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Old 08-01-2013, 11:34 AM    (permalink
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Well DL has tons of depth this year. It all depends on how many guys we keep on the line this year. It's the reason I don't want 3 QB's on roster.


Oh I think year 1 you have to keep 3 QBs. If Eli goes down you want s veteran in year one not a rookie. I doubt anything happens to either QB. Not year 1 at least.
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Old 08-01-2013, 11:57 AM    (permalink
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It was a dumb year to take QB. You think if Eli goes down Carr would lead us to playoffs even with these weapons? Doubtful at best.
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Old 08-01-2013, 12:13 PM    (permalink
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It was a dumb year to take QB. You think if Eli goes down Carr would lead us to playoffs even with these weapons? Doubtful at best.
Well as a GM you can't stop trying, lol. Stop trying gets you fired like Bill Polian and his son in Indy. No more keeping utter garbage QBs after Peyton. Its not about playoffs then having a total melt down of 2-3 win season. IlThats what GMs have to guard against.

and drafts are different animals. If QB falls you go for it. Its not like you say this year isn't ghr right year and pass on talent. I'd hope and glad our GM and scouts wouldn't do that nonsense.
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Old 08-01-2013, 12:27 PM    (permalink
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Agreed but don't keep 3 QB's. Cut Carr it's as simple as that. Eli goes down then Nassib gets thrown in.
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Old 08-01-2013, 12:45 PM    (permalink
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Agreed but don't keep 3 QB's. Cut Carr it's as simple as that. Eli goes down then Nassib gets thrown in.


Well that's my point. If he isn't ready then what? He has rough learning curve based on the reports. He is throwing interceptions and missing on deep balls. You can't have him in the field when it counts. I'd we carried two and god for bit Eli got hit and a rookie was there. I'd fire Coughlin and Reese for that assinine move and lack of forthought. Thats a fireable offense. A rookie struggling in TC and yet they carried 2 QBs knowing this. If that happened we would win couple games , draft Clowney and fire Coughlin and Reese for allowing that idiotic scenario to happen because they failed when it came to roster management.
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Old 08-01-2013, 01:26 PM    (permalink
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I disagree that is a fireable offense. How many games does Carr win you over Nassib? 1 maybe 2? I couldn't care less if we had 6 wins instead of 4. If we don't get to the playoffs I'd like to have the worst record possible to get a better talent.
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Old 08-01-2013, 01:27 PM    (permalink
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It was a dumb year to take QB. You think if Eli goes down Carr would lead us to playoffs even with these weapons? Doubtful at best.
You can't look at it that way. The Giants had a much higher grade on Nassib than a 4th rounder and he was there, they took him. I think it was the right call bc Nassib is more talented than a typical 4th round qb. It was a situation where we kept failing with mid round qbs and we had a pretty talented one fall to our lap, we had to take him. There's no guarantee that a Nassib will be there in the 4th next year.

Now if it was me, I'd cut Carr and throw Nassib the backup job. But the Giants won't do that.
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Old 08-01-2013, 01:29 PM    (permalink
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You can't look at it that way. The Giants had a much higher grade on Nassib than a 4th rounder and he was there, they took him. I think it was the right call bc Nassib is more talented than a typical 4th round qb. It was a situation where we kept failing with mid round qbs and we had a pretty talented one fall to our lap, we had to take him. There's no guarantee that a Nassib will be there in the 4th next year.

Now if it was me, I'd cut Carr and throw Nassib the backup job. But the Giants won't do that.
This is basically my point. Since we took him which is fine then we need to drop Carr.
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Old 08-01-2013, 01:34 PM    (permalink
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This is basically my point. Since we took him which is fine then we need to drop Carr.
I want us to, but I doubt we do it. The Giants won't do Carr like that unless he absolutely bombs.

We just have to get rid of that one guy on the 53 that is there just bc. The Bardens/Jernigans of the world.

