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Old 12-10-2013, 08:42 PM    (permalink
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We can't fix all of that in one offseason. I think the priority right now on offense has to be OL. We can make do with another rental TE for a year if need be. We can get by with hoping that Cruz and Randle are good enough next year, draft another WR in the mid rounds, and hope for the best.

RB can be found late in the draft. Cox may develop too.

Priority on offense has to be OL. We need to invest heavily in our OL.

And because we don't have multiple picks in the first 2 rounds, I think our priority in this draft has to be OL early.

If a great DE or CB falls in our lap then we should think about it. Same with OLB. But right here right now, unless a stud DE, CB, or OLB is there and is BPA by a wide margin, I think we have to take the best available OLmen in both rounds 1 and 2.

The need is just too great for us to pass up. Unless, again, the BPA at another position far exceeds the grade on the best available OLmen.
Oh man. Not another 1 year rental. They need to man up and draft one and say, from now on, you're starting and that's it. Obviously injuries is one factor, but if you're healthy, you will go through trial by fire. No ifs, and, or buts, about it.

RR and Cruz won't be enough. Who plays Z? You want RR as X? OL I agree, but if the system doesn't change then we need to go all out. If not, then trade Eli. Why waste a man's talents and pay him top dollar if we can't get our stuff together?
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Old 12-10-2013, 08:46 PM    (permalink
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Who plays Z?
I would assume Jerrel Jernigan.
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Old 12-10-2013, 08:54 PM    (permalink
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The TE situation is very interesting.

We need to cut Myers, Pascoe is a FA and both Donnell and Robinson are unproven.

There are very few options in free agency who fit the mould of all round TEs we prefer.

Maybe Jake Ballard is an option if he is healthy and gets a low RFA tender

In the draft the only option I see as a good fit for us is Austin Sefarian-Jenkins
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Old 12-10-2013, 09:00 PM    (permalink
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I would assume Jerrel Jernigan.
JJ is going to play Z?! God lord. What a mess if that happens.

RR-X
JJ-Z
Cruz-Z/slot

That's a god awful WR corps. No OL and NO TE. And 2 injury prone RBs. That's an amazing offense. To top it off one bad system. Which one if you guys sold your soul for 2 SBs? LOL. That's a god awful forecast if all that comes true.
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Old 12-10-2013, 09:03 PM    (permalink
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If you add a real TE and a bargain veteran FA WR it might not be THAT bad. Plus do your due diligence with late round guys and hope you get a Da'Rick Rogers type.

I wouldn't be against using a high pick on a starting TE who can be the 2nd best receiving threat.
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Old 12-10-2013, 09:18 PM    (permalink
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China doll Jacobs to IR.
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Old 12-11-2013, 09:43 AM    (permalink
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I love you Jacobs. Forever and ever.

I don't want Tuck back. If you bring Tuck back, he's not coming back as a backup. We all know Coughlin by now, he doesn't do that to veterans. He's starting.

So you have to ask yourself, do you want Tuck starting for another 3 years? My answer is HELL NO. I don't want him back.

And I don't want Kiwi back either. He's the definition of mediocre. We should start JPP and Moore next year and draft another pass rusher and hope that 3 man rotation works. It's time to move on from dead weight.

As for TE and WR, look, in a perfect world it would be great to find people and add replacements, but it's going to be impossible to address all of that along with OL, DL, LB and DB. It's just impossible.

So I think we need to focus on the trenches. Go heavy along the OL, add a pass rusher if you can, an OLB if you can, and you just have to pray your DBs and WRs hold up for another year.

Realistically it's gonna take 2 years to fix everything, so we need to work on the trenches first, then worry about skill positions.

Fix the lines this year. Then work backwards.
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Old 12-11-2013, 10:17 AM    (permalink
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So Eli would be 35 years old by then. I wonder if it's better to trade him, and get the picks? If that happens and we format the hard drive, then might as well clean house with everyone on the coaching staff too. What's the point of having Eli if we can't get our stuff together in terms of players.
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Old 12-11-2013, 10:19 AM    (permalink
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No way. You ride it out with Eli. On paper, it will take 2 years to rebuild our team, but we all know that you can compete for a SB in this league with good health and a franchise qb. We could still be good enough next year to compete.

We work the lines this year, that will bring us back to a competitive status, and we work the skill positions the year after.

Or maybe a combo of the 2 as we go BPA.

We'll be ok, we just won't be perfect. But no one is. So it's ok.
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Old 12-11-2013, 10:25 AM    (permalink
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No way. You ride it out with Eli. On paper, it will take 2 years to rebuild our team, but we all know that you can compete for a SB in this league with good health and a franchise qb. We could still be good enough next year to compete.

We work the lines this year, that will bring us back to a competitive status, and we work the skill positions the year after.

Or maybe a combo of the 2 as we go BPA.

We'll be ok, we just won't be perfect. But no one is. So it's ok.
Eh, I have to see how the team, specifically, the offense is addressed. OL has to be fixed. But we need to sign FAs that can contribute. No more stupid show me, 1 year deals. If we like a TE, then man up, and sign the guy so he can develop.

