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Old 04-26-2013, 12:29 PM    (permalink
D-Unit
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Everyone would have be super excited to have seen Floyd at 18 and Frederick at 47, but no one could have been certain that he'd still have been there at 47. This is the reverse of last year when Dallas traded up to get Claiborne. They obviously have Claiborne, but they could have had David DeCastro + Casey Hayward.
There are still a ton of different scenarios and eventually in this next 2 rounds there's going to be a run on quarterbacks and runningbacks. There's still some real interesting defensive tackles left including Short, Logan, Hill, Everett Dawkins, Josh Boyd and Akeem Spence.

And there's still EXCELLENT value at defensive end:
Damontre Moore
Tank Carradine
Margus Hunt
Alex Okafor
Quanterus Smith
William Gholston
Sam Montgomery

And a single pick of one of those guys could shuffle Crawford inside where you'd now have Ratliff, Hatcher, Lissemore, and Crawford to go with Brian Price, Ben Bass, and Robert Callaway. You'd probably have your "bodies" you'd just need to fit them into the holes.

There's a bunch of different ways to skin a cat left in this draft and the Cowboys could address that defensive tackle position a couple different ways going forward. Keep in mind they could still trade back into round 2 with their 2 3rd rounders if there's someone they like there.

Yesterday Dallas was at the mercy of how things fell in front of them. Now they have the necessary ammunition to trade up or move around to get who they want. Expect to get some really good value today.
I like the way your put together this post. I do agree that the Cowboys come into Day 2 in a power position. We have 3 picks today and we've been talking A LOT about how the strength of this draft is in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.

When I look at what the Giants and Bears did in taking Pugh and Long right after us... If you look at that value versus Frederick.... I'd way rather have Frederick and that 3rd than Pugh or Long by themselves.

Frederick is NASTY! I'm listening to ESPN Dallas Radio right now. His old Wisconsin OL coach who is now at Arkansas just said Travis broke several of his teammates arms and wrists in practice throwing them down to the ground. Talked about his nasty streak and said he had to talk to Travis "Hey we can't have that now. These are our own guys". Great listen if it's ever put on a podcast. Fitz and Durrett have been bashing the pick all day, but after this interview they got happy about the pick.
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Old 04-26-2013, 12:38 PM    (permalink
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You guys got an interior linemen from Wisconsin. No one should be upset about that.
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Old 04-26-2013, 12:39 PM    (permalink
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Though thinking about the Ravens Safeties makes me sad. Huff and Elam. I pictured that as a legit option for us a month ago. They complement eachother well. And watch Reid be a pro bowler in SF. Even Dashon Goldson wasn't as good as he was made out to be in that scheme, when you have a front 7 like theirs, it's going to highlight all his strengths and mask all his weaknesses.
I never got on the Elam bandwagon. Too wreckless with his body and he doesn't have the frame to hold that up. I actually like his teammate Josh Evans better.

Drewy hated Reid... but I was with you. I did have a thing for Reid, I think he could be great in SF. But I never wanted a S in the first. Too deep. Many consider Reid more of a second round guy too. So it's sort of the same thing... aka taking a 2nd round guy in the 1st debate. Just at a different position. OL was my #1 priority, but at 18, the OL I wanted (Armstead/Watson) were bad values too. So in the end, I'm pleased. If we were at 18, I would've wanted Eifert. He was the only elite player left that I saw on the board there.

Not a fan of Floyd or Sly. So I'm really happy we didn't get them. I would've wanted Datone Jones if we took a DT.
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Old 04-26-2013, 12:41 PM    (permalink
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I like the way your put together this post. I do agree that the Cowboys come into Day 2 in a power position. We have 3 picks today and we've been talking A LOT about how the strength of this draft is in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.

When I look at what the Giants and Bears did in taking Pugh and Long right after us... If you look at that value versus Frederick.... I'd way rather have Frederick and that 3rd than Pugh or Long by themselves.

