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Old 09-11-2013, 10:56 AM    (permalink
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Loved the DL rotation. I think Tuck does still have some stuff left in the tank. Webster played well. I think that groin injury really hindered his game last year. Rolle was all over the place. Mundy looked pretty good. We tackled better. The LB's are the LB's but even Herzlich did play that Witten TD correctly. Thomas still tackles so well. This D has some potential possibly.

OL will get settled once Boothe goes back to LG and Baas plays at C. Pugh did a really good job.
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Old 09-11-2013, 11:01 AM    (permalink
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Loved the DL rotation. I think Tuck does still have some stuff left in the tank. Webster played well. I think that groin injury really hindered his game last year. Rolle was all over the place. Mundy looked pretty good. We tackled better. The LB's are the LB's but even Herzlich did play that Witten TD correctly. Thomas still tackles so well. This D has some potential possibly.

OL will get settled once Boothe goes back to LG and Baas plays at C. Pugh did a really good job.
We still need a pass rush and effective blitzes. Romo had all day. That is troubling because our system is predicated on a pass rush. Without it, that's a big kick in the balls.

D played well overall. Fewell should get some props his way. He needs a pass rush on sunday or else we are in deep trouble.
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Old 09-11-2013, 11:05 AM    (permalink
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I'm encouraged as well. We played like absolute crap and we still almost won at the end.

This offense can be deadly if we can block up front. We'll patch together the run game as best as we can, I'm not concerned about that. If it means 2 yards and a cloud of dust with Jacobs, so be it. At least it won't hinder the pass game. We can throw it on anyone as long as we can block up front.

And with the defense playing way better than I imagined, I'm cautiously optimistic.

As wrong as it sounds, even though Dallas beat us, they do not scare me. I didn't think they were very good. Washington is still our main threat for the division.
First, pass pro is very difficult for young out of college backs. RB is an easy position, mentally, by nature. RBs usually aren't the most intellectual players. They know how to run with the ball - away from or through defenders - the most basic of all skills.

So first, it's different because he has to think way more than he's used to. Then he has to adjust, then he has to make a split-second decision on who's coming and where. That's hard, especially when the game is SO MUCH faster than it was in college. And by being a hair late to the spot, you've lost position. Now you are out of position AND giving up 40-50 pounds against a heat-seeking missle. He's going full blast at you and you're just taking a few steps forward. It's insanely difficult physically to hold your ground and there's no wonder backs, who are almost all smaller than LBs, get blown up or beat. They're at a huge disadvantage.

And that doesn't even have to do with the various schemes against various fronts they need to learn. I came across a pro PB online and I was swimming when I got to pass pro.

Second, as a pseudo-Giant fan, Dallas scares the **** out of me. They look better on D, Murray's healthy, and the line looks good.

I think Philly and Dallas are the main comp.
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Old 09-11-2013, 11:22 AM    (permalink
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First, pass pro is very difficult for young out of college backs. RB is an easy position, mentally, by nature. RBs usually aren't the most intellectual players. They know how to run with the ball - away from or through defenders - the most basic of all skills.

So first, it's different because he has to think way more than he's used to. Then he has to adjust, then he has to make a split-second decision on who's coming and where. That's hard, especially when the game is SO MUCH faster than it was in college. And by being a hair late to the spot, you've lost position. Now you are out of position AND giving up 40-50 pounds against a heat-seeking missle. He's going full blast at you and you're just taking a few steps forward. It's insanely difficult physically to hold your ground and there's no wonder backs, who are almost all smaller than LBs, get blown up or beat. They're at a huge disadvantage.

And that doesn't even have to do with the various schemes against various fronts they need to learn. I came across a pro PB online and I was swimming when I got to pass pro.

Second, as a pseudo-Giant fan, Dallas scares the **** out of me. They look better on D, Murray's healthy, and the line looks good.

I think Philly and Dallas are the main comp.
Eh, Vick still blows and that defense is still not very good. They capitalized on a rusty RG3 to start the game, once he got his legs back he threw it all over them.

You can throw it on Dallas. Dallas will be in it til the end, but I gotta see it before I believe it out of Romo now. I'm done giving him the benefit of the doubt.

