pads and fight us!

I love Payton's philosophy! GIVE ME THAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Non of that Bush league, 4 minute offense to kill the clock. Screw that! When we have the lead we are going to attack you! Plain and simple! YOU make the adjustment, not us!

If you don't like that style, then forfeit!


I love that aggressive nature on both sides of the ball for NO, but specifically on offense! They kill you with vertical stretches and a lot of horizontal concepts too! Just a pleasure to watch that offense work.

That's what I want! Even if we can't be as effective as them, give me that nature, style, and aggressive attitude!
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Old 11-30-2011, 05:28 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by OSUGiants17 View Post
I'm so glad you all agree because I am fully prepared to come in here and straight up RANT about how sick I am of our coaching staff! I want EVERYONE GONE if we don't make it to round 2 of the playoffs!

Coughlin- Sorry buddy, you've had a nice long run, but too many 1st round exits and late season collapses.

Killdrive- God I hate this man, have for years! That PhD WR playbook needs to go. Plus, he's a *****, plain and simple. 3rd and 10+ yards to go, down 21-3...Draw play up the middle for no gain. Bro, you serious? You've gotta air it out there. We've got a big lead? Let's sit on it and let them get right back into this game by calling the same ****** plays over and over because you won't run up the score. When was our last blowout win?

Perry- Cover 2 sucks, 3rd down package with 3...that's right 3 down linemen and a soft zone sucks, we have one of the best DLs in the league and you put 3 of them out there to give up a first down on 3rd and 99.

ST coach- I don't even wanna know this piece of ****'s name, but get him out. Our special teams has sucked for years now.

Strength & Conditionig people- How is it that we're always injury plagued? These guys must suck at their jobs.

Brandon Jacobs- You've turned into a shell of yourself, you're now a Giant puss- bag who can't bulldoze people for ****, gives no effort and crys all day. Get the f*ck off my team!

DJ Ware- You're just bad bro, plain and simple. Gimme Bradshaw, Scott and Brown or a Rookie over AB, BJ, and Going No-Ware any day of the week.

Please Rams fire Spags! And Giants, sign him as our DC/HC in waiting and Grueden or Cowher as our HC till you feel Spags is ready. Thanks!
Can't say I feel differently. Insanity is defined as changing nothing and expecting a different result. We continue to run cover 2, we continue to draft middle round LB's and get minor FA's, we continue to roll with lackluster coaches, and we continually overlook OL and RB. We haven't went out and gotten a stalwart on the OL in quite a while and we've known that Diehl, Snee, and McKenzie wouldn't hold up forever.

We all know that Reese has an eye for talent, but he's one of a few of our staff that doesn't have their heads up their asses. We have the receivers, we have the QB, we have the defense besides the linebackers. Find a way to renovate the OL, get another RB, and get a few LB's. Also make it a priority to stretch, lift, and eat well; its a long season and a battle of fruition. Those few pieces will make a huge difference in being only a 1st half team and a team ready for a playoff run.
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Old 11-30-2011, 05:42 PM    (permalink
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I loved watching the Saints offense! Now that's a big boy offense. Now stall outs like we do since this system was created. You didn't see Jimmy G go left, and the ball go right.. You didn't see any WRs run the wrong routes. Not only that, the system is aggressive! I would LOVE to be part of a staff like that.

We don't care about your feelings, about sparing your ego. At the end of the day, we will score, and KEEP SCORING! So you better be prepared because I won't call off the hounds!

On top of that, i respect our offense, and that's why I called the fake FG. Not that I think we could make it, but because I don't respect your offense AND your defense. You can't run the ball, you can't pass protect, and you stall out a lot. That's your offense! Your D stinks! So I will call a fake FG because I know we can score all night when the chips are down!

And oh by the way, our defense may not be sick, but we fit our aggressive nature and will keep blitzing you! So be prepared to put on your big boy pads and fight us!

I love Payton's philosophy! GIVE ME THAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Non of that Bush league, 4 minute offense to kill the clock. Screw that! When we have the lead we are going to attack you! Plain and simple! YOU make the adjustment, not us!

If you don't like that style, then forfeit!


I love that aggressive nature on both sides of the ball for NO, but specifically on offense! They kill you with vertical stretches and a lot of horizontal concepts too! Just a pleasure to watch that offense work.

