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Old 04-03-2012, 02:24 PM    (permalink
JoeJoeBrown
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Originally Posted by gpngc View Post
This thread is atrocious. Gardner's multiple intelligences and everyone ****. ESPN should be ashamed for reporting this 'story' when the kid has a documented learning disability. Many students succeed with learning disabilities. It takes courage for the kid to even take the ******* test seeing as how he's likely struggled with reading and test-taking his entire life.
Here's a rag to slow down your bleeding heart...
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Old 04-03-2012, 02:28 PM    (permalink
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A 2009 study by professors from Fresno State University, the University of Georgia and Towson State found no connection between Wonderlic scores and performance during the first three years of a player's NFL career. The group studied 762 players from the 2002, 2003 and 2004 draft classes.

John W. Michel, an assistant professor at Towson University who co-authored the study, told the Washington Post: "We found in no cases was cognitive ability related to (football) performance. We did find a negative relationship for tight ends and defensive backs. For defensive backs, it was the most pronounced; basically, the lower you scored on the Wonderlic, the better you performed."
http://espn.go.com/chicago/nfl/story...ic-sources-say
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Old 04-03-2012, 02:32 PM    (permalink
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See, the test is worth something.
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Old 04-03-2012, 02:42 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by JHL6719 View Post
The closest thing any of you nerds have ever been to a mouthpiece or a jockstrap is when the dude wearing them walked by and stuffed a twinkie in your pocket protectors....

Blaine Gabbert supposedly scored a 42 on the Wonderlic and he couldn't play football if his life depended on it... he's smart enough to get his a** out of the way when a pass rush is coming :^)
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Old 04-03-2012, 03:16 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by prock View Post
There is no way passing and completing the wonderlic makes you a genius.
completing it within time is a feat in its own, passing while completing is impossible.. that is why i said that.
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Old 04-03-2012, 03:20 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Asteinebach View Post
It's 50 questions, and it's not timed. While the Wonderlic score does not necessarily reflect intelligence, it does take some intelligence to get a good score on it.

For the umpteenth time, it's not intelligence they are looking for when they administer this test. These guys are going to be exposed to certain extraordinary circumstances in their everyday life (i.e. dealing with fans, media, carrying around a lot of money), and the Wonderlic best gauges a persons ability to think critically and make good decisions.
the wonderlic test that was administered to us at our junior day had nothing to do with dealing with fans, media, and carrying around a lot of money. there was grammar questions, math questions that i couldn't answer for the life of me and yes it was timed.
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Old 04-03-2012, 03:22 PM    (permalink
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I'm not going to argue that the Wonderlic is necessarily indicative of future performance but it is a mistake to completely disregard a terrible score. If Vontaze Burfict got a 4 this thread would look completely different.
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Old 04-03-2012, 03:23 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by gpngc View Post
This thread is atrocious. Gardner's multiple intelligences and everyone ****. ESPN should be ashamed for reporting this 'story' when the kid has a documented learning disability. Many students succeed with learning disabilities. It takes courage for the kid to even take the ******* test seeing as how he's likely struggled with reading and test-taking his entire life.
Agree. Intelligence and reading acuity aren't related. I had this argument ad nauseum regarding Frank Gore's score .
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Old 04-03-2012, 03:25 PM    (permalink
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I'm not going to argue that the Wonderlic is necessarily indicative of future performance but it is a mistake to completely disregard a terrible score. If Vontaze Burfict got a 4 this thread would look completely different.
Yea cuz with all the other flags Taze has it would just be anther thing to knock him but Mo has a learning disability as SPH posted.
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Old 04-03-2012, 03:34 PM    (permalink
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It sucks that a thing like a college education and 20 years of schooling couldn't help him overcome his learning disability by more than just a score of 4 on the wonderlic. Maybe instead of holding his hand and wiping his ass, somebody should have taught him to stand up and just pick a damn answer or else he'd look like an idiot.
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Old 04-03-2012, 03:36 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by YAYareaRB View Post
the wonderlic test that was administered to us at our junior day had nothing to do with dealing with fans, media, and carrying around a lot of money. there was grammar questions, math questions that i couldn't answer for the life of me and yes it was timed.
I'm not saying that the test itself is composed of questions specifically of that nature. I'm suggesting that the questions it does ask may have other implications on the persons character or personality.
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Old 04-03-2012, 03:38 PM    (permalink
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Maybe instead of holding his hand and wiping his ass, somebody should have taught him to stand up and just pick a damn answer or else he'd look like an idiot.
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Old 04-03-2012, 03:39 PM    (permalink
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completing it within time is a feat in its own, passing while completing is impossible.. that is why i said that.
Maybe for someone with a learning disability. Or maybe for the average professional athlete.
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Football...it's rocket surgery now, folks.
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Old 04-03-2012, 03:43 PM    (permalink
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It sucks that a thing like a college education and 20 years of schooling couldn't help him overcome his learning disability by more than just a score of 4 on the wonderlic. Maybe instead of holding his hand and wiping his ass, somebody should have taught him to stand up and just pick a damn answer or else he'd look like an idiot.
no offense, but that is one of the most ignorant things i've ever read
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Old 04-03-2012, 03:43 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by JHL6719 View Post
The closest thing any of you nerds have ever been to a mouthpiece or a jockstrap is when the dude wearing them walked by and stuffed a twinkie in your pocket protectors....

