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Old 02-10-2012, 12:08 PM    (permalink
Sloopy
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Yea he will most likely be gone at the bottom of the 2nd round or the top of the first.

I like him as a prospect but he isn't one of the guys I'm targeting for us.

We might be able to nab him with our 2nd rounder but I would like to get an OL at that spot.
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Old 02-10-2012, 12:36 PM    (permalink
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The 4th...who the hell are you? Irvin is going in the Top 40 picks.
I strongly disagree with you, so sit back and learn something dickhole.
Irvin may be a great athlete as a passrusher, he's also got great speed and a relentless motor, I'll give it to you.
But what Irvin doesn't have is size, and not just is he extremely undersized for the position but he doesn't have any experience in coverage for a 3-4 scheme. Put that together with offering pretty much nothing as far as run support, and you have a very raw unpredictable pass rusher.
But an ignorant know it all like you might know that pass rusher is one of, if not the hardest position to translate to the NFL.
Especially for undersized/athletic type guys, We've seen it happen so many times before.
On top of all that, did you watch any WVU games this year? As a full time starter he declined big time from his breakout year 2 years ago. He's weak at the point of attack, gets lost in space, and will only offer a situational pass rush at best in the NFL. I like the guy, but its the truth.
I'd bet you 500 dollars right now he won't go in the top 40.
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Old 02-10-2012, 01:02 PM    (permalink
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I strongly disagree with you, so sit back and learn something dickhole.
Irvin may be a great athlete as a passrusher, he's also got great speed and a relentless motor, I'll give it to you.
But what Irvin doesn't have is size, and not just is he extremely undersized for the position but he doesn't have any experience in coverage for a 3-4 scheme. Put that together with offering pretty much nothing as far as run support, and you have a very raw unpredictable pass rusher.
But an ignorant know it all like you might know that pass rusher is one of, if not the hardest position to translate to the NFL.
Especially for undersized/athletic type guys, We've seen it happen so many times before.
On top of all that, did you watch any WVU games this year? As a full time starter he declined big time from his breakout year 2 years ago. He's weak at the point of attack, gets lost in space, and will only offer a situational pass rush at best in the NFL. I like the guy, but its the truth.
I'd bet you 500 dollars right now he won't go in the top 40.
First of all calm down.

2nd of all: I agree with your assessment of the kid. However, his athleticism, motor and speed will get him picked up earlier than his skill set would allow because it does give him such upside.

In a weak pass rusher class the kid probably goes in the top of the third but someone in desperate need may take him as early as a late 2nd.

Skill wise with upside I'd actually have to probably retract my statement above and give him an early-mid third range, but like I said, someone may reach on him
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Old 02-10-2012, 01:52 PM    (permalink
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I strongly disagree with you, so sit back and learn something dickhole.
Irvin may be a great athlete as a passrusher, he's also got great speed and a relentless motor, I'll give it to you.
But what Irvin doesn't have is size, and not just is he extremely undersized for the position but he doesn't have any experience in coverage for a 3-4 scheme. Put that together with offering pretty much nothing as far as run support, and you have a very raw unpredictable pass rusher.
But an ignorant know it all like you might know that pass rusher is one of, if not the hardest position to translate to the NFL.
Especially for undersized/athletic type guys, We've seen it happen so many times before.
On top of all that, did you watch any WVU games this year? As a full time starter he declined big time from his breakout year 2 years ago. He's weak at the point of attack, gets lost in space, and will only offer a situational pass rush at best in the NFL. I like the guy, but its the truth.
I'd bet you 500 dollars right now he won't go in the top 40.
He played DE on a 3-man line this year. Still put up pretty decent numbers. I'm not sure if he goes in the top 40 but he isn't lasting any later than the 2nd round either.
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Old 02-10-2012, 02:44 PM    (permalink
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I strongly disagree with you, so sit back and learn something dickhole.
Irvin may be a great athlete as a passrusher, he's also got great speed and a relentless motor, I'll give it to you.
But what Irvin doesn't have is size, and not just is he extremely undersized for the position but he doesn't have any experience in coverage for a 3-4 scheme. Put that together with offering pretty much nothing as far as run support, and you have a very raw unpredictable pass rusher.
But an ignorant know it all like you might know that pass rusher is one of, if not the hardest position to translate to the NFL.
Especially for undersized/athletic type guys, We've seen it happen so many times before.
On top of all that, did you watch any WVU games this year? As a full time starter he declined big time from his breakout year 2 years ago. He's weak at the point of attack, gets lost in space, and will only offer a situational pass rush at best in the NFL. I like the guy, but its the truth.
I'd bet you 500 dollars right now he won't go in the top 40.
You know who else has zero experience in coverage as a prospect? Aldon Smith. How did his rookie year go? How about Brooks Reed? Neither had any experience in coverage and both played excellently this season. There are many, many prospects playing OLB in a 3-4 who didnt do it whatsoever in college. Ryan Kerrigan is another one, just from last year.