That's what I want! Even if we can't be as effective as them, give me that nature, style, and aggressive attitude!
It's very funny you brought this up because I was thinking the guy I possibly want the most right now is Carmicheal. With Eli and the weapons we have on offense there's no reason why we can't run a similar offense to them. I hate to waste Eli in his prime so maybe we should change Giants football up a little and let the offense carry the team. I was hoping to come here to post this so you'd get happy but we're on the same page here.
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Old 11-30-2011, 06:04 PM    (permalink
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It's very funny you brought this up because I was thinking the guy I possibly want the most right now is Carmicheal. With Eli and the weapons we have on offense there's no reason why we can't run a similar offense to them. I hate to waste Eli in his prime so maybe we should change Giants football up a little and let the offense carry the team. I was hoping to come here to post this so you'd get happy but we're on the same page here.
I would prefer a Defensive minded choach, but I was thinking the same thing. If we go the Offensive route I would love to have Carmichael.
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Old 11-30-2011, 06:16 PM    (permalink
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I would prefer a Defensive minded choach, but I was thinking the same thing. If we go the Offensive route I would love to have Carmichael.
Right now it boils down to this for me. Who is our most important player? Eli obviously so why don't we build the team around him. I know the Giants way is defense but you can't always let the past dictate the future. The Packers have also shown a cold weather team can still have an offensive juggernaut. We have the QB and the skill players so all we need to do is build the line back up a little.
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Old 11-30-2011, 07:21 PM    (permalink
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I would prefer a Defensive minded choach, but I was thinking the same thing. If we go the Offensive route I would love to have Carmichael.
Is he qualified? He never even called plays until Payton blew out his knee.
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Old 11-30-2011, 08:06 PM    (permalink
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Is he qualified? He never even called plays until Payton blew out his knee.
I've heard his name as a hot coaching candidate and while he may not call the plays I believe I've read he has a lot of influence on the game plan.
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Old 11-30-2011, 08:08 PM    (permalink
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Here's a good bio from the Saints site:

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Pete Carmichael Jr. is in his third season as the Saints’ offensive coordinator after tutoring the club’s quarterbacks the previous three years. Throughout this time he has been a key figure in the planning and preparations of an offensive attack that has been ranked first in the NFL in yardage in three of the last five seasons, while leading the league in scoring for the 2008 and 2009 campaigns.

In 2010, the Saints finished third in the NFC and sixth in the NFL after averaging 372.5 yards of total offense, while finishing third in the league in passing, averaging 277.6 net yards per game through the air. The unit converted a club record 48.8% of their third down conversions and finished second in the conference and fifth in the league with 351 first downs, the second-most in club record books.

In his first season with his new title, The Saints continued to compile impressive numbers on offense. The Saints finished in the top five in seven offensive categories and eight single season and single game team records were set or tied. They scored a club-record and NFL-best 510 points, the ninth-highest total in league record books. At least 45 points were scored four times, a fifth time in the postseason, with four straight outputs of at least 30. They ranked first in the league with 6,461 net yards, the second-best total in club history. The Saints’ 348 first downs was the second-best total both in 2009 league rankings and in team record books. The Saints also finished ranked sixth in the NFL in rushing yardage with 131.6 yards per game on a club-best 4.5 yards per carry, an improvement from 28th in 2008 and their highest ranking since 1987 when they were third with a 146.0 average.

The offense continued to flourish in the postseason, averaging 35.6 points per game and scoring eight-of-nine times inside the red zone. QB Drew Brees keyed the run, completing 70.6 percent of his passes and throwing eight touchdowns, tied for the fifth-highest postseason total in NFL history and a 117.0 passer rating.

He was selected MVP in Super Bowl XLIV, as he led the Saints back from a ten point deficit, completing 18 of his last 19 passes and engineering the fourth quarter game-winning drive, culminating in the go-ahead touchdown pass with under five minutes left.

In 2008, Carmichael’s title was quarterbacks/passing game – with duties that included assisting in the pass routes, protection schemes and quarterback responsibilities. He tutored the signal callers his first three seasons with the club. In 2008, the offense went on to rank No. 1 in the NFL in passing, and Brees threw for 5,069 yards – the second-highest total in league history and tossed a club-record 34 touchdowns.

Carmichael has worked closely with Brees since both arrived in New Orleans in 2006, and since then the majority of the franchise’s career, single-game and single-season passing records have fallen. Brees has led the NFL in passing yardage twice, set the NFL record for completion percentage (70.6-2009) and has thrown for a club record 155 touchdowns over the last five seasons.

