The Official Training Camp thread. - Page 31

AntoinCD · 08-21-2012, 10:32 AM

I think when looking at bad teams turning it around you have to look at the whole thing in context.

Carolina had a pretty decent turnaround last year, however they are actually a relatively talented team. The offensive line is pretty solid and the running game is definitely a strong point. Steve Smith having a comeback year also really helped.

Defensively they also have some very good players at all 3 levels.

Adding Cam Newton to the mix added just enough of a spark to make them a relatively competitive team and he had a rookie year that has never been seen. Over 4000 yards passing with 21TDs and 700 yards rushing and 14TDs.

They also played a very poor Bucs team twice who quit down the stretch, the worst in the NFL Colts, a horrendous Jags team, a poor Redskins team and the Vikings. With all that being said they only managed to win 6 games.

When looking at Detroit's turnaround recently, it took them a number of years and some home run picks in the draft.

The Colts will be better this year than last. I can make that statement with full confidence. However that doesn't gaurantee a significant improvement in the win loss column. This is a multi year project that Pagano will have to undergo. In the NFL any team can beat any team. The Chiefs beat the unbeaten Packers last year, the Browns beat the Patriots the year before etc. However in general any team with a significant weakness will be exploited week in, week out, and at this moment in time the Colts have numerous gaping holes on their roster.

K Train · 08-21-2012, 11:26 AM

it looks like mike wallace is reporting today, giving him 19 days to sign a long term deal or he will be a FA at the end of the season

gpngc · 08-22-2012, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrdrylie

I just saw this and this serves as proof that the Andrew Luck dick sucking train has gotten way out of control. We may think Luck is going to be great, but the guy has taken as many meaningful NFL snaps as I have. At this point, you can't even say the Colts will have the advantage at QB even against Jacksonville and Minnesota, let alone guys like Schuab or Cassel. Yes, he has looked pretty good so far. But it is preseason. you know who else has looked very good this preseason? Blaine Gabbert! So it means nothing. When teams actually start game planning for him and going 100% in the regular season, he is going to take his lumps. He is not going to be a 4000 yard 30 TD 12 INT guy year one.

Luck will be better than Cassel right from the start. Again, watch Luck tape. He's the best QB prospect (and most pro-ready) in modern history in an era when rookie QBs transition almost seamlessly and are set up for success. That's not dick sucking - it's scouting and projection.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuperPacker

Wow. This just took off to a whole new level.

It's shocking how good people expect Luck to be in his first season. He's set up for failure now.

The Colts won't have the better QB is 10 out of 16 games.

@ Cutler
Ponder
Gabbert
Rodgers
@ Sanchbow
Weeden
@ Locker
Tannehill
@ Gabbert
@ Brady
Fitzmagic
@ Stafford
Locker
Schaub
@ Cassel
Schaub

So they PROBABLY have the better QB in 5 of their 16 games. Jake Locker is arguable, but they actually chose him over Hasselbeck (who was better last year than Luck will be this year). And don't forget that in basically every game they play, if you take out the QB's, they will have the worse team. I echo what others have said. 4-6 wins.

Andrew Luck has been and always will be better than Jake freaking Locker who is hilariously innaccurate compared to Luck. I understand people don't watch Pac-12 football late on the East Coast and get their info from ESPN highlights.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeerBaron

It would be downright impressive for any head coach to ever be as inept as Caldwell. Caldwell didn't seem to know anything beyond "insert Peyton Manning, win games."

Agree with this.

In this thread:

Donald Brown had like a 4.8 or 5 ypc last year and played well in the 2nd half of the seaosn. He doesn't look like a bust at all anymore. No one saw it but Colts fans though, because no one else watched the Colts except hardcore fans and Colts fans.

The Colts defense this year has just as much talent as Carolina's last year, if not more. Beason was out, their safeties were horrible, they had Gamble, pretty good but not much impact plays Charles Johnson, and not much else. The Colts have two or three legit pass rushers, a very good safety and an awesome ILB when he comes back healthy. Zbikowski's also a big upgrade at SS.

