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Old 04-02-2012, 02:25 PM    (permalink
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Different strokes for different folks I guess. I tried watching Superman Returns the other day, and couldn't make it past the first hour. For how bad it was, and how unrealistic Superman is depicted in that movie in contrast to his publication history, it wasn't funny to me or entertaining...and I had to stop viewing it.
See I think Superman Returns while awful at times is really just incredible mediocre. I hate mediocrity when it comes to movies and television shows. At least say The Room or The Walking Dead are so bad is nearly every way that I can enjoy them. I will say though that The Room is far better than The Walking Dead when it comes to being so bad it's good. The Walking Dead can just be so infuriating. I remember watching an episode of Spartacus after The Walking Dead and just seeing how much better Spartacus is. I really do think the writers of The Walking Dead think they are making something important and serious and they fail whereas the writers of Spartacus know they are going for entertainment and they very much succeed. I think it is too late for The Walking Dead as far as following the graphic novels and taking itself seriously, they really should embrace the ridiculousness of the show.
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Old 04-02-2012, 02:26 PM    (permalink
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Right, but doing something like that is something I enjoy. And I'm getting enjoyment of the activity, because I actually enjoy doing it...not getting enjoyment because I hate doing it. That's a terrible analogy by that way. If you said something along the lines of me posting photos of Asian women on the internet and I absolutely hate doing it, but still did it because of me getting some kind of enjoyment of something I hate doing, then you would have something along the same lines of what I was talking about. Instead you bring up something completely irrelevant that doesn't even make a good analogy.

I mean oranges and apples, I don't get why you do it but you get enjoyment out of it. You don't get why I find enjoyment in bad things but I do. It really isn't that hard to pick up on what I was saying. Again are we going to argue about the show or are you going to continue to bring this into subjectivity, because I am not going to waste any more of my time on that subject with you. And seriously it really wasnt that hard for you to pick up on what I was getting at.
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Old 04-02-2012, 02:30 PM    (permalink
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See I think Superman Returns while awful at times is really just incredible mediocre. I hate mediocrity when it comes to movies and television shows. At least say The Room or The Walking Dead are so bad is nearly every way that I can enjoy them.
Really? I don't think Superman Returns works at all really. The production value is good for the most part, but the way Superman acts in that movie is really off and doesn't really work at all for me. That is probably what is most bothersome. I'm a big Superman fan though, so I'm pretty harsh about it...especially when the Reeve movies (the first two) were pretty good.
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Old 04-02-2012, 02:31 PM    (permalink
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I really would like to see something post why they think the show is good. I understand we all have different tastes but I have yet to really see anybody explain to me in a well thought out manner why they like The Walking Dead. I actually am curious since it is apparent so many people like it.
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Old 04-02-2012, 02:34 PM    (permalink
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Really? I don't think Superman Returns works at all really. The production value is good for the most part, but the way Superman acts in that movie is really off and doesn't really work at all for me. That is probably what is most bothersome. I'm a big Superman fan though, so I'm pretty harsh about it...especially when the Reeve movies (the first two) were pretty good.
Oh I don't think it is a good movie by any means but I don't find myself really hating it. I just choose to not watch it anymore. I remember being incredibly excited for it when it came out and seeing it a week in advance. I fell asleep halfway through. Tried to watch it once since then, turned it off. It is just boring but again I don't really hate it, I just find it is on the bad end of mediocre.
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Old 04-02-2012, 02:35 PM    (permalink
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I mean oranges and apples, I don't get why you do it but you get enjoyment out of it. You don't get why I find enjoyment in bad things but I do. It really isn't that hard to pick up on what I was saying. Again are we going to argue about the show or are you going to continue to bring this into subjectivity, because I am not going to waste any more of my time on that subject with you. And seriously it really wasnt that hard for you to pick up on what I was getting at.
Except I'm getting enjoying out something I enjoy doing. And you are getting enjoyment out of something that you hate doing/subjecting yourself to. One is logical, and the other isn't. Not saying people don't do illogical things, but to say you don't understand why I get entertainment out of something I do, because I enjoy doing it and then justify this as it being "apples and oranges" to enjoying something you hate doing is pretty stupid to me.