Carmichael brings the perspective of having a wide range of coaching experiences, including working with nearly every position group on offense during his career. With the Chargers, he assisted wide receivers coach James Lofton for an offense that ranked 10th in the NFL in 2004 and 2005. Carmichael joined the Chargers in 2002 and served as offensive assistant/quality control until being promoted.

In 2001, Carmichael was quality control coach for the Washington Redskins, and in 2000, he was the tight ends and offensive assistant coach for the Cleveland Browns. From 1995-99, Carmichael was the quarterbacks coach at Louisiana Tech, and during his tenure the Bulldogs’ QBs broke almost every passing record at the school. He began his coaching career as the assistant offensive line coach at the University of New Hampshire in 1994, with the Wildcats winning the Yankee Conference championship.

Born Oct. 6, 1971 in Framingham, Mass., Carmichael attended Medway (Mass.) HS where he played football and baseball. He went on to a collegiate playing career in baseball and was a four-year letterman at Boston College. As a senior, Carmichael was a team captain and Most Valuable Player. He graduated with a degree in mathematics in 1994.
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Old 11-30-2011, 08:15 PM    (permalink
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I actually kinda like Ware...
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Old 12-01-2011, 07:42 AM    (permalink
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I want a defensive coach dammit. I'm tired of this coaching carousel on defense.

If you have a good qb, your offense will be good enough. But players can't carry a defense the way a qb can carry an offense. For that reason I rather have continuity on the defensive side of the ball.

Our offense will be fine as long as we have Eli. Our 2 best seasons of the past 5 years have been when we had a stallworth DC calling the defense. That's what we need.

As for our oline system, I have no problem with it. It's a good system, we just missed on Beatty, that's all. You win some, you lose some. If we get a LT, the rest of our oline is fine, it'll fill out nicely with Petrus at LG, Baas at C, Snee at RG, and Diehl at RT.

I do agree that we need some RBs. Preferably a guy who can catch, as we're going away from the run game and more towards a passing offense.

I want a TE too.
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Old 12-01-2011, 08:27 AM    (permalink
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Why should the offense be good enough though? I'd rather have at least one dominant side of the ball and I think the offense can be that. With the collection of defensive talent we have we'll be good enough on that side of the ball with a competent coordinator. You should build your team around your best player which is Eli.
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Old 12-01-2011, 01:29 PM    (permalink
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QB Eli Manning has become the fifth quarterback in history to record seven consecutive seasons with at least 3,000 yards and 20 touchdown passes. He joins his brother, Brett Favre, Dan Marino and Drew Brees in accomplishing the feat.

Congrats to Eli!
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Old 12-01-2011, 01:42 PM    (permalink
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Why should the offense be good enough though? I'd rather have at least one dominant side of the ball and I think the offense can be that. With the collection of defensive talent we have we'll be good enough on that side of the ball with a competent coordinator. You should build your team around your best player which is Eli.
Any time we get a good DC, he leaves and we're stuck with crap for a long while. First John Fox, now Steve Spagnuolo and a bunch of crap in btw. During this entire era btw Fox and Spags, the ONLY times we went to the SB were when we had that compentent DC we need.

It's harder finding a good DC than an OC. Bc quite honestly, a good qb can make up for a lot of crap the OC throws out there. Which Eli does. On the flip side, there isn't a player on the defensive side of the ball that can dominate and take over like that and make up for a crappy DC. That's why I rather lock up a defensive HC to bring consistency to that side and have Eli hold down the offense. That way we at least know we're set on both sides of the ball.

If we bring in an offensive guy, sure, our offense will get better. But we'll still have the same problems on defense that has plagued this team forever. We need a defensive guy.

We've had an offensive coach for the last 14+ years. It's time for a defensive guy.

And to counter your point, the Steelers, who are arguably the most successful franchise of the last 7 years, have built themselves around defense and letting the qb handle the offense. They are consistently good bc they have Ben carry the offense while their guru DC holds down the defense.

We need to follow that blue print. The Packers didn't win **** until they got Dom Capers to shore up the defense. The Saints didn't win until they got Greg Williams.

Lots of teams can score. Not everyone can stop you from scoring. That's where you need to find your coaches.
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Old 12-01-2011, 01:51 PM    (permalink
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Any time we get a good DC, he leaves and we're stuck with crap for a long while. First John Fox, now Steve Spagnuolo and a bunch of crap in btw. During this entire era btw Fox and Spags, the ONLY times we went to the SB were when we had that compentent DC we need.