And my main points about defensive improvement, that no one has a rebuttal for are:

A) Having a better offense indisputably helps the defense.
B) Pagano and the 3-4 transition will help.
C) They don't play that many good offenses.

For clarification for everyone sarcastically saying the Colts are going to win double digit games:

I doubt they get 10 wins, but they could.

I think they fall between 7-9 and 9-7.

*I also am not that high on Houston, so this obviously ties into my Colts predictions. I think Houston will be around 8-8 or 9-7 and the Colts can definitely beat them (I think they did last year?).

BeerBaron · 08-22-2012, 08:44 AM

I don't want to dredge this argument back up in full, but look a few pages back from my comparison to last year's Panthers team.

If you call Steve Smith and Reggie Wayne a wash, the entirety of that Panthers team was better AND got one of the greatest rookie QB seasons of all time out of Cam Newton and STILL went 6-10.

I just don't think it's realistic to project better than that for this Colts team.

K Train · 08-22-2012, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeerBaron

I don't want to dredge this argument back up in full, but look a few pages back from my comparison to last year's Panthers team.

If you call Steve Smith and Reggie Wayne a wash, the entirety of that Panthers team was better AND got one of the greatest rookie QB seasons of all time out of Cam Newton and STILL went 6-10.

I just don't think it's realistic to project better than that for this Colts team.

i wouldnt really call 6-10 and 7-9 or 8-8 THAT big of a difference and realisitcally the panthers lost some close games last year, they were in games pretty frequently which is what im indicating the colts will do, be at least competitive

Giantsfan1080 · 08-22-2012, 02:27 PM

Witten doesn't need surgery on his spleen.

Ness · 08-22-2012, 02:34 PM

Carolina's problem was that dreadful defense. I will be interesting to see how the Colts fare in that department this season. Especially since it's a new scheme with a new coaching staff in place. They do have Greg Manusky, which I would be concerned about. He wasn't very good here in San Francsico with what he tried to do and the same goes for San Diego, which is why he was dismissed. But Chuck Pagano is in charge now, and he is mainly a defensive minded coach.

BeerBaron · 08-22-2012, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Giantsfan1080

Witten doesn't need surgery on his spleen.

Well that's a positive for them. Still, depending on how long he needs to heal with R&R, he could miss some regular season time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ness

Carolina's problem was that dreadful defense. I will be interesting to see how the Colts fare in that department this season. Especially since it's a new scheme with a new coaching staff in place. They do have Greg Manusky, which I would be concerned about. He wasn't very good here in San Francsico with what he tried to do and the same goes for San Diego, which is why he was dismissed. But Chuck Pagano is in charge now, and he is mainly a defensive minded coach.

Yeah, I don't think the Colts is really all that much better than the Panthers. And if it is, it's only slightly better and not enough to make up the offensive deficiencies they have in comparison. They have Mathis and Freeney...both of whom are aging and learning new positions. The rest of their talent doesn't seem to translate particularly well to the new defensive scheme either, even if it's hybrided quite a bit.

DoughBoy · 08-22-2012, 06:22 PM

Allow me to do some Tits horn tooting

2011 draft class-

Jake Locker-Starter
Akeem Ayers- Starter
Jurrell Casey- Starter
Colin McCarthy-Starter
Karl Klug- Our best pass rusher
Tommie Campbell- Starting nickle corner.

That is one sick draft class. Not bad for a rookie coach.

BeerBaron · 08-22-2012, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DoughBoy

Allow me to do some Tits horn tooting

2011 draft class-

Jake Locker-Starter
Akeem Ayers- Starter
Jurrell Casey- Starter
Colin McCarthy-Starter
Karl Klug- Our best pass rusher
Tommie Campbell- Starting nickle corner.

That is one sick draft class. Not bad for a rookie coach.

That's uh...not saying a whole lot.

Hines · 08-23-2012, 06:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DoughBoy

Allow me to do some Tits horn tooting

2011 draft class-

Jake Locker-Starter
Akeem Ayers- Starter
Jurrell Casey- Starter
Colin McCarthy-Starter
Karl Klug- Our best pass rusher
Tommie Campbell- Starting nickle corner.