RBs we need to address. I want to see Cox play more. Let's see if we can draft 1 or have an undrafted FA make the team. WR is key. Murphy is god awful. JJ is useless.
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Old 12-11-2013, 10:27 AM    (permalink
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The way we rotate players who cares if Tuck "starts" or not. He'll get less snaps as time goes on. He's still good and would be a good rotation DE. The hate that everyone here throws towards Tuck is blinding everyone.
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Old 12-11-2013, 10:50 AM    (permalink
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Don't fall for the contract year production. Dude needs to go. We made that mistake with Beatty. Now look. Got paid and sucks again. If you sign Tuck, watch him magically play hurt half the season like he always does.

Funny how all those nagging injuries he always has magically disappeared in his contract year right?

I appreciate what he's done here, but it's time to move on. We need some fresh blood to revitalize the team. Too many complacent veterans on the team right now.
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Old 12-11-2013, 10:53 AM    (permalink
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Ohh please it has nothing to do with that. It's called being healthy for the first time in forever. If Tuck even wants to come back he'll take a good deal. His original deal was way below market value and you never hear a peep out of him about his contract.
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Old 12-11-2013, 10:57 AM    (permalink
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I'm not falling for it. He needs to go. I don't think it's a good idea to dump salary in a guy who will be hurt most of the time and who's best years are behind him.
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Old 12-11-2013, 11:12 AM    (permalink
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As always it all depends on what he wants. He loves it here maybe he'll come back for slightly above the vet minimum for all we know. Let's see how it plays out.
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Old 12-11-2013, 11:13 AM    (permalink
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See if it was that simple I'd be ok with it. But do you trust Coughlin to use him sparingly like he should? I doubt it.

Coughlin is incredibly loyal to veterans, especially guys like Tuck. He'll take meaningful snaps away from guys who can offer more at this point in his career. Sometimes you just have to move on. We have an opportunity to move on without the bad blood of cutting the guy, let's just wish him well and move on.
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Old 12-11-2013, 11:15 AM    (permalink
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We all like Moore but maybe he looks like garbage in practice. He's been hurt the first half of the year so it's very possible he's behind. Tuck has been our best DE all year so he's been deserving to play.
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Old 12-11-2013, 11:19 AM    (permalink
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See if it was that simple I'd be ok with it. But do you trust Coughlin to use him sparingly like he should? I doubt it.

Coughlin is incredibly loyal to veterans, especially guys like Tuck. He'll take meaningful snaps away from guys who can offer more at this point in his career. Sometimes you just have to move on. We have an opportunity to move on without the bad blood of cutting the guy, let's just wish him well and move on.

While I agree for the most part, Tuck has been good against the run even when his pass rush is lagging. I think that is what appeals to TC and PF the most right now, we've really committed to stopping the run this year.
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Old 12-11-2013, 11:30 AM    (permalink
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I also feel like the use of Tuck has been butchered over the years.

Tuck is a prototype base LE in our 43 front who should always slide inside on the nickel. His best pass rush comes from the 3 tech.

But we just don't use him like that. We do it sparingly. And when we do it works! Yet we don't do it often enough.
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Old 12-11-2013, 11:31 AM    (permalink
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Well that's not Tuck's fault. Talk to good ole Perry. I feel dirty because I kind of came around a bit on him but that totally went out the windown again after SD game.
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Old 12-11-2013, 11:34 AM    (permalink
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We need to get younger and faster on both sides of the ball. So hopefully Reese can step up this year with decisions on who to let go. Ross needs a big draft.
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Old 12-11-2013, 02:08 PM    (permalink
touchdownmaker
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Originally Posted by bigbluedefense View Post
I also feel like the use of Tuck has been butchered over the years.

Tuck is a prototype base LE in our 43 front who should always slide inside on the nickel. His best pass rush comes from the 3 tech.

But we just don't use him like that. We do it sparingly. And when we do it works! Yet we don't do it often enough.
Yeah, pretty much spot on there. Look no further than the Redskins game. Tuck does his best work rushing on the outside.

I too feel that we need to build the team inside out, but I would avoid the DL and shoot for OL/LB help. I would rather not touch the DE spot until the third round. If CJ Mosley is there its going to be tough to pass him up, but hopefully we woudl be in range of a quality LT. Then we could go with a G or C in teh second.
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Old 12-11-2013, 02:10 PM    (permalink
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Yeah, pretty much spot on there. Look no further than the Redskins game. Tuck does his best work rushing on the outside.

I too feel that we need to build the team inside out, but I would avoid the DL and shoot for OL/LB help. I would rather not touch the DE spot until the third round. If CJ Mosley is there its going to be tough to pass him up, but hopefully we woudl be in range of a quality LT. Then we could go with a G or C in teh second.
I really feel like we should aggressively go after a LT. Whether in the draft or FA, I just don't want Beatty covering Eli's blindside anymore.

If we fall far enough in the draft, I'm looking at Jake Matthews as BPA.
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Old 12-11-2013, 04:13 PM    (permalink
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If we fall far enough in the draft, I'm looking at Jake Matthews as BPA.
Sorry, at 5 wins I think that door is closed. Especially with a week 17 game against Washington. I mean, unless TC decides to shut down Eli the final week.
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Old 12-11-2013, 04:22 PM    (permalink
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but i think with QB needy teams, Lewan and Matthews, Barr and Clowney, we could get someone pretty good.

ACTUALLY, I'm falling in love with MSU CB Dennard. I'd LOOOOOVE if we got him. Dennard-Prince-Hosley-Mcbride? Yeah. Scotty likey.
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BTW, if it's 3rd and 97... I'm throwing a screen pass to Brian Leonard and he will convert.
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