And obviously we aren't talking about The Walking Dead and it's background. So I don't even know why you brought that up.
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Old 04-02-2012, 02:39 PM    (permalink
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Except I'm getting enjoying out something I enjoy doing. And you are getting enjoyment out of something that you hate doing/subjecting yourself to. One is logical, and the other isn't. Not saying people don't do illogical things, but to say you don't understand why I get entertainment out of something I do, because I enjoy doing it and then justify this as it being "apples and oranges" to enjoying something you hate doing is pretty stupid to me.

And obviously we aren't talking about The Walking Dead and it's background. So I don't even know why you brought that up.
See I would say he does enjoy watching the show. He just hates it. I get that because I am the same. I do not think it is illogical at all. The Walking Dead makes me laugh more than most comedies because it is so awful. That is not the intention of the show at all but Jvig and I don't enjoy it because it is good, it isn't, we enjoy it because it is awful and makes us laugh. I smile quite a bit while watching the show.
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Old 04-02-2012, 02:41 PM    (permalink
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See I would say he does enjoy watching the show. He just hates it. I get that because I am the same. I do not think it is illogical at all. The Walking Dead makes me laugh more than most comedies because it is so awful. That is not the intention of the show at all but Jvig and I don't enjoy it because it is good, it isn't, we enjoy it because it is awful and makes us laugh. I smile quite a bit while watching the show.
It's logical to enjoy something you completely hate having to deal with?


Hmmm...like I said, different strokes for different folks I guess.
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Old 04-02-2012, 02:46 PM    (permalink
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It's logical to enjoy something you completely hate having to deal with?


Hmmm...like I said, different strokes for different folks I guess.
But as I continue to say I don't hate dealing with it. If I did I wouldn't watch it. I just think it is laughably awful. Like I said, it's the rubberneck effect, watching the show is watching a car wreck in progress, I just can't help myself and I do derive pleasure from watching said car wreck. Still waiting on reasons why people think the show is good, I am genuinely curious.
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Old 04-02-2012, 02:50 PM    (permalink
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Except I'm getting enjoying out something I enjoy doing. And you are getting enjoyment out of something that you hate doing/subjecting yourself to. One is logical, and the other isn't. Not saying people don't do illogical things, but to say you don't understand why I get entertainment out of something I do, because I enjoy doing it and then justify this as it being "apples and oranges" to enjoying something you hate doing is pretty stupid to me.