One of those guys has to go.
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Old 08-01-2013, 03:14 PM    (permalink
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Carr only helps us if Eli suffered a minor injury. A 2-3 week one. Depending on the opponents he maybe able to get us 1 or hopefully 2 wins. Any long term injury to Eli knocks us out of playoff contention or if we are in the playoffs, will get us eliminated.

I agree with GF, at that point, I'd prefer the better draft pick.
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Old 08-01-2013, 06:47 PM    (permalink
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I disagree that is a fireable offense. How many games does Carr win you over Nassib? 1 maybe 2? I couldn't care less if we had 6 wins instead of 4. If we don't get to the playoffs I'd like to have the worst record possible to get a better talent.
Polian and his son got the axe. This happened. We saw the effects of it. If you fail to plan when your franchise or starting QB goes down It's of course a fireable offense.

Probably more. I trust Carr way more than a rookie. Well I am sure as a fan losing season is a losing season, but GM's don't think that way. People in the business don't think that way. You want to put your team in the best possible position to win. Even it's a few more games.

As fans sure.. If you play video games, then same thing. Lose more, get a higher pick and great job. But people in the business don't think like that. Ah, well, season is done, losing is losing, so let's just lose big, and get a good pick, and try again next season.

I know for a fact most good franchises don't think that way. GM's who create the team don't think that way.

I agree with BBD that barden or those guys will get cut.
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Old 08-01-2013, 09:32 PM    (permalink
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It's not going to be that big of a deal. At the end of the day, the guy who makes the 53rd roster spot probably isn't going to amount to poo anyway so we'll be ok.

I prefer 2 qbs, but if we have to cut an extra guy for 1 year, it's ok. We several guys who can get cut to make room for another qb honestly.
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Old 08-02-2013, 08:44 AM    (permalink
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So Stevie Brown is playing FS for us and Rolle is playing SS huh? Interesting...

I don't really disagree with it. Rolle is much better in the box or as a nickel CB instead of a FS. He takes horrible angles and is always slow to react as a FS. Plus he's pretty abysmal in Cover 2. I rather have him in the box, playing man on a TE, blitzing, playing an underneath zone, or playing nickel CB. He's pretty good in those roles.

That puts more pressure on Stevie to step up though. We really should have taken a FS this year. It was a great FS draft class. Cyprien would have been a good pick. Even Swearinger in the 2nd or 3rd.
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Old 08-02-2013, 08:47 AM    (permalink
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Yeah I wanted to mention that yesterday and I think it's the right move. I know you're not a fan of Brown but in Fewell's system he's going to be good. I know he wont have the same type of year as last but I think he can do a good job in this system. S always do well in Fewell's system.
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Old 08-02-2013, 08:51 AM    (permalink
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I don't necessarily dislike Brown, I just think that his season last year was atypical. When I broke him down, I saw more bad than good, but a lot of it was masked by the turnovers. He was out of position a lot.

This year? Who knows. Maybe another year in the system helps him improve. I don't see any athletic issues for him. It was all mental mistakes. And technique mistakes. If he can clean that up he can be solid.

I'm just a firm believer that in today's NFL, especially now with the emergence of the read option, you need a stud FS. A good read option qb like RGIII will eat your single high looks for breakfast if that deep FS isn't doing his job back there.

There's more stress than ever before for your FS to have great range, and for your CBs on the outside to be able to tackle in the run game. Seattle has the ideal set up in the secondary. That's the blueprint to follow. Big physical CBs who can press and chase, and also tackle, and a FS who can cover the deep ball by himself.
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Old 08-02-2013, 09:32 AM    (permalink
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That's kind of what NE is looking to do also.
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Old 08-02-2013, 09:37 AM    (permalink
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Yeah pretty much. NE is quietly going to have a good defense this year. I like the talent they put together. It took them awhile, but they're a 5 tech away from being a very good defense again.
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Old 08-02-2013, 09:50 AM    (permalink
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Logan Ryan is going to ball so hard for them. I hate the term but I feel it's apt here. They just signed another Rutgers player this week also. It's insane how much he loves them.
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Old 08-02-2013, 09:54 AM    (permalink
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Ryan and Dennard are basically poor man versions of Sherman and Browner (at the moment bc they're unproven). McCourty could be their Earl Thomas. Wilson their Chancellor. Talib is another guy who fits the mold.