It's harder finding a good DC than an OC. Bc quite honestly, a good qb can make up for a lot of crap the OC throws out there. Which Eli does. On the flip side, there isn't a player on the defensive side of the ball that can dominate and take over like that and make up for a crappy DC. That's why I rather lock up a defensive HC to bring consistency to that side and have Eli hold down the offense. That way we at least know we're set on both sides of the ball.

If we bring in an offensive guy, sure, our offense will get better. But we'll still have the same problems on defense that has plagued this team forever. We need a defensive guy.

We've had an offensive coach for the last 14+ years. It's time for a defensive guy.

And to counter your point, the Steelers, who are arguably the most successful franchise of the last 7 years, have built themselves around defense and letting the qb handle the offense. They are consistently good bc they have Ben carry the offense while their guru DC holds down the defense.

We need to follow that blue print. The Packers didn't win **** until they got Dom Capers to shore up the defense. The Saints didn't win until they got Greg Williams.

Lots of teams can score. Not everyone can stop you from scoring. That's where you need to find your coaches.
Eh I think Dom Capers was just lucky he got hired when Rodgers was coming into his own.

Also Ben is pretty f'ing dumb. It took him about 6 years to finally "control" that offense. He's had some pretty good offensive coaches there.

And it wasn't like Sean Payton had been there for 8+ years before he finally won because of Gregg Williams. They are good coordinators, him and Capers, but both were terrible head coaches outside of Capers first few years in Carolina.

There is more than one way to win in this league. However I think killer offense has proven to be an easier goal to obtain under the current rules these days.
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Old 12-01-2011, 02:10 PM    (permalink
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Eh I think Dom Capers was just lucky he got hired when Rodgers was coming into his own.

Also Ben is pretty f'ing dumb. It took him about 6 years to finally "control" that offense. He's had some pretty good offensive coaches there.

And it wasn't like Sean Payton had been there for 8+ years before he finally won because of Gregg Williams. They are good coordinators, him and Capers, but both were terrible head coaches outside of Capers first few years in Carolina.

There is more than one way to win in this league. I think killer offense has proven to be an easier goal to obtain under the current rules these days.
The Packers were a top 3 defense in the league last year. The Steelers were the #1 ranked defense the year they won. We won with great defense. 3 of the last 4 champs have won with top caliber defenses.

I still believe in building around defense. We need to get that identity back.
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Old 12-01-2011, 04:24 PM    (permalink
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Manningham to IR?
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In Reese We Trust
Word from the Giants is that Mario Manningham might need season ending surgery. He might have played his last snap as a Giant... If true, the Giants have to be close to double the NFL record of most players on IR in one season.

Posted on BBI. HAHA Damn injuries! This is nuts! If MM needs surgery, than I'd sadly let him go. We can always draft another WR or TE toy for Eli!
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Old 12-01-2011, 04:40 PM    (permalink
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Dream Offseason At The Moment:
- Keep Osi since we can't trade him since he got hurt!
- Trade Jacobs for a 4th or 5th
- Release Ware
- Fire TC, Killdrive, Perry and ST coach
- Hire Grueden, Spags and a OC and ST coach
- Sign Steve Smith, let Mario walk
- Publicly Execute Beckum
- Draft:
1. Kuechly
2. LaMichael James
3. AJ Jenkins
4. Orson Charles
4. Andrew Datko
5. BPA
6. BPA
7. BPA
New Offense:
RB- Bradshaw/Scott/James
WR- Nicks/Jenkins
Cruz/Barden
Slot- Smith/Jernigan
TE- Ballard/Charles on passing downs, Pascoe/Ballard on Running

Defense(With sexy blitz drawn up by Spags<3)
LB- Bolley-Kuechly-Kiwi
DT- Marvin Austin emerges!

Thoughts?
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Old 12-01-2011, 05:07 PM    (permalink
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Osi sprained his ankle it's not like he blew his knee out. Teams won't be scared away because of that. Also, no one is trading for Jacobs. No thanks to Gruden.
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Old 12-01-2011, 05:27 PM    (permalink
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Fewell has come out publically and said some of the players quit during the Saints game. A couple of days ago I said I had a good feeling about this game but I take that back. It's going to be a mess.
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