Extremely undersized? I'll buy that he's smaller, but he's far extremely undersized. Von Miller is 6'3 245, same as Irvin. Aaron Maybin was 6'4 245, and he was taken 11th overall for his pass rush ability, the same thing that will elevate Irvin's stock. You're an absolute moron if you think he'll be available in the fourth.
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Old 02-10-2012, 03:17 PM    (permalink
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Cliff Avril - 3rd round
Elvis Dumervil - 4th round
Mark Anderson - 5th round

- Elvis Dumervil fell to the 4th round and the same thing will happen to Irvin. You might ask, why did Dumervil fall so far after such a productive college career?
Same exact issues Irvin has.. Size, run support, consistency, strength.
If you're comparing Kerrigan, Aldon Smith and Brooks Reed to Bruce Irvin you're a fool.
All 3 of those players are so much more physical and stronger than Irvin it's not even funny.
If you're so sure, let's get a written agreement, if Bruce Irvin goes in the first 40 picks I will pay you 500 dollars, put your money where your mouth is boy
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Old 02-10-2012, 04:59 PM    (permalink
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He wasn't comparing them as prospects so much as he was comparing the lack of experience they had in coverage coming out of college. The transition from NCAA 4-3 DE to NFL 3-4 OLB is pretty common. Guys who played DE aren't going to have any/much experience in coverage.

Now comparing Irvin to Avril is interesting. Irvin had more production coming out of WVU than Avril did at Purdue but they're similar types of pass-rushers.
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Old 02-17-2012, 03:18 PM    (permalink
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Alright lets say Konz, Burfict, and Floyd are all available when we pick. Who do you go with? I don't think all 3 of those guys will be available when we pick, Floyd least of all, but I'm trying to come up with different situations we could be in come April. That and the activity around here has been lacking lately.
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Old 02-17-2012, 03:21 PM    (permalink
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Floyd, definitely. He's a Top 15 talent.
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Old 02-17-2012, 03:29 PM    (permalink
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I'd go Floyd > Konz > Burfict. Floyd just is too talented to fall to us. Konz is a need and a good value. Burfict could work our and be great but the other two are just safer and still good value.
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Old 02-17-2012, 03:49 PM    (permalink
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I'd go Floyd > Konz > Burfict. Floyd just is too talented to fall to us. Konz is a need and a good value. Burfict could work our and be great but the other two are just safer and still good value.
That's where I'm at right now. Like I said before I don't actually think Floyd will fall to us but there seems to be a lot of dissent on the top WR prospects. Floyd would definitely be my choice out of the three. I think Cameron would actually be able to use Boldin, Smith, and Floyd effectively at the same time and with Rice and Dickson/Pitta also on the field that makes a dangerous passing game on paper. Of course the OL would have to hold up long enough to let Flacco stand in the pocket.
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Old 02-17-2012, 05:50 PM    (permalink
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That's where I'm at right now. Like I said before I don't actually think Floyd will fall to us but there seems to be a lot of dissent on the top WR prospects. Floyd would definitely be my choice out of the three. I think Cameron's replacement in 2013 would actually be able to use Boldin, Smith, and Floyd effectively at the same time and with Rice and Dickson/Pitta also on the field that makes a dangerous passing game on paper. Of course the OL would have to hold up long enough to let Flacco stand in the pocket.
Fixed it for you.
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Old 02-18-2012, 01:38 PM    (permalink
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Fixed it for you.
We can only hope. I have faith in the front office but not Harbaugh's personnel decisions. :(
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Old 02-18-2012, 07:58 PM    (permalink
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I think that Floyd is obviously an intriguing prospect should he fall to us but since I sincerely doubt he does in any realistic situation, it's hard to put him in rank order with anyone else.

I guess the best way to put this is to actually rank by position what I would like to address.

1. ILB
2. OL
3. WR
4. OLB

If a viable 1st round ILB falls to us, I would really like to pick him up, flat out. Addressing this position in the first and the OL in the 2nd would be ideal. The only OL I would be okay taking in the first OVER an ILB would be Adams, Reiff, DeCastro, and Kalil but I doubt any of them fall to us.

Interestingly enough though, I have had a shift in my philosophy about ILB.

I seriously think that Zach Brown should be our #1 target in this draft. I love Taze and would not be disappointed to pick him up. However, Brown seems to be an elite prospect that people are letting slip down boards.

Reportedly weighing in at 237 now, the guy is clearly putting on weight to fit the NFL LB mold. Furthermore, he is expected to run about a 4.3 40.

He won't bring the hard hitting tenacity of Taze but he may be a safer prospect and have just as much upside at this point.