They basically copied Seattle's secondary. To be fair, what Seattle is doing up front with their front 7 is something that NE has been doing for the past 4 years so I guess this is a chicken or egg debate.
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Old 08-02-2013, 10:13 AM    (permalink
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Yup exactly how I thought about it when just comparing them before! Like you said if they find that 5 tech they'll be top 10 D once again.
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Old 08-02-2013, 10:50 AM    (permalink
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so Nicks has a groin issue. I am surprised by this. He is a player who rarely, rarely, ever gets hurt. LOL. But here is a question. If Nicks is ok or has an injury plagued year and RR has a stellar season, do we become a shrewd franchise and let him go and promote RR to X?

Do we even offer Nicks a deal especially if RR has that stellar season? Would you low ball Nicks this way you can tell your fan base you tried and offered him a deal but he said no?

I was thinking about this yesterday and posed that question on BBI.
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Old 08-02-2013, 11:00 AM    (permalink
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I think Nicks will be an injury liability his whole career. I can see the Giants offering him a team friendly deal that he turns down, and then we promote Randle to X.

Or we franchise him and keep him for one more year before promoting Randle to X.
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Old 08-02-2013, 11:07 AM    (permalink
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All depends on how much money Nicks is looking for. If it's more than the Giants value him at and Randle is coming off a good year then you could definitely say goodbye to Hakeem.
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Old 08-02-2013, 11:11 AM    (permalink
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I think Nicks will be an injury liability his whole career. I can see the Giants offering him a team friendly deal that he turns down, and then we promote Randle to X.

Or we franchise him and keep him for one more year before promoting Randle to X.
I mentioned that on BBI. I do believe people will be emotionally attached to Nicks and the thought of losing him will impede peoples thinking on the matter. I feel you and I have that logic in tact where we see the big picture. I think people will rather keep Nicks and then let RR go. If injuries are a nagging issue and the guy is only 25, then it's going to be worse as he gets older. Sometimes I forget how old he is because of it. His body is like a 27 or 28 year old player. But that hypothetical above for me is predicated only if RR has a breakout season.
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Old 08-02-2013, 11:14 AM    (permalink
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I don't necessarily dislike Brown, I just think that his season last year was atypical. When I broke him down, I saw more bad than good, but a lot of it was masked by the turnovers. He was out of position a lot.

This year? Who knows. Maybe another year in the system helps him improve. I don't see any athletic issues for him. It was all mental mistakes. And technique mistakes. If he can clean that up he can be solid.

I'm just a firm believer that in today's NFL, especially now with the emergence of the read option, you need a stud FS. A good read option qb like RGIII will eat your single high looks for breakfast if that deep FS isn't doing his job back there.

There's more stress than ever before for your FS to have great range, and for your CBs on the outside to be able to tackle in the run game. Seattle has the ideal set up in the secondary. That's the blueprint to follow. Big physical CBs who can press and chase, and also tackle, and a FS who can cover the deep ball by himself.
Ed Reed was Ed Reed. He had all-time great instincts and an elite physical tool box to break on balls he had no business getting to. He's not the same player today, but he was THE stud safety you're referring to.

Earl Thomas is Earl Thomas. For all the heat he takes, there's no safety in the league with better range. His range is what allows the Hawks' corners to do what they do.

That's one guy. I don't see another Earl Thomas in this league.

That's what separates the secondary. I just don't see the Giants, or really any team, finding another Earl Thomas any time soon. You have to do the best with what you have.

We can play cover 3 press and cover 1 press on every down because of him. Most teams can't.
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