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Old 06-30-2011, 12:35 PM    (permalink
ArkyRamsFan
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Originally Posted by Halsey View Post
Non sequitor argument! Just because things changed in the past does not mean they'll change in the future!
Are you serious or are you being silly again?

1.) Sequitur is spelled with a 'u' not an 'o'.

2.) I said "Things CAN and do change." Note I did not say 'Things WILL change...' or anything along those lines.

3.) Please read people's posts as they are written without interjecting your own bias into the equation.

Thank you.
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Old 06-30-2011, 12:46 PM    (permalink
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No I agree with you. I just thought it was funny.

Pass rush is a big concern. With a lack of a consistent pass rush and pretty much a no name secondary they aren't doing themselves any favors.
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Old 06-30-2011, 12:51 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by ImBrotherCain View Post
No I agree with you. I just thought it was funny.

Pass rush is a big concern. With a lack of a consistent pass rush and pretty much a no name secondary they aren't doing themselves any favors.
Their defense could become a poor man's Bears defense if you think about it.

The Bears defense is all about their LBs. Urlacher and Briggs absolutely patrol the middle of the field and take it away, plus they stop the run and spy the qb.

So then Chicago just goes into that Tampa 2 shell to take away the deep ball and they hope and pray Peppers creates a pass rush on the dline.

The Falcons defense is built the same way, only with lesser talents at each position.
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Old 06-30-2011, 02:16 PM    (permalink
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Another non sequitur argument. What Cleveland has done in past drafts is not indicative of what they will do with the picks acquired in this trade because of a myriad of reasons.

Chiefly among them is the new regime featuring Mike Homgren which has only been in place for 2 years now.

If the Browns had the same bumbling management team in place currently as they had in the past, your point would have more credibility.

BTW it wasn't too long ago that the Falcons themselves were also among the worst organizations at the draft.

Things can and do change.
Past performance is not a guarantee of future ineptitude? True, but it is the best thing we have.

J
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Old 06-30-2011, 04:28 PM    (permalink
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William Moore was a stud for Atlanta last season. They also have two solid corners in Brent Grimes and Dunta Robinson, Thomas DeCoud was pretty trash however and they never had a solid nickel. I would say the secondary is better than people give them credit for.
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Old 06-30-2011, 10:32 PM    (permalink
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What can I say, that's the best way to describe their defense. I think Falcon fans will back me up on that.
You are right. They very much take on the personality of Smitty.

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William Moore was a stud for Atlanta last season. They also have two solid corners in Brent Grimes and Dunta Robinson, Thomas DeCoud was pretty trash however and they never had a solid nickel. I would say the secondary is better than people give them credit for.
This is all true. The thing with DeCoud is he played really well the year before. We all expected him to really burst on the scene this year (like Willy Mo did), but he regressed.
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Old 06-30-2011, 11:38 PM    (permalink
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Past performance is not a guarantee of future ineptitude? True, but it is the best thing we have.

J
Which would have more relevance if Phil Savage and Romeo Crennel were leading the Browns and not Mike Holmgren and Pat Shurmur. This is the first draft that Holmgren/Shurmur have put together, so there is no past performance to base your projection on - only the failures of the now departed former Browns GM's and HC's, and it's not only unfair, but completely asinine, to hold them against the current regime.

Besides, I'd label Mike Holmgren's career as many things, and "inept" would not be one of them.
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Old 08-03-2011, 05:49 AM    (permalink
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Reports out of Falcon's camp suggest Julio Jones will be ready to be a major contributor from day 1. A couple of quotes:

"may already be the most impressive player" at Falcons training camp.

"more explosive off the ball than they thought."

Mike Mayock


"This kid Julio Jones is the real deal. He's the best incoming receiver I've ever played with. Come to think of it, it's not even close."

Tony Gonzalez

"Look the **** out.."

Me
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Old 08-03-2011, 08:04 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Halsey View Post
Reports out of Falcon's camp suggest Julio Jones will be ready to be a major contributor from day 1. A couple of quotes:

"may already be the most impressive player" at Falcons training camp.

"more explosive off the ball than they thought."

Mike Mayock


"This kid Julio Jones is the real deal. He's the best incoming receiver I've ever played with. Come to think of it, it's not even close."

Tony Gonzalez

"Look the **** out.."