Frederick is NASTY! I'm listening to ESPN Dallas Radio right now. His old Wisconsin OL coach who is now at Arkansas just said Travis broke several of his teammates arms and wrists in practice throwing them down to the ground. Talked about his nasty streak and said he had to talk to Travis "Hey we can't have that now. These are our own guys". Great listen if it's ever put on a podcast. Fitz and Durrett have been bashing the pick all day, but after this interview they got happy about the pick.
Which is good. We don't have a nasty guy up front that consistantly finishes their blocks and punishes people. Probably haven't since Larry Allen or Erik Williams. Which is why I'm still interested in Winters assuming we don't trade or anything and he's still on the board with that 80th pick.
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Old 04-26-2013, 12:45 PM    (permalink
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I never got on the Elam bandwagon. Too wreckless with his body and he doesn't have the frame to hold that up. I actually like his teammate Josh Evans better.

Drewy hated Reid... but I was with you. I did have a thing for Reid, I think he could be great in SF. But I never wanted a S in the first. Too deep. Many consider Reid more of a second round guy too. So it's sort of the same thing... aka taking a 2nd round guy in the 1st debate. Just at a different position. OL was my #1 priority, but at 18, the OL I wanted (Armstead/Watson) were bad values too. So in the end, I'm pleased. If we were at 18, I would've wanted Eifert. He was the only elite player left that I saw on the board there.

Not a fan of Floyd or Sly. So I'm really happy we didn't get them. I would've wanted Datone Jones if we took a DT.
I like Cyprien in the 2nd, but I HAVE to believe he's off the board as soon as the Bengals select.

Same as liking Short, but would be shocked if he gets past the Raiders at 42 and Bucs at 43.
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Old 04-26-2013, 12:45 PM    (permalink
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You guys got an interior linemen from Wisconsin. No one should be upset about that.
I don't get it either. Even if he got picked 15 picks too early, that's nothing to fuss about. Dallas finally takes an interior OL and addresses the trenches.. the one thing people loved to bash them for ignoring all these years... "Cowboys always take flashy picks and never address the important trenches"... Now they do and people are up in arms. You can't win....

Anyways, I'm looking forward to today's moves. Lots to talk about. I'm putting together my list for today right now. I'm excited with the value available!
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Old 04-26-2013, 12:53 PM    (permalink
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I don't get it either. Even if he got picked 15 picks too early, that's nothing to fuss about. Dallas finally takes an interior OL and addresses the trenches.. the one thing people loved to bash them for ignoring all these years... "Cowboys always take flashy picks and never address the important trenches"... Now they do and people are up in arms. You can't win....

Anyways, I'm looking forward to today's moves. Lots to talk about. I'm putting together my list for today right now. I'm excited with the value available!
My favorite guys that could end up in Dallas today:

DE Demontre Moore
DE Alex Okafor
DT Kawaan Short
DT Bennie Logan
S Johnathan Cyprien
S Phillip Thomas

Give just about any combination of those guys, and I'm pumped for next season! I'd say every single one of those players carried a first round grade at some point over the last year.
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Old 04-26-2013, 12:56 PM    (permalink
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I just dont know why everybody wants to give Jerry the benifit of the doubt? How many times has he reached on a player and that player turned into a stud? Its like he trades back just to trade back and has no idea what to do when we are up. I mean I get that we are all Cowboy fans and hope he does good but IMO its not a good pick. Jerry doesnt know how to work the draft but hopes people thinks he does cuz he makes a bunch of trades. At 31 we should have went Safety. At 47 we take Fredrick and IF hes not there, we take Schwenke, Jones, Short, Warford, Winter, Quessenberry, whoever. The point is, that somebody just as good would be there at 47 as we took at 31. Just my 2 cents
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:08 PM    (permalink
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I just dont know why everybody wants to give Jerry the benifit of the doubt? How many times has he reached on a player and that player turned into a stud? Its like he trades back just to trade back and has no idea what to do when we are up. I mean I get that we are all Cowboy fans and hope he does good but IMO its not a good pick. Jerry doesnt know how to work the draft but hopes people thinks he does cuz he makes a bunch of trades. At 31 we should have went Safety. At 47 we take Fredrick and IF hes not there, we take Schwenke, Jones, Short, Warford, Winter, Quessenberry, whoever. The point is, that somebody just as good would be there at 47 as we took at 31. Just my 2 cents
I'm telling you that whoever we select at 47 (assuming we don't trade down), will have the same grade at Frederick. The problem is of the offensive linemen you just named, either are zone guys (Schwenke, Quessenberry), don't play center (Warford), or doesn't have this tiergrade (Jones)

