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Old 02-26-2012, 12:08 PM    (permalink
WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
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Soooo...giving up a MONSTER contract to Williams who quite honestly is better suited as a DE in the 4-3 is okay but giving up a good contract and a first rounder is TOO MUCH???

Honestly, no thanks to Williams. We dont need him. What the 49ers need is to re-sign Brooks, let Rogers walk and get a ******* speed playmaking receiver on the outside. We already have the best defense but guess what, we need more offensive firepower to score more points. Pass on Williams.
Dan we are giving a monster contract to a top 5 pass rusher. A lot more valuable of position compared to WR. Mario did a very good job transitioning to OLB last season. He had 5 sacks in 5 games before his season ending injury. Plus with how much the 49ers run 4 lineman sets it wouldn't be much of a problem since he would line up at end like Aldon, which seemed to work out well for him.
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:11 PM    (permalink
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Wylie is making himself some money today. Looked very fluid in the deep ball drill tracking the ball and keeping stride. Really liking Kashif Moore. Marvin Jones only being 6'1 was kind of a bummer, but still a solid guy. Sanu is having a awful Combine though....
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:15 PM    (permalink
WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
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Wylie is making himself some money today. Looked very fluid in the deep ball drill tracking the ball and keeping stride. Really liking Kashif Moore. Marvin Jones only being 6'1 was kind of a bummer, but still a solid guy. Sanu is having a awful Combine though....
I don't think Sanu is having an awful combine. We knew coming in he would post a high 40 time. He had good measurables but he just isn't a good fit in this offense that is missing a vertical threat. Ravens could use a player like Sanu.
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:22 PM    (permalink
dan77733
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Dan we are giving a monster contract to a top 5 pass rusher. A lot more valuable of position compared to WR. Mario did a very good job transitioning to OLB last season. He had 5 sacks in 5 games before his season ending injury. Plus with how much the 49ers run 4 lineman sets it wouldn't be much of a problem since he would line up at end like Aldon, which seemed to work out well for him.
The Texans defense played and did BETTER without him plus who knows how he's going to come back from the pectoral muscle injury. I'm sorry and hell yeah, I would love Williams, Nicks and others all gift wrapped for us fans but thats not going to happen.

More valuable than WR? Hmmm, were we both watching the same Giants playoff game? Were we watching the same offense all season? Because I dont see how Williams or any defensive player is going to help us score points on offense. With that money, we could re-sign Brooks, get a playmaking WR and still add a quality DB like Jason Allen.

Williams is a top five pass rusher but I dont see how that solves our greatest need. What happens if next season, our defense does better but our offense does the same or worse? Sorry, the 49ers number one priority after re-signing their top free agents should be to acquire a top tier young franchise WR. Any other position as their number one need makes no sense to me whatsoever.
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:28 PM    (permalink
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Dan we are giving a monster contract to a top 5 pass rusher. A lot more valuable of position compared to WR. Mario did a very good job transitioning to OLB last season. He had 5 sacks in 5 games before his season ending injury. Plus with how much the 49ers run 4 lineman sets it wouldn't be much of a problem since he would line up at end like Aldon, which seemed to work out well for him.
He's easily in the top 5 at his position. And physical nigtmare to deal with. Physiaclly, one of the most impressive players the league has ever seen.You add him to this front seven, its almost too scary to imagine. Comparing him to a one trick pony WR is comparing apples to oranges. If Im going to go out and splurge in free agency, its going to be on a difference maker and player who is a physicsl mis-match everytime he steps on the field. Williams is a terror against the run, a living nightmare as a pass-rusher, and his presence frees up everbody else along the line. We wouldnt even need the secondary to be as stout, as any QB trying to pass on us 40 times a game would get killed. Like I said, Im not even suggesting we do it, but going after Williams makes alot sense on alot of levels if we did go that route.
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:35 PM    (permalink
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The Texans defense played and did BETTER without him plus who knows how he's going to come back from the pectoral muscle injury. I'm sorry and hell yeah, I would love Williams, Nicks and others all gift wrapped for us fans but thats not going to happen.