The combine should be huge for Brown and I imagine he will shoot up boards after the fact, just like every other prospect we decide that we want :P

Still want to target Silatolu in the 2nd and is another guy I am hoping doesn't end up rising past our pick but I'm starting to fear that he will :(
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Old 02-18-2012, 08:20 PM    (permalink
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I agree im starting to consider we need a guy who can at least somewhat cover all these freak TEs. and with Browns speed he has the potential too
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Old 02-18-2012, 09:58 PM    (permalink
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I agree im starting to consider we need a guy who can at least somewhat cover all these freak TEs. and with Browns speed he has the potential too
If he can run a 4.3 forty at 240ish lbs I think there is no doubt he should be our #1 guy.
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Old 02-21-2012, 05:54 PM    (permalink
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I've reworked the latest mock draft most suited to address all of the Ravens major needs. Tell me what you guys think..

1st) C, Peter Konz.

2nd) OLB, Vinny Curry.

3rd) ILB, Audie Cole.

4th) WR, Jordan White.

5th) LT, Nate Potter.

6th) RB, Brandon Bolden.

7th) NT, Dominique Hamilton.
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Old 02-22-2012, 06:34 AM    (permalink
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Still wouldn't be psyched about an OL in the first. I've watched Konz throughout his career and while I think he will be a solid starter, I don't see him being overly special.

Meanwhile, we could address ILB with a top guy.

In that case I would want to address OL in the 2nd were there is some real value to be had and I see some real stud interior OL prospects.

3rd round would obviously change in that case.

Rest of the draft looks good, not sure is Potter makes it to the bottom of the 5th though.
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Miller is visual sex on the field.
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Old 02-25-2012, 12:25 PM    (permalink
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I keep going back and forth on what kind of OLB we should be looking for to replace Johnson if he leaves. Should we be looking for somebody in the same mold, basically a SLB where pass-rushing isn't the most important skill or are we looking for a pass-rusher first? I would prefer a slight scheme change where we send both OLBs at the QB consistently but I don't think we've done that since Thomas was here (and from what I remember he wasn't used as a traditional 3-4 OLB either). The reason I ask is because I see prospects like Perry, Mercilus, Branch, Curry, etc. mocked to us/around our pick and while I like the potential for a better pass-rush none of those guys seem to fit well in the role that Johnson has now.
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Old 02-25-2012, 03:53 PM    (permalink
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Zach Brown:

6'1 and 244 lbs 33 1/4 arm length and 9 1/2 hands

I know I said that we probably won't draft this guy as few will think of him as an inside guy but I WANT him so bad.

Talk about a Ray Lewis mold... pretty much the exact size that he came in at, athletic and plays well in pass coverage.

And the guy still probably puts up a freakish 40 time

As far as your comment Co:

I really don't know what we do with that OLB spot, I imagine it evolves based on who we put there.

I wouldn't be okay taking a pure pass rush artist as we could just plug Kruger in there if we are only going to have position rushing the QB.
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Miller is visual sex on the field.

Last edited by Sloopy : 02-25-2012 at 03:57 PM.
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Old 02-25-2012, 04:25 PM    (permalink
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I have this bad feeling that we're going to end up with Hightower in the 1st round. We drafted the last player I preached so thoroughly against and he did play pretty well for us last year, but in my defense I was convinced we were going to switch to a base 4-3 defense and he didn't fit what we need for that very well. Anybody remember who it is? :D
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Old 02-25-2012, 05:19 PM    (permalink
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Silatolu looked pretty awesome at the combine today. Definitely only had me falling harder for the kid
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Old 02-25-2012, 05:25 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sloopy View Post
Zach Brown:

6'1 and 244 lbs 33 1/4 arm length and 9 1/2 hands

I know I said that we probably won't draft this guy as few will think of him as an inside guy but I WANT him so bad.

Talk about a Ray Lewis mold... pretty much the exact size that he came in at, athletic and plays well in pass coverage.

And the guy still probably puts up a freakish 40 time

As far as your comment Co:

I really don't know what we do with that OLB spot, I imagine it evolves based on who we put there.

I wouldn't be okay taking a pure pass rush artist as we could just plug Kruger in there if we are only going to have position rushing the QB.
TACKLE and I just drafted Brown in the Forum Mock.
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Old 02-25-2012, 07:46 PM    (permalink
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It would be cool to get the MD local here. He was in my region for wrestling and boy the guy was a freak. Won MD state track title as a senior and jogged the last part of the sprint. I would like him.


But I agree I got a feeling we will take a hard look at Hightower. Hightower seems like a JJ kind of player. Can stuff the run, blitz, even put his hand in the dirt but will just be embarassed if asked to cover these freak TEs who keep popping up
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Old 02-25-2012, 07:54 PM    (permalink
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Also if Brown didnt lose any speed while bulking up to 245 he will be a top 20 pick at worst. We would have to traade up for him. His scouting report is the same that Ray had back in his day. Hopefully he becomes half as good as Ray.
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