Again you're assuming that Dallas thought Frederick is the 47th rated player in the draft. It was assumed Dallas had about 16 players rated as 1st round prospects and after that it's hard to tell who they have rated as 2nd round prospects. It could be 30 players. Now if you're 16 first rounders are off the board, why does it matter that Frederick was selected at 31? The team probably has a similiar grade to Eric Reid, Johnathan Cyprien, Sylvester Williams, Kawaan Short, ect.... so if they were scared that Frederick wouldn't be there, then you absolutely select him. Especially if you've identified the interior of your line as your biggest area of need.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:08 PM    (permalink
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I just dont know why everybody wants to give Jerry the benifit of the doubt? How many times has he reached on a player and that player turned into a stud? Its like he trades back just to trade back and has no idea what to do when we are up. I mean I get that we are all Cowboy fans and hope he does good but IMO its not a good pick. Jerry doesnt know how to work the draft but hopes people thinks he does cuz he makes a bunch of trades. At 31 we should have went Safety. At 47 we take Fredrick and IF hes not there, we take Schwenke, Jones, Short, Warford, Winter, Quessenberry, whoever. The point is, that somebody just as good would be there at 47 as we took at 31. Just my 2 cents
I don't feel like I'm giving Jerry the benefit of the doubt. If anything, I'm giving Garrett the benefit of the doubt. Jerry/Stephen made this trade, but Garrrett took the player.

At 31 the Safety I would've taken is Cyprien... but even then, he's a 4.6 guy and a SS. If there was an elite FS available, then sure. But there wasn't. I took Schwenke in Round 4 of our forum mock. Taking him in Round 2 would've made me scratch my head.

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Old 04-26-2013, 01:19 PM    (permalink
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Sooooo lets get down to the real question, Who will be our new coach in 2014?
Lol I kid (I think) I hope your right but Im just not digging it. I have a feeling we'll go Logan in the 2nd and use one of our 3rd's on Tyler Wilson. Just a hunch
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:23 PM    (permalink
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The real question, do we think Leon Sandcastle will be there at 47?
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:28 PM    (permalink
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Sooooo lets get down to the real question, Who will be our new coach in 2014?
Lol I kid (I think) I hope your right but Im just not digging it. I have a feeling we'll go Logan in the 2nd and use one of our 3rd's on Tyler Wilson. Just a hunch
Jon Gruden

And I think Dallas drafts a QB, but I'd have NO idea who it is.

I like some things about Wilson, Bray, Dysert, Scott ... but I don't love any of them except for Geno Smith.

I wonder if Dooley's input might lead to Bray if Bray is setting there in the 4th.

If not, I'd assume we certainly sign that Eastern Washington kid as an UDFA.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:35 PM    (permalink
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I just dont know why everybody wants to give Jerry the benifit of the doubt? How many times has he reached on a player and that player turned into a stud? Its like he trades back just to trade back and has no idea what to do when we are up. I mean I get that we are all Cowboy fans and hope he does good but IMO its not a good pick. Jerry doesnt know how to work the draft but hopes people thinks he does cuz he makes a bunch of trades. At 31 we should have went Safety. At 47 we take Fredrick and IF hes not there, we take Schwenke, Jones, Short, Warford, Winter, Quessenberry, whoever. The point is, that somebody just as good would be there at 47 as we took at 31. Just my 2 cents


I agree with you on your premise 100%, that would be my preference as well. And I know for me, I fully admit Jerry doesn't know how to maneuver in the draft and we didn't get value on that trade back also, that's a given. But that doesn't mean I think Frederick will suck even though I realize all of the latter, or that I want him to suck to prove that Jerry is a bad GM which I knew before today.