Once RG3 gets his legs back, Washington can score on anyone again, and their defense is opportunistic enough to win games with. They're still the main threat to me.

Barring injuries of course. Anything can happen that would change the landscape of the division.

I secretly root for Seattle as long as they don't interfere with the Giants too btw bc I love that defense and Russell Wilson. And they're my Madden team. Don't judge me.
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Old 09-11-2013, 12:36 PM    (permalink
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Honestly, no one in this division really scares me. I am the first one to admit when we have tough competition but I really am not scared. Dallas almost lost to us despite giving up an INSANE amount of turnovers. That does not bode well for them. Plus Murray is a walking injury and their safeties are terrible. As we saw, they can be very easily beat over the top. We win that game in a blow out if we can even limit ourselves to 2-3 turn overs. Credit to them for getting the turnovers but a lot of them were stupid and careless.

Eagles can clearly also be beat over the top. Same with the Redskins. Vick is a walking injury. RG III is on his second ACL surgery. I also wonder if RGIII will make that next step. They babied him SO much last year. He was getting huge gains of dink and dunking. Then when teams would key in on that he'd have one or two great throws. I don't think you will see that this year. Teams are going to stop the run and make him beat them deep.

I mean, we as team are also very flawed too, so that's not to just say all the teams in the division are worse than us. Really when you think about it though we're the only team with an elite and established QB (Romo is borderline) so I feel like that gives us a nice edge.
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Old 09-11-2013, 12:45 PM    (permalink
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RG3 will depend on his ability to run. There's a big misconception that the read option is dying bc they're not running for yards and that's patently false. The difference is teams are keying in on the run and taking it away, but that's the beauty of the option. Those option qbs are flinging it all over the field bc of the coverage shells.

Now if you take away RG3's ability to run, and now he's just a pocket passer and he's not as scary. Bc his threat of running is what dictates the fronts and coverages, and which is why he was so deadly last year throwing it as well as running it.

He did not look fast on Monday. I think it's going to take him some time to get his legs back as a runner.

Having that said, even as a traditional drop back qb he still made some good throws. RG3 is the real deal, he's gonna be a problem for awhile.
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Old 09-11-2013, 12:51 PM    (permalink
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If we are set on running screens I hope we use the one last season against the Packers, after the bye week. That play design was a thing of beauty. Bring back that play. I wanted to see more of that last season too, after we showed it. However, we never ran it again.
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Old 09-11-2013, 12:55 PM    (permalink
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We should just run WR screens and that's it. No more RB screens ever. They're all terrible bc Eli can't throw a screen pass to save his life and our RBs can't catch a screen pass to save their life and our OL can't block for a screen pass to save their lives.

It's just all around awful. If we can't figure it out since 2004 we can't do it. Just burn those plays off the playbook and pretend they never existed.
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Old 09-11-2013, 12:58 PM    (permalink
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We should just run WR screens and that's it. No more RB screens ever. They're all terrible bc Eli can't throw a screen pass to save his life and our RBs can't catch a screen pass to save their life and our OL can't block for a screen pass to save their lives.

It's just all around awful. If we can't figure it out since 2004 we can't do it. Just burn those plays off the playbook and pretend they never existed.
That's fair. However, when the play is designed well. We can run it very well. The screen we ran during the Packer game with Bradshaw last season worked out VERY well.

We aren't creative with our screens. That's an issue. Teams sniff it out and it's over. Eli has to end the play by throwing on the ground or the RB gets tackled quickly.

I don't know why we can't design it better. If we do that sure, we can execute it better.
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Old 09-11-2013, 01:01 PM    (permalink
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That's fair. However, when the play is designed well. We can run it very well. The screen we ran during the Packer game with Bradshaw last season worked out VERY well.

We aren't creative with our screens. That's an issue. Teams sniff it out and it's over. Eli has to end the play by throwing on the ground or the RB gets tackled quickly.

I don't know why we can't design it better. If we do that sure, we can execute it better.
It's not the design. The design is fine. It's the technique. A good screen pass is sold by the players. We do a terrible job of selling the screen. The OL doesn't sell it enough, and they do a terrible job of getting the right angles at the 2nd level. The RBs don't slide into the right holes, and Eli doesn't understand how to throw a touch pass to a RB.