And obviously we aren't talking about The Walking Dead and it's background. So I don't even know why you brought that up.
No YOU aren't talking about the Walking dead. I have been this whole time until you started to try and psychoanalyze what stimulates enjoyment and then saying that there is some logical explanation for why we feel enjoyment, or any other feeling for that matter which psychologists will explain to you there is no strict rationality when it comes to feelings. I said I enjoy watching something that is bad, I never said I hate doing it (watching the show). I said I enjoyed watching terrible writing, it amuses me, there is nothing that can be used to deduce what is or isnt logical about that. If it stimulates feelings of enjoyment within me, thats all the logic one needs. Again, my analogy wasnt difficult for you to get, or maybe for you it was and you can tell me all day it isnt a good analogy until youre blue in the face but the point I was making still stands. I don't care if you don't get why Gonzo and I like watching it because it's bad, I never was trying to persuade you to understand. I keep asking to argue the show which I have been doing this whole time until you started pressing this issue. Youre being obnoxious, if you have a case about why were wrong in thinking that the show isn't good then make it but lets stop this useless ******* argument about whether or not my feelings are logical or not. I will get back to what I, not you, was arguing, which is the show isn't very good.
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Old 04-02-2012, 03:05 PM    (permalink
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No YOU aren't talking about the Walking dead. I have been this whole time until you started to try and psychoanalyze what stimulates enjoyment and then saying that there is some logical explanation for why we feel enjoyment, or any other feeling for that matter which psychologists will explain to you there is no strict rationality when it comes to feelings. I said I enjoy watching something that is bad, I never said I hate doing it (watching the show). I said I enjoyed watching terrible writing, it amuses me, there is nothing that can be used to deduce what is or isnt logical about that. If it stimulates feelings of enjoyment within me, thats all the logic one needs. Again, my analogy wasnt difficult for you to get, or maybe for you it was and you can tell me all day it isnt a good analogy until youre blue in the face but the point I was making still stands. I don't care if you don't get why Gonzo and I like watching it because it's bad, I never was trying to persuade you to understand. I keep asking to argue the show which I have been doing this whole time until you started pressing this issue. Youre being obnoxious, if you have a case about why were wrong in thinking that the show isn't good then make it but lets stop this useless ******* argument about whether or not my feelings are logical or not. I will get back to what I, not you, was arguing, which is the show isn't very good.
The conversation moved beyond The Walking Dead obviously with my last few posts to a more broad inquiry. So what? I also said something along the lines of "whatever floats your boat." in terms of what you enjoy. You can find entertainment in something you think is terrible and that it is your prerogative. I was just saying that continuously enjoying something you believe is overall terrible is stupid. That is my feeling on the situation. Pretty simple. And I know you didn't ask for my approval or whatever in regards to what you enjoy doing or how you enjoy doing it, but since this is a public message board I don't see why I'm not allowed to share my opinion on your feelings (or whatever you post for the world to see) on the matter anyways. I never said or implied you have to accept my thoughts on how you subscribe to your entertainment.
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Old 04-02-2012, 03:07 PM    (permalink
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It just wouldn't be a day on the DC boards without some sort of argument about TWD.
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Old 04-02-2012, 03:10 PM    (permalink
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The conversation moved beyond The Walking Dead obviously with my last few posts to a more broad inquiry. So what? I also said something along the lines of "whatever floats your boat." in terms of what you enjoy. You can find entertainment in something you think is terrible and that it is your prerogative. I was just saying that continuously enjoying something you believe is overall terrible is stupid. That is my feeling on the situation. Pretty simple. And I know you didn't ask for my approval or whatever in regards to what you enjoy doing or how you enjoy doing it, but since this is a public message board I don't see why I'm not allowed to share my opinion on your feelings (or whatever you post for the world to see) on the matter anyways. I never said or implied you have to accept my thoughts on how you subscribe to your entertainment.
I think watching something that is awful and trying to defend it with absolutely nothing is stupid.
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Old 04-02-2012, 03:12 PM    (permalink
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I think watching something that is awful and trying to defend it with absolutely nothing is stupid.
Bad analogy because he doesnt find the show awful........

I was going to pick apart that last post but once again I am starting to see how useless arguing with him is. He started this whole argument of why watch if you don't like the writing, then just says "whatever floats your boat", not to mention tried telling me that I am the one not discussing the walking dead, only to later say so what when I prove him wrong. Now I will continue to go back to discussing the topic at hand.
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Old 04-02-2012, 03:14 PM    (permalink
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I think watching something that is awful and trying to defend it with absolutely nothing is stupid.
That's what I am saying! It is much more logical if we are using the logic argument to watch a show, know why it is awful, be able to explain it, and still derive enjoyement out of it because it is awful than it is to watch a show that is awful and not be able to explain why it is good. The subjectivity argument will continue to be made I am sure but I still have yet to see anyone explain why they like it with anything but 'I like the concept' or 'I like zombies' or 'It is good.'
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Old 04-02-2012, 03:15 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Dr. Gonzo View Post
That's what I am saying! It is much more logical if we are using the logic argument to watch a show, know why it is awful, be able to explain it, and still derive enjoyement out of it because it is awful than it is to watch a show that is awful and not be able to explain why it is good. The subjectivity argument will continue to be made I am sure but I still have yet to see anyone explain why they like it with anything but 'I like the concept' or 'I like zombies' or 'It is good.'
Jvig and I have been going round and round with Ness on this for months now and he still hasn't given us a reason as to why the show is good. He enjoys it, he likes the theme, he likes the writing, but there is no tangible reason why it is a GOOD show.