In hindsight, if Frederick ends up considered a very good starting Guard in the league and Floyd is a bust it'll look like a solid decision, especially if we hit on the 3rd. Once it's done, nothing I can do but try and hope it pans out, but even though we butchered the process I'd have been much more angry with a flashy position like WR or RB which I felt Jerry could have screwed up and done also.


Hell if it were up to me I'd have tried to move up for Warmack but that was just my initial feelings. Sucks now, hate that we never seem to have a good grip on the draft process itself, but I'm just looking forward to see how we finish Day 2 at this point. If Barrett Jones goes to the Jets at 39(who I wanted with our 2nd or 3rd) I'm not going to buy that we reached all that bad.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:35 PM    (permalink
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Jon Gruden

And I think Dallas drafts a QB, but I'd have NO idea who it is.

I like some things about Wilson, Bray, Dysert, Scott ... but I don't love any of them except for Geno Smith.

I wonder if Dooley's input might lead to Bray if Bray is setting there in the 4th.

If not, I'd assume we certainly sign that Eastern Washington kid as an UDFA.
I don't see us taking a QB, but if we did, my favorite guy is Bray.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:36 PM    (permalink
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Sooooo lets get down to the real question, Who will be our new coach in 2014?
Lol I kid (I think) I hope your right but Im just not digging it. I have a feeling we'll go Logan in the 2nd and use one of our 3rd's on Tyler Wilson. Just a hunch
I wouldn't hate any QB in the 3rd, I'd feel pretty good about it actually. Just sucks that Garrett is probably gonna have a big hand in picking the QB and he won't be here for him to start. I still LOVE Matt Scott, if we could take him with that 3rd(74) I'd be all over it.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:36 PM    (permalink
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Look, this whole deal boils down to how well they do with this 2nd and two 3rd round picks. This has a chance to be a very good draft if the picks hit.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:37 PM    (permalink
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I agree with you on your premise 100%, that would be my preference as well. And I know for me, I fully admit Jerry doesn't know how to maneuver in the draft and we didn't get value on that trade back also, that's a given. But that doesn't mean I think Frederick will suck even though I realize all of the latter, or that I want him to suck to prove that Jerry is a bad GM which I knew before today.


In hindsight, if Frederick ends up considered a very good starting Guard in the league and Floyd is a bust it'll look like a solid decision, especially if we hit on the 3rd. Once it's done, nothing I can do but try and hope it pans out, but even though we butchered the process I'd have been much more angry with a flashy position like WR or RB which I felt Jerry could have screwed up and done also.


Hell if it were up to me I'd have tried to move up for Warmack but that was just my initial feelings. Sucks now, hate that we never seem to have a good grip on the draft process itself, but I'm just looking forward to see how we finish Day 2 at this point. If Barrett Jones goes to the Jets at 39(who I wanted with our 2nd or 3rd) I'm not going to buy that we reached all that bad.
I hope Barrett Jones is still an option. :)
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:37 PM    (permalink
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I don't see us taking a QB, but if we did, my favorite guy is Bray.
He's my favorite developmental guy too but I think Garrett is going to see him and say "no thanks" pretty quickly. I could see Bray going to Arizona and being really good in a few years.
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I guarantee that if someone picks Cam Newton in the Top 5 they will regret it.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:38 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Rev Bolyard View Post
Jon Gruden

And I think Dallas drafts a QB, but I'd have NO idea who it is.

I like some things about Wilson, Bray, Dysert, Scott ... but I don't love any of them except for Geno Smith.

I wonder if Dooley's input might lead to Bray if Bray is setting there in the 4th.

If not, I'd assume we certainly sign that Eastern Washington kid as an UDFA.
Well we already have Gruden's DC when he won a SB....

I'm willing to give Garrett a chance now that he's given up playcalling though.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:50 PM    (permalink
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I agree with you. I think there's a ton of overreaction to this pick. I agree that it's a bit too early for him, but virtually all the OL went early. Hell, there were 2 guards in the top 10! How unprecedented is that!? It's a weird draft.

So all the folks yelling about taking a 2nd round guy too early, would you have been okay with Frederick at 33?