Me
im not surprised by any of this, the dude is gonna be magical
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Old 08-03-2011, 08:34 AM    (permalink
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At least they brought in a starting caliber DE in Ray Edwards. He's not a world beater, but he's a solid all-around player and they didn't overpay. I'm pretty sure it's around what Antwan Odom got from Cincy after the '08 season, and he had the exact same concerns coming off an 8 sack season across from Haynesworth and Vanden Bosch.

But albeit, Odom became a busted FA signing, but he had injuries, failed drug test, and played for Cincy, so...
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Old 08-03-2011, 04:00 PM    (permalink
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Hopefully Abraham, Babs and Peria Jerry will have good years so that Edwards continues to play on a line with other good players.
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Old 08-05-2011, 07:09 AM    (permalink
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Hopefully Abraham, Babs and Peria Jerry will have good years so that Edwards continues to play on a line with other good players.
Hope in one hand, **** in the other lets see which one fills up first.
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i mean, why wouldn't the broncos take cam newton? they can play him at quarterback WITH tebow!
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Old 11-22-2011, 08:04 AM    (permalink
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Injuries have slowed down the overall numbers for Jones, but anyone wanna hate on this trade anymore? LOL. Jones is pure beast.
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Old 11-22-2011, 08:32 AM    (permalink
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I think some of Atlanta's struggles this year can be attributed to forcing the ball to Jones. i think he is going to be a very good player but they needed to have him produce early on the field to justify trading all they did for him. With him out of the line up ATL has not really skipped a beat and Roddy White and Harry Douglas are getting more targets. When Julio was playing it seems that Ryan is almost forced to get him the ball no matter what.
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Old 11-22-2011, 08:55 AM    (permalink
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This trade was terrible.

No WR is worth that much. You only trade multiple 1st round picks for QBs.
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Old 11-22-2011, 09:34 AM    (permalink
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Right now the trade does not look good for Atlanta, mainly due to Jones missing so many games. However, if Jones comes back and is a difference maker down the stretch, and the Falcons makes the playoffs, does it really matter that much that he missed some games.

In hindsight, it can certainly be argued that the Falcons should have just stayed at 27 and taken Torrey Smith.
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Old 11-22-2011, 05:34 PM    (permalink
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Still think they gave up way too much for Jones. Do I think he's a good player, yes I do. But he needs to be Andre 3000 or Fitz good to make this trade the right move by ATL
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Old 11-22-2011, 05:59 PM    (permalink
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Exactly. It's nice to finally agree on something. Julio Jones' impact on this team is more than the number of catches and yards he gains. Matt Ryan, Michael Turner, and Roddy White all had career lows in YPA and YPC (6.5, 4.1, and 12.1) and that is what caused the offense to sputter out. Some of the non-explosiveness was on purpose to keep the weak Falcon's defense off the field, but explosive plays are needed to if the Falcons are to fall behind more than 14 points. The immediate returns of this trade are going to be measured through the increase in the star trio's efficiency averages; Jones can gain anywhere between 300-900 yards, but if the trio's YPA and YPC rises noticeably to 7.0, 4.5, and 14.0, I will consider the Jones' trade a success. That is how the success of this trade is to be measured because that is why the trade happened. I know that next season people will be calling the Julio Jones trade a bust because he didn't put up 850 yards with 8 TDs in his rookie season, but remember to check out the rest of the team's success.
That is what I posted around when the trade happened. Julio Jones was brought in to bring an explosive element to the whole offense, not just put up studly numbers. Midway through the season, shall we see how Atlanta is doing explosively?

Matt Ryan's YPA has gone from 6.5 to 7.3. Roddy White's YPC has gone up from 12.1 to 13.1. Tony Gonzalez's YPC has gone up from 9.4 to 11.2. Michael Turner's YPC has gone up from 4.1 to 4.4. JJ's YPC sits pretty at 16.6.

Atlanta's passing offense ranks 9th in plays of 40+ and 11th in plays of 20+ yards (they finished the season 22nd and 31st, respectively, last year). Atlanta's rushing offense ranks 4th in plays of 40+ and 9th in plays of 20+ yards (they finished 18th and 12th last year).