It's all execution. The play design is perfectly fine.

Like anything else, and you know this as a coach, practice and repetition dictates success rate of plays. We don't practice it enough bc we rarely run screens. So the execution is awful.
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Old 09-11-2013, 01:06 PM    (permalink
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It's not the design. The design is fine. It's the technique. A good screen pass is sold by the players. We do a terrible job of selling the screen. The OL doesn't sell it enough, and they do a terrible job of getting the right angles at the 2nd level. The RBs don't slide into the right holes, and Eli doesn't understand how to throw a touch pass to a RB.

It's all execution. The play design is perfectly fine.

Like anything else, and you know this as a coach, practice and repetition dictates success rate of plays. We don't practice it enough bc we rarely run screens. So the execution is awful.


Design wasn't fine. It was average and those average designs get sniffed out more often than naught now since Hufangel was fired.

But another story.. wait for it.. wait for it.. Hope you're sitting down!

Paul Schwartz & #8207;@NYPost_Schwartz 3m
RB Da'Rel Scott went down today and was unable to finish practice. #nyg

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Da'Rel Scott got hurt during practice today, more coming in injury report #nyg
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Old 09-11-2013, 01:09 PM    (permalink
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So I guess now we have Wilson, Jacobs and Cox.

Can someone stay healthy and step up please? At this point all you do is laugh at this stupid stuff going on. Dude has a chance to make a play for the spot. He has been waiting for this chance. BOOM! He gets hurt. I hope he is fine because right now our RB situation is not good.
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Old 09-11-2013, 01:12 PM    (permalink
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What happened to Scott?

Edit: Oh he's fine.
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Old 09-11-2013, 01:15 PM    (permalink
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What happened to Scott?

Edit: Oh he's fine.
Not sure. Did they say he is fine? Let's hope so. Last year Cbs were an issue for us. Now the injury position seems to be the RB. I really hope he is fine and not an issue. We can't have Jacobs without playing a game in a year be the guy. I am worried he may pull something in Jacobs like fashion and be out.
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Old 09-11-2013, 01:38 PM    (permalink
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Patricia Traina ‏@Patricia_Traina now
Da'Rel Scott injured his knee in practice.
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Old 09-12-2013, 10:13 AM    (permalink
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RG3 will depend on his ability to run. There's a big misconception that the read option is dying bc they're not running for yards and that's patently false. The difference is teams are keying in on the run and taking it away, but that's the beauty of the option. Those option qbs are flinging it all over the field bc of the coverage shells.

Now if you take away RG3's ability to run, and now he's just a pocket passer and he's not as scary. Bc his threat of running is what dictates the fronts and coverages, and which is why he was so deadly last year throwing it as well as running it.

He did not look fast on Monday. I think it's going to take him some time to get his legs back as a runner.

Having that said, even as a traditional drop back qb he still made some good throws. RG3 is the real deal, he's gonna be a problem for awhile.
Yeah but...if the run-option is not successful then teams are not going to key in on it. That's kind of how these things work..

Like I said, teams will start leveling the QB and that will consistently stop teams from playing around with read options, even fakes.

I like RG III, but considering he played in one of the safest systems I have ever seen I am going to be interested to see how he handles having to throw the ball more down field. It was absurd how many little passes he threw last year turned into huge gains. There is no doubt he can throw the ball deep, it's just a matter of how well he can read the defense and his overall decision making. We really have not had a chance to see him make any tough decisions.
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Old 09-12-2013, 10:29 AM    (permalink
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Yeah but...if the run-option is not successful then teams are not going to key in on it. That's kind of how these things work..

Like I said, teams will start leveling the QB and that will consistently stop teams from playing around with read options, even fakes.

I like RG III, but considering he played in one of the safest systems I have ever seen I am going to be interested to see how he handles having to throw the ball more down field. It was absurd how many little passes he threw last year turned into huge gains. There is no doubt he can throw the ball deep, it's just a matter of how well he can read the defense and his overall decision making. We really have not had a chance to see him make any tough decisions.
You're not understanding what I'm trying to say. The run option is being taken away by accounting for an extra gap assigned to the qb. By doing that, yes, you can take away the run option, but you essentially make it much easier for the pass option so instead of seeing these quarterbacks run all over you, they're simply checking to the pass and throwing it all over you.