Franklin I think Long and Pugh were a much bigger reach than Frederick.

Now, the trade is something I think we all agree that we didn't get enough value.
The fact that both Cooper and Warmack went in the top 10 should really show that teams have a premium on interior lineman, and that could mean that anyone was targeting Frederick. From what I'm hearing he's supposed to be the top rated center on a lot of team's boards, but that could be hearsay. We know for a fact that he's the top rated center on the Cowboys' board because they took him. They've needed a center for two years now, and the OL was the worst part of the team by far last season. Moving down, picking up another pick, and getting your top center that could also play guard isn't a bad deal at all. DT would have been sexy, but OL is far more of an issue here. The OL is really hurting the stars on the team, and I'm glad they addressed it. They need to find a way to keep Romo from getting killed while opening up bigger lanes to make Murray and whoever they draft studs.

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I just dont know why everybody wants to give Jerry the benifit of the doubt? How many times has he reached on a player and that player turned into a stud? Its like he trades back just to trade back and has no idea what to do when we are up. I mean I get that we are all Cowboy fans and hope he does good but IMO its not a good pick. Jerry doesnt know how to work the draft but hopes people thinks he does cuz he makes a bunch of trades. At 31 we should have went Safety. At 47 we take Fredrick and IF hes not there, we take Schwenke, Jones, Short, Warford, Winter, Quessenberry, whoever. The point is, that somebody just as good would be there at 47 as we took at 31. Just my 2 cents
It's less of giving Jerry the benefit of the doubt and seeing the logic in their pick. Frederick is the top rated C on their board, and they are really high on him. Center was a huge need, and they filled it when their top targets got picked right before him. I didn't watch Frederick, so the guy could be a stud. Hell I was a little upset that they went with Sean Lee as opposed to a safety, but they were oh so right on that pick. I still want them to go safety, but the scouting department isn't that bad now like when they picked Quincy.

You also have to see that this is a Garrett pick through and through. The guy was smiling like he just got a blowjob when they picked him, and he was genuinely raving about Frederick in the press conference. I have more faith in Garrett than Jerry. I know Jerry is a bit crazy, but since Garrett has been the coach the drafts have been solid. I'm just going to wait it out to see how good it ends up because I like the versatility and smarts of Frederick on paper, and getting a center when Costya was set to be starter is one of the many things I wanted this offseason. I understand some of the frustration with wanting another player, but I can't knock filling a huge need. Besides, isn't safety and DT supposed to be deep this year?
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Old 04-26-2013, 02:01 PM    (permalink
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Here's my wish list for the day:

2nd - DT - Short, Logan or Hill
3rd - S Swearinger or Thomas
3rd - RB - Bell or Randle
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Old 04-26-2013, 02:20 PM    (permalink
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I'm also kinda infatuated with idea of Ellington.
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Old 04-26-2013, 02:51 PM    (permalink
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@Edwerderespn: Based on my random survey of five teams, here is where Cowboys No. 1 Travis Frederick was on draft boards: 4th (1), 5th (2), 6 (1), 6-7 (1)

How much more proof do you guys need that this was a terrible pick? Massive reach.

Say what you want, he would have been available at 47 and probably later.
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Old 04-26-2013, 02:53 PM    (permalink
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I never got on the Elam bandwagon. Too wreckless with his body and he doesn't have the frame to hold that up. I actually like his teammate Josh Evans better.

Drewy hated Reid... but I was with you. I did have a thing for Reid, I think he could be great in SF. But I never wanted a S in the first. Too deep. Many consider Reid more of a second round guy too. So it's sort of the same thing... aka taking a 2nd round guy in the 1st debate. Just at a different position. OL was my #1 priority, but at 18, the OL I wanted (Armstead/Watson) were bad values too. So in the end, I'm pleased. If we were at 18, I would've wanted Eifert. He was the only elite player left that I saw on the board there.

Not a fan of Floyd or Sly. So I'm really happy we didn't get them. I would've wanted Datone Jones if we took a DT.
Dude, Elam has the most stout frame on any safety in the class. Pure muscle and compact. Again, you're making stuff up.
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