Not too shabby for an offense not quite in sync yet. And, with the defense gelling together well, we'll see how formidable the Falcons will be down the line.
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Old 11-22-2011, 06:13 PM    (permalink
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Injuries have slowed down the overall numbers for Jones, but anyone wanna hate on this trade anymore? LOL. Jones is pure beast.
Ignore this guy. He is the new jesus of the Falcons' forum. Absolutely no need to bump this thread. I'm the biggest supporter of Jones and obviously we haven't won as of now because of injuries. However, I don't think it's fair to judge this until 2-3 years down the road. When healthy Julio has been a stud, hopefully he keeps it up.
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Old 11-22-2011, 06:19 PM    (permalink
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Just wait until Phil Taylor ends up flopping in the long run, Greg Little ends up being nothing more than a #2 and then we package a **** load of picks next year for Luck including the ATL pick and he ends up being the next Ryan Leaf. Cleveland manages to **** everything up.
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Old 11-22-2011, 06:19 PM    (permalink
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That is what I posted around when the trade happened. Julio Jones was brought in to bring an explosive element to the whole offense, not just put up studly numbers. Midway through the season, shall we see how Atlanta is doing explosively?

Matt Ryan's YPA has gone from 6.5 to 7.3. Roddy White's YPC has gone up from 12.1 to 13.1. Tony Gonzalez's YPC has gone up from 9.4 to 11.2. Michael Turner's YPC has gone up from 4.1 to 4.4. JJ's YPC sits pretty at 16.6.

Atlanta's passing offense ranks 9th in plays of 40+ and 11th in plays of 20+ yards (they finished the season 22nd and 31st, respectively, last year). Atlanta's rushing offense ranks 4th in plays of 40+ and 9th in plays of 20+ yards (they finished 18th and 12th last year).

Not too shabby for an offense not quite in sync yet. And, with the defense gelling together well, we'll see how formidable the Falcons will be down the line.
Here are the numbers that matter:

The Falcons have scored 235 points so far this season (23.5 points/game), which is only 14th of 32 in the NFL.

Matt Ryan has thrown 15 passing TDs, which is tied for 12th in the NFL. Matt Ryan has also thrown 2484 passing yards, which is 10th in the NFL.

So basically speaking, the offense is still a plain-jane, middle-of-the-road passing offense. We'll see what Jones and Ryan can do next year, but as of right now, that trade did very little for them, in my opinion.
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Old 11-22-2011, 07:32 PM    (permalink
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Here are the numbers that matter:

The Falcons have scored 235 points so far this season (23.5 points/game), which is only 14th of 32 in the NFL.

Matt Ryan has thrown 15 passing TDs, which is tied for 12th in the NFL. Matt Ryan has also thrown 2484 passing yards, which is 10th in the NFL.

So basically speaking, the offense is still a plain-jane, middle-of-the-road passing offense. We'll see what Jones and Ryan can do next year, but as of right now, that trade did very little for them, in my opinion.
When you think of the Falcons, do you think of a finesse passing team like the Packers, Saints, Patriots? Since the new crew has taken over Atlanta, the Falcons have always, always been a run-to-control-the-clock team and it has brought much success. I don't expect a jump into the top 5 in terms of passing, but I do expect improvement and I see it. Wait until the end of the season when JJ starts playing consistently and Ryan learns to balance throwing to Tony G, Roddy White, HD83, and JJ.
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Old 11-22-2011, 08:37 PM    (permalink
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In hindsight, it can certainly be argued that the Falcons should have just stayed at 27 and taken Torrey Smith.
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Old 11-22-2011, 08:46 PM    (permalink
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I think some of Atlanta's struggles this year can be attributed to forcing the ball to Jones. i think he is going to be a very good player but they needed to have him produce early on the field to justify trading all they did for him. With him out of the line up ATL has not really skipped a beat and Roddy White and Harry Douglas are getting more targets. When Julio was playing it seems that Ryan is almost forced to get him the ball no matter what.

Early on, this was very much an issue, seemed to get better as the year progressed.
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B-I-N-G-O!!
No. Torrey Smith can do exactly one thing, out run people deep. Matt can't consistently hit that throw. Even if someone like Julio outruns the corner, he's often got to come back to the ball a bit or slow down to get it. Throwing deep isn't Ryan's strength.




Also, this thread got bumped now of all times? Christ. I know Julio's looked like a monster, but if that was your point, make this post after the Colts game. You bumped this thread to brag about a guy who the past two weeks left a game early, sat out, and will probably sit out again this week.
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Old 11-22-2011, 09:55 PM    (permalink
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In hindsight, it can certainly be argued that the Falcons should have just stayed at 27 and taken Torrey Smith.
They could have pretty much gotten Torrey Smith with the 2nd rounder. Either way, Julio Jones is much more valuable than just what the numbers show.
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