More valuable than WR? Hmmm, were we both watching the same Giants playoff game? Were we watching the same offense all season? Because I dont see how Williams or any defensive player is going to help us score points on offense. With that money, we could re-sign Brooks, get a playmaking WR and still add a quality DB like Jason Allen.

Williams is a top five pass rusher but I dont see how that solves our greatest need. What happens if next season, our defense does better but our offense does the same or worse? Sorry, the 49ers number one priority after re-signing their top free agents should be to acquire a top tier young franchise WR. Any other position as their number one need makes no sense to me whatsoever.
Yes with Brooks as a FA OLB would be considered a high need for this team. I have no problem investing money into bolstering the pass rush. Plus the team seems to feel comfortable with Culliver as a starter so we would be looking at lower tier FA CB to fill the nickel/dime packages.

49ers would still have all their draft picks intacted to fill the need at WR and CB. Signing Mario Williams would not deter the 49ers from being able to get a WR in the draft and I am really liking the WRs at pick 30.
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:36 PM    (permalink
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I don't think Sanu is having an awful combine. We knew coming in he would post a high 40 time. He had good measurables but he just isn't a good fit in this offense that is missing a vertical threat. Ravens could use a player like Sanu.
Ok maybe awful is too strong a word but I dont think anyone was thinking he would run 4.65 twice. And he hasnt look very impressive outside the 40 either.
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:37 PM    (permalink
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He's easily in the top 5 at his position. And physical nigtmare to deal with. Physiaclly, one of the most impressive players the league has ever seen.You add him to this front seven, its almost too scary to imagine. Comparing him to a one trick pony WR is comparing apples to oranges. If Im going to go out and splurge in free agency, its going to be on a difference maker and player who is a physicsl mis-match everytime he steps on the field. Williams is a terror against the run, a living nightmare as a pass-rusher, and his presence frees up everbody else along the line. We wouldnt even need the secondary to be as stout, as any QB trying to pass on us 40 times a game would get killed. Like I said, Im not even suggesting we do it, but going after Williams makes alot sense on alot of levels if we did go that route.
To me....spending money on Williams would be a waste. You already have the best rushing defense and a top three defense without Williams. Seriously, how much better can you get than that? Adding Williams does nothing for our offense and greatest need so if we end up in the same situation again next year, will it really be worth it? I dont. Team needs to go after what they need the most and thats a playmaking WR unless of course, you just prefer FG's on every possession inside the 20 or even outside the 20.

A top tier playmaking receiver, re-signing Brooks and signing a DB like Jason Allen > Mario Williams.
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:41 PM    (permalink
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I'm drooling over the Mario Williams talk. A LB group of Mario, Aldon, Willis and Bowman could be one of the greatest of all time.

I'm bummed Streeter ran so well. I think he's borderline first round now. Was hoping he would go late second at best. Not anymore.
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:43 PM    (permalink
WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
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You can never have enough pass rushers especially when your depth at the postion is literally just Haralson.
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:43 PM    (permalink
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Yes with Brooks as a FA OLB would be considered a high need for this team. I have no problem investing money into bolstering the pass rush. Plus the team seems to feel comfortable with Culliver as a starter so we would be looking at lower tier FA CB to fill the nickel/dime packages.

49ers would still have all their draft picks intacted to fill the need at WR and CB. Signing Mario Williams would not deter the 49ers from being able to get a WR in the draft and I am really liking the WRs at pick 30.
The difference is that the team doesnt NEED to invest in OLB when they could re-sign Brooks, keep the front seven intact and spend less money doing so. I'm fine with letting Rogers leave and have Brown/Culliver start, in fact thats what im hoping for.