So you're not stoping the read option at all. All you did was change their success in the package from the run to the pass. You can stop one or the other, but stopping both is incredibly hard vs the read option unless you have a sick secondary like Seattle.

If teams now adjust by trying to stop the pass out of the read option these quarterbacks are just going to run all over you again.

And smashing the qb isn't nearly as simple as we like to believe. They see you coming from a mile away and can easily side step you.

There were a lot of great articles on the read option over the summer, one take home message that I got out of it is how the uncovered DE is supposed to attack it.

Basically, when they leave the backside DE unaccounted for, he can't just crash at the point. By doing that he makes the decision very easy for the qb. What he needs to do is use a right angle style of rush towards the qb. It's hard to explain without drawing it out.

But basically he has to go straight, and sit, and force the qb to delay his read, then crash the point. So create a right angle. The biggest detriment to the read option is forcing the qb to slow his read.

Now the big problem is the read option forces you to use 3 man shells in the secondary. This puts incredible stress on the CBs on the outside and the FS to play on an island.

So the key vs a read option offense is having big DTs who can stop the inside runs, traps, rb option up the gut, etc. CBs who can press, tackle on outside runs, and chase, a FS with incredible range, and a versatile SS who can play in the box but also play the TE on PA.

Basically, the Seahawks. The pass rush is completely negated by the read option. Having a surplus of pass rushers won't do anything for you because the read option is specifically designed to take away your pass rush.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:06 PM    (permalink
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I can't believe this is Eli's 10th season. I feel old.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:14 PM    (permalink
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Eli is 7 months older than me. I was there on draft day Giants Stadium when he was drafted. I drove from college in Boston down to the meadowlands. I will also try to go when he goes to Canton inducted in the HOF. That would be a special trip.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:42 PM    (permalink
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I tried to get into the draft that day and it was a **** show. We were told numerous times we'd be let in but they never let us in. After our pick and the trade we left that area and went home.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:44 PM    (permalink
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I tried to get into the draft that day and it was a **** show. We were told numerous times we'd be let in but they never let us in. After our pick and the trade we left that area and went home.
We also drank until 5 am the night before and then slept through the rest of entire first day of the draft.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:44 PM    (permalink
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In an odd way, I kind of miss the days of having a developing quarterback.

Now I feel like every season is SB or bust. It's fun, but also taxing. You don't enjoy it as much.

When your qb is developing you enjoy the games more. You don't go into the season with that Yankee fan like expectation and you just enjoy the ride more.
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Old 09-12-2013, 12:47 PM    (permalink
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In an odd way, I kind of miss the days of having a developing quarterback.

Now I feel like every season is SB or bust. It's fun, but also taxing. You don't enjoy it as much.

When your qb is developing you enjoy the games more. You don't go into the season with that Yankee fan like expectation and you just enjoy the ride more.
Yeah. 2008 was so fun as a Falcons fan.
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Old 09-12-2013, 01:17 PM    (permalink
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In an odd way, I kind of miss the days of having a developing quarterback.

Now I feel like every season is SB or bust. It's fun, but also taxing. You don't enjoy it as much.

When your qb is developing you enjoy the games more. You don't go into the season with that Yankee fan like expectation and you just enjoy the ride more.
I wonder if a team can do that and be different. Sure, now all rookie Qbs are playing. What if a team wants to practice the "older" ways and sit a rookie? I wonder how that would be looked upon right now.

Eli on the WFAN talked about this with Mike F. How now systems are tailored towards or around rookie QBs. He had to learn the system. Nothing was tailored around him he said. That was the difference between now and then he said.
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Old 09-12-2013, 01:29 PM    (permalink
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I wonder if a team can do that and be different. Sure, now all rookie Qbs are playing. What if a team wants to practice the "older" ways and sit a rookie? I wonder how that would be looked upon right now.

Eli on the WFAN talked about this with Mike F. How now systems are tailored towards or around rookie QBs. He had to learn the system. Nothing was tailored around him he said. That was the difference between now and then he said.
No. That's bc our coach is a dinosaur.

A lovable dinosaur though.
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