Blaine Gabbert supposedly scored a 42 on the Wonderlic and he couldn't play football if his life depended on it... he's smart enough to get his a** out of the way when a pass rush is coming :^)
You sound like a really intelligent guy. I bet in your day you could throw a football a country mile, over them mountains over yonder.
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Old 04-03-2012, 03:48 PM    (permalink
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no offense, but that is one of the most ignorant things i've ever read
Not in my opinion. Half the problem with all these kids and their "learning disabilities" is that they never had anyone to push them. They were considered "special" and therefore everything they did had to be easy. Being an NFL football player is not easy. Being a role-model is not easy. And being in the very judgmental public spotlight certainly is not easy. Even a child (or adult) with a learning disability is still capable of learning. And still capable of trying.
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Old 04-03-2012, 03:49 PM    (permalink
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I was under the impression that if you score under 24 that isn't good and anything below 20 is borderline ********. Maybe I am wrong, I only took the SAT.
http://www.actstudent.org/scores/norms1.html

A 20 is the 48th percentile, so it's certainly not terrible. Denard Robinson scoring a 19 puts him in the 41st percentile, just slightly below average for those that take the test. I know non-athletes who got into UW-Madison scoring in the low 20s.
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Old 04-03-2012, 03:50 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Prowler View Post
It sucks that a thing like a college education and 20 years of schooling couldn't help him overcome his learning disability by more than just a score of 4 on the wonderlic. Maybe instead of holding his hand and wiping his ass, somebody should have taught him to stand up and just pick a damn answer or else he'd look like an idiot.
You are apparently an asshole of epic proportions.
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Old 04-03-2012, 03:53 PM    (permalink
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But remember, these are "student athletes."

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Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.
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Old 04-03-2012, 03:54 PM    (permalink
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no offense, but that is one of the most ignorant things i've ever read
I have a natural bias against hippy coddling ********. The dude's job was to go in there and get the best result possible on the thing. Its obvious that he didn't finish or understand what he was doing.

What has he actually learned in his life? Has anybody taught him how to approach life's problems or does he have to rely on someone else to spell it out for him? All it would have taken was one person to say, "this is timed, in order for you to do your best you shouldn't take too long on any one problem. use your best judgement and guess if you aren't sure. just keep moving."