Even if Brooks leaves, OLB still isnt a huge need because their plans are to start Smith opposite Haralson if Brooks leaves. We have no offensive playmakers except for Davis yet we have a bunch on defense so how is OLB (with or without Brooks) a greater need?

And everyone keeps saying that a rookie WR can come in and dominate. Sorry, I dont see that happening. People talk about Nicks, Julio Jones but forget who their QB is and who else is on their offense.

Smith needs a playmaking WR on the outside with speed which would also allow Harbaugh to be more aggressive instead of this pansy play-calling crap. But whatever, everyone has their own opinions. I just dont see how adding a Mario Williams helps the area that we need the most help - WR/offense.
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:46 PM    (permalink
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Pass rushers are great but when you look at the Giants, Packers and other teams over the last decade, it was more about offense and having receivers that the QB can get the ball too instead of pass rushers.

And yeah, Giants pass rush is awesome but if you switch their receivers with ours, they lose and we win so thus, its not all about pass rushers because no matter how great your defense is, unless they're scoring TD's on int/fumble returns every possession, its all about scoring points in an offensive league. You would think that the playoff games would show that but I guess not.
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Old 02-26-2012, 12:55 PM    (permalink
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You know, I was actually comptemplating that same move. Do we make a run at Mario Williams? I mean think about the ramifications his signing would have. You bring in a athletic freak, pass rushing monster like him into this defense and its almost unfair. With the way our LBs cover ground, our front seven would have a field day. No more double teams for Cowboy and Ray Mac, now you have two monsters on the outside to worry about. I know it goes against conventional wisdom but how often to you get grab a All-Pro cailber freak of nature prospect in the prime of his career? And Im not even suggesting we should do it. But man, if we did do it, I think we would have a chance to be one of the greatest defenses of all time. And according to Mario, he's not looking for a big payday. He said he's already made loads of money, being a #1 overall pick. Now he looking for the best fit and a place for him to win. And he will defintely hit the market. Texans are only 3 mil under the cap and the franchise tag for Mario would be 23 million for this year....OUCH! Very tempting sceniro if Im Baalke. Means you wave bye bye to Brooks, and Rogers, and thats the delemia.
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Same thought crossed my mind. It would remind me of when the Packers signed Reggie White to put them over the top. It would be nuts to run a 4 man line of Super Mario, McDonald, Cowboy, and Aldon Smith out on 3rd down. I thought I heard Matt Barrows say on the radio that the 49ers felt that Rogers good season was due more to the pass rush than his pass rush. I would go with Culliver as a starter and give up Brooks and Rogers to get Mario Williams.
That would be great if we could get Williams at a contender discount. And i think Brooks is asking for $8 million a year anyway. If we could get Williams for say, 10-11 instead of Brooks for 8 i would do that deal for Williams in a heartbeat. Only issue with Williams is he's missed some time to injury lately. But our strength and conditioning staff have been top notch and outside of Gore, we haven't had many injury prone players lately.

That's also an interesting tidbit about Rogers, from Barrows. If Barrows indeed said that the 49ers believe Rogers season was a result of the pass rush, then i can't see them spending big on a CB. Donatell is one of the best in the biz so while i want Rogers back, i'm confident we can let him go and sign a 2nd tier CB and coach him up. Brown was never a starter and Culliver was a raw rookie and Donatell coached them both up. Some interesting 2nd tier corners if we're not spending big money on Rogers or other FA's are Terrell Thomas, Eric Wright, or Tracy Porter. I could see us signing one of those CB's on a Donte Whitner type teal (3 years, 10/11 million)
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Old 02-26-2012, 01:18 PM    (permalink
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Pass rushers are great but when you look at the Giants, Packers and other teams over the last decade, it was more about offense and having receivers that the QB can get the ball too instead of pass rushers.

And yeah, Giants pass rush is awesome but if you switch their receivers with ours, they lose and we win so thus, its not all about pass rushers because no matter how great your defense is, unless they're scoring TD's on int/fumble returns every possession, its all about scoring points in an offensive league. You would think that the playoff games would show that but I guess not.