Except that a lot of people watch it.
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Old 04-02-2012, 03:17 PM    (permalink
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Because good isn't an objective fact, despite the fact we have several award shows for good television which has a list of categories of what we constitute as good. Regardless if you agree with it or not, we in fact do have a way of defining what constitutes good television.
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Old 04-02-2012, 03:17 PM    (permalink
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It just wouldn't be a day on the DC boards without some sort of argument about TWD.
Yes, very true. That reminds me, I started a thread on another forum a couple of weeks ago. It was in regards to the comic book and the show. I think a couple of people here in this thread were trying to say that the comic was not written very well also. Maybe it was just Brodeur:


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Why buy the comics? They're really not that good from what I've read, and it has basically the same problems as the show. Read some Batman comics instead.
I went to CBR forums, and started a thread asking folks about the writing of The Walking Dead comic books series up to this point. Some interesting responses. Most of them saying that the comic book has been very good since it's inception in that regard, although the dialogue needs some work.

http://forums.comicbookresources.com...-to-this-point
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Old 04-02-2012, 03:18 PM    (permalink
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Jvig and I have been going round and round with Ness on this for months now and he still hasn't given us a reason as to why the show is good. He enjoys it, he likes the theme, he likes the writing, but there is no tangible reason why it is a GOOD show.

Except that a lot of people watch it.
False. I love when people take things out of context to suit their argument.

Every episode I've posted about thus far I've listed what I like and don't like about it. I even quoted this for Jvig in a post a while ago when we were talking about it.
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Old 04-02-2012, 03:20 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by vidae View Post
Jvig and I have been going round and round with Ness on this for months now and he still hasn't given us a reason as to why the show is good. He enjoys it, he likes the theme, he likes the writing, but there is no tangible reason why it is a GOOD show.
Wait, he likes the writing? I am very serious when I say I could have done a better job than the writers when I was 15 and working on my own zombie epic and I was not a good writer then (still probably am not). I credit the concept and really any good aspect of the show to the graphic novel of which it is based on, the worst thing about the show is the writers butcher the source material at every turn and seem to abandon nearly every aspect of the graphic novel that is good. They could have made a great show and you know what, the show might have less of an audience than they do now because of it. They instead decide to dumb the whole show dumb and pander to the lowest common denominator and it seems to have worked because a ton of people watch this ****. I understand I am one of those people but at least I recognize it's faults.
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Old 04-02-2012, 03:20 PM    (permalink
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I think watching something that is awful and trying to defend it with absolutely nothing is stupid.
See my last post.
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Old 04-02-2012, 03:22 PM    (permalink
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Wait, he likes the writing? I am very serious when I say I could have done a better job than the writers when I was 15 and working on my own zombie epic and I was not a good writer then (still probably am not). I credit the concept and really any good aspect of the show to the graphic novel of which it is based on, the worst thing about the show is the writers butcher the source material at every turn and seem to abandon nearly every aspect of the graphic novel that is good. They could have made a great show and you know what, the show might have less of an audience than they do now because of it. They instead decide to dumb the whole show dumb and pander to the lowest common denominator and it seems to have worked because a ton of people watch this ****. I understand I am one of those people but at least I recognize it's faults.
Where did I flat out say "I like the writing"? I remember saying it was terrible or the worst I've ever seen. And I remember saying there were good parts about the writing I liked and bad parts. But I don't recall saying "I like the writing" flat out.
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Old 04-02-2012, 03:22 PM    (permalink
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False. I love when people take things out of context to suit their argument.

Every episode I've posted about thus far I've listed what I like and don't like about it. I even quoted this for Jvig in a post a while ago when we were talking about it.
What you like and don't like != what makes the show GOOD.
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Old 04-02-2012, 03:23 PM    (permalink
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Where did I flat out say "I like the writing"? I remember saying it was terrible or the worst I've ever seen. And I remember saying there were good parts about the writing I liked and bad parts. But I don't recall saying "I like the writing" flat out.
Yet here we are.....
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Jesse realizing Walt was Santa Claus could really shake things up.
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I don't know how old you are, but if you can get to 24/25 without getting arrested or killed, you've done well for yourself lol.
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Old 04-02-2012, 03:23 PM    (permalink
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What you like and don't like != what makes the show GOOD.
Again, I love when people take information out of context to try and suit their arguments.
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