There's a better balance between being nurturing to his needs/making him feel better vs actual performance. His performance was absolutely terrible, so somebody needs to get on his ass about it. If nobody tells it to him straight, then even with millions of dollars, he's going to get killed by life's struggles.
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Old 04-03-2012, 03:57 PM    (permalink
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Not in my opinion. Half the problem with all these kids and their "learning disabilities" is that they never had anyone to push them. They were considered "special" and therefore everything they did had to be easy. Being an NFL football player is not easy. Being a role-model is not easy. And being in the very judgmental public spotlight certainly is not easy. Even a child (or adult) with a learning disability is still capable of learning. And still capable of trying.
People who use a disabilities as an excuse for their struggles rather than an explanation to learn from are, going to use anything as an excuse to fail, whether they're special or not and whether they're pushed or not. On the flip side someone who's got an actual disability, doesn't recognize it and work on it, but just keeps pushing themselves can easily become stifled and there problems exacerbated. A lot of this has to do with the specific problems, but helping people understand how they work and how to utilize that knowledge is a good thing.
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Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.
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Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.
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Old 04-03-2012, 03:59 PM    (permalink
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I'm not saying that the test itself is composed of questions specifically of that nature. I'm suggesting that the questions it does ask may have other implications on the persons character or personality.
well im sure if you looked at the test i took you could imply that im piss poor at math and time to question ratio management. that implication would be spot on. i dont think you would get a guage on anyone's personality or character by asking them whats the difference between "preserve" and "reserve" or "if train A left this place and train b left this place..." type questions.
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Old 04-03-2012, 04:04 PM    (permalink
YAYareaRB
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Maybe for someone with a learning disability. Or maybe for the average professional athlete.
i dont care who ya are, having 2-3 minutes to answer 30-40 questions each is pretty tough. on top of that, there's no way to study for them.
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Old 04-03-2012, 04:04 PM    (permalink
Rosebud
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I have a natural bias against hippy coddling ********. The dude's job was to go in there and get the best result possible on the thing. Its obvious that he didn't finish or understand what he was doing.

What has he actually learned in his life? Has anybody taught him how to approach life's problems or does he have to rely on someone else to spell it out for him? All it would have taken was one person to say, "this is timed, in order for you to do your best you shouldn't take too long on any one problem. use your best judgement and guess if you aren't sure. just keep moving."

There's a better balance between being nurturing to his needs/making him feel better vs actual performance. His performance was absolutely terrible, so somebody needs to get on his ass about it. If nobody tells it to him straight, then even with millions of dollars, he's going to get killed by life's struggles.
You understand that he might know a hell of a lot about his own condition and test just aren't something his brain processes well? I mean I'm ******* awesome at test, getting to bounce around between new and only loosely connected problems? That's perfect for me, but sit me down with a book for more than 15 minutes and I'm stuck reading the same paragraph over and over because I keep missing a sentence. Knowing that doesn't make a great reader and if you put me in a test that involved sitting for as long as possible reading the same text, I'd do terrible. Doesn't make me incompetent at reading, I just have to be careful with how I schedule my work so that whenever I have a lot of reading to do I mix it in around activities that let my mind work on something else. That's why I fly through books a lot faster when I'm working and we have multiple studies going than I do when I'm on vacation and just lying in the sun for an hour or more.
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Old 04-03-2012, 04:04 PM    (permalink
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I completely don't buy that him having a learning disability is the reason he got a 4. Its a complete excuse, he's in college. Are you telling me that if I managed to get a learning disability that it would excuse me from answering 6th grade math problems? Even the most basic math class would deal with number systems, and he'd probably had to have taken a lab based science class. How did he pass that? Did someone read it to him and explain it?

Even so...even if it takes a person a long time to learn something, or if they have to learn through different methods...why the hell does that excuse a college student from getting a 4 on a relatively simple test based off of stuff that he would have already learned in previous years of high school/college?

Summary...he's not learning anything new here. He just has to show up, read, and follow his previous training.

So, the only excuse that I can see is that he doesn't have the confidence to do it on his own. Probably from being coddled and told how special he was and not having to face problems on his own.
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