I wouldn't say it was more about offense than defense for the Giants. The Giants beat an offense in the '08 Super Bowl that had statstically one of the greatest seasons of all-time mainly due to how dominant their front 4 was.

Dan how much money did Green Bay and New York invest into their WR position the past few years?
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Old 02-26-2012, 01:24 PM    (permalink
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The difference is that the team doesnt NEED to invest in OLB when they could re-sign Brooks, keep the front seven intact and spend less money doing so. I'm fine with letting Rogers leave and have Brown/Culliver start, in fact thats what im hoping for.

Even if Brooks leaves, OLB still isnt a huge need because their plans are to start Smith opposite Haralson if Brooks leaves. We have no offensive playmakers except for Davis yet we have a bunch on defense so how is OLB (with or without Brooks) a greater need?

And everyone keeps saying that a rookie WR can come in and dominate. Sorry, I dont see that happening. People talk about Nicks, Julio Jones but forget who their QB is and who else is on their offense.

Smith needs a playmaking WR on the outside with speed which would also allow Harbaugh to be more aggressive instead of this pansy play-calling crap. But whatever, everyone has their own opinions. I just dont see how adding a Mario Williams helps the area that we need the most help - WR/offense.
And you fail to understand our coach and our offensive philosphy. Jimbaugh had the best QB in college football.....and he threw the ball less than most other offenses and relied on a steady ground game and good defense to win. That is Harbaugh. Doesn't matter who the QB is, doesnt matter who the WRs are. If you think that us signing Wallace means that all of a sudden we're passing the ball 40-50 times a game, you are going to be disappointed. Harbaugh will always be a ball-control coach. No personel moves will change who is. You think by bringing in a WR who's only real asset is catching deep balls and pluging him into a offense that will only look his way a few times a game is smart? And that's not even taking into account his QB. Let me ask you this, what is one of the biggest weakness of Alex, as a QB? His deep ball. So your pairing a WR who's strength doesn't necessarily mesh with our QB. Thats why guys would rather have dudes like V. Jackson. Because he has a much bigger catch radius and he has the physical ability to make unbelievable catches and help out a QB who has accuracy issues. I've seen him bail out Phillip Rivers lame duck passes too many times to count. But I actually would pass on V. Jackson. But guys like him are why alot of us here are clamoring for guys like Streeter and Hill....because they posess those same traits. That's why I dont want Wallace. I dont feel he'll mesh with this offense. He needs to be on a team that has a more vertical passing attack....like Arians ran. I dont feel this WCO is the best fit for him. If he were a more complete WR, maybe I could see him adjusting to this offense, but I dont see him dramatically changing this offense. The only player that controls how this offense evloves is the QB, not a WR. If Alex makes the necessary improvement going in to next season, we'll be fine as long as we add someone on the outside with speed. Doesn't have to necessarily be Wallace.
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Old 02-26-2012, 01:32 PM    (permalink
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That would be great if we could get Williams at a contender discount. And i think Brooks is asking for $8 million a year anyway. If we could get Williams for say, 10-11 instead of Brooks for 8 i would do that deal for Williams in a heartbeat. Only issue with Williams is he's missed some time to injury lately. But our strength and conditioning staff have been top notch and outside of Gore, we haven't had many injury prone players lately.

That's also an interesting tidbit about Rogers, from Barrows. If Barrows indeed said that the 49ers believe Rogers season was a result of the pass rush, then i can't see them spending big on a CB. Donatell is one of the best in the biz so while i want Rogers back, i'm confident we can let him go and sign a 2nd tier CB and coach him up. Brown was never a starter and Culliver was a raw rookie and Donatell coached them both up. Some interesting 2nd tier corners if we're not spending big money on Rogers or other FA's are Terrell Thomas, Eric Wright, or Tracy Porter. I could see us signing one of those CB's on a Donte Whitner type teal (3 years, 10/11 million)
If Brooks is really looking for 8 millon a year, I dont think he'll be back. He's going to have to come off that number. I love the guy but for a guy who has never posted double digit sacks, that's a little steep. I personally feel it would probably take around 12 mil a year to get Williams. Maybe if he met with the staff and really liked Jimbaugh, maybe we can bring that down to 11. But 12 is number I think he and his agent could live with. The question is would Baalke feel he would be worth it at that price?
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Old 02-26-2012, 01:32 PM    (permalink
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I actually don't think Alex's deep ball is the biggest weakness to his game. He dropped some dimes at the end of the year to Vernon (Saints/Giants game) and Crabtree (big time throw vs Seahawks). He just needs to have a comfort level with his targets or be trailing late in the game to make those type of throws. He is far to concerned of turning over the ball which is why, IMO, we get a lot of over throws from him.
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Old 02-26-2012, 01:36 PM    (permalink
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I actually don't think Alex's deep ball is the biggest weakness to his game. He dropped some dimes at the end of the year to Vernon (Saints/Giants game) and Crabtree (big time throw vs Seahawks). He just needs to have a comfort level with his targets or be trailing late in the game to make those type of throws. He is far to concerned of turning over the ball which is why, IMO, we get a lot of over throws from him.
Most of those throws to VD weren't really deep balls. Most were sideline patterns where he just threw the ball up and let VD's speed run under it. When I say deep ball, I mean passes where he has to have velocity to drive it, as well as a good arch and touch to drop it over the defender. Those throws he struggles mightily to complete.

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Old 02-26-2012, 01:41 PM    (permalink
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I don't want to sound like a square, but can we keep the FA talk out of the draft thread?
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Old 02-26-2012, 01:47 PM    (permalink
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Hill, 40" vert and 11'1" in the broad....talk about explosive athlete. I dont care how raw he is, you can't teach those numbers. Its hard not to drool over this guy, really.
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Old 02-26-2012, 01:54 PM    (permalink
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Hill, 40" vert and 11'1" in the broad....talk about explosive athlete. I dont care how raw he is, you can't teach those numbers. Its hard not to drool over this guy, really.
I'm jumping on the Hill bandwagon as well. A lot of untapped potential there. Also good pedigree of WR's from Georgia Tech the past couple of years with Megatron and Thomas.

Kendall Wright posted a 4.61 "official" 40 time? Chapo's mock may not be that far off, lol.
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Old 02-26-2012, 02:00 PM    (permalink
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Who gives a **** about a 40 time? Look at game speed.
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Old 02-26-2012, 02:02 PM    (permalink
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And Doug Martin with the 4.47 40 and 28 reps on the bench....MAKE IT HAPPEN BAALKE!

And really thought Rainey would be faster...

As far as Wright, he just didnt look good out of his stance on his runs. Him and Joe Adams are guys I believe are absolutelty faster than their times today. Kinda like the year Hester ran a 4.5. Most knew he was much faster than that. I dont think it will change Wright's stock all that much....but maybe Floyd has jumped ahead of him for some. The top 2-3 guys have all been interchangable for me really.

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Old 02-26-2012, 02:07 PM    (permalink
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Who gives a **** about a 40 time? Look at game speed.
Hey it's Feburary and free agency is more than two weeks away. We need something to over evaluate. Let me be Skip Bayless.

I do find the 40 times/measurables interesting for guys like Randle and Hill who were stuck in offenses that didn't utilize their skill sets enough. But it isn't the end all be all for my opinion on a player.
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Old 02-26-2012, 02:28 PM    (permalink
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Yeah it's interesting to see names that have hardly ever been mentioned now being labeled as players people "love" and "need" on the team. Relax. It's the combine.

As for Doug Martin. He would be a great option to be in the rotation but does anyone think it's a smart investment to use pick #30 on RB3?

Surely Martin won't be available at #60.
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