That is one sick draft class. Not bad for a rookie coach.

Glad to see Tommie Campbell doing well after all he's been through and out of football for a while. He was BIG TIME in Western PA in HS, but couldn't stay out of trouble and couldn't find a position at Pitt.

BeerBaron · 08-23-2012, 07:03 AM

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...-in-green-bay/

So after all the Packers talking up of Harrell, he could now be getting cut. So what do they do then? Sign someone who has been cut elsewhere and just hope they can pick up the offense quickly?

Quote:

He’s completed 27-of-51 passes (52.9 percent) for 235 yards (4.6 YPA), one touchdown, and two interceptions.

Those are some downright Gabbert-esque stats...yuck.

Hines · 08-23-2012, 07:06 AM

Colt McCoy and/or TJax will be on the Packers.

descendency · 08-23-2012, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeerBaron

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...-in-green-bay/

So after all the Packers talking up of Harrell, he could now be getting cut. So what do they do then? Sign someone who has been cut elsewhere and just hope they can pick up the offense quickly?

Those are some downright Gabbert-esque stats...yuck.

Trade of Tebow. If the Packers can make Matt Flynn a decent QB, then imagine what they could do with Tebow.

BeerBaron · 08-23-2012, 08:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hines

Colt McCoy and/or TJax will be on the Packers.

I would also throw David Garrard onto that list. I don't think Miami keeps him and Moore, and with him missing the preseason due to injury, he's the likely goner of the two.

Quote:

Originally Posted by descendency

Trade of Tebow. If the Packers can make Matt Flynn a decent QB, then imagine what they could do with Tebow.

Let's not even joke about such things.

Giantsfan1080 · 08-23-2012, 10:30 AM

Wayne Hunter has been demoted and moved to TE. I wonder if they're giving Kareem McKenzie a call.

Jughead10 · 08-23-2012, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Giantsfan1080

Wayne Hunter has been demoted and moved to TE. I wonder if they're giving Kareem McKenzie a call.

Haha he sucks but at least he wouldn't be seeing JPP again this year.

Giantsfan1080 · 08-23-2012, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jughead10

Haha he sucks but at least he wouldn't be seeing JPP again this year.

Jets fans should be sending the Giants thank you notes for finally making sure the coaching staff realize how absolutely terrible he was.

Jughead10 · 08-23-2012, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Giantsfan1080

Jets fans should be sending the Giants thank you notes for finally making sure the coaching staff realize how absolutely terrible he was.

So when are the Jets getting a new QB then?

Giantsfan1080 · 08-23-2012, 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jughead10

So when are the Jets getting a new QB then?

They already did. I was listening to Ryan this morning on an interview and he's delusional about the offense. He actually thinks now that the WildCat is back in the offense that they are going to start scoring again. Cites the years with Brad Smith.

Jughead10 · 08-23-2012, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Giantsfan1080

They already did. I was listening to Ryan this morning on an interview and he's delusional about the offense. He actually thinks now that the WildCat is back in the offense that they are going to start scoring again. Cites the years with Brad Smith.

I mean a real QB. They're the new Miami Dolphins. They're collecting **** QBs. Rex couldn't care less about the offense. His OC could tell him that Sanchez is poised for a 6000 yd season and he'd believe it and repeat it to the media.

Giantsfan1080 · 08-23-2012, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jughead10

I mean a real QB. They're the new Miami Dolphins. They're collecting **** QBs.

I obviously agree with you but they are delusional. Believe me when I tell you Ryan doesn't see a problem with the offense.

K Train · 08-23-2012, 11:03 AM

Little write up about decastro and his locking down of the RG spot because he creates on-field sexual magic

Quote:

At some point during nearly every NFL player’s rookie season, there is a moment of realization that ultimately defines a career.
For some, it’s understanding that shutting down that defensive end from East Carolina was infinitely easier than containing Terrell Suggs. That the tackles they broke in college are tackles behind the line of scrimmage in the everybody-is-good NFL. That the degree they once considered a nicety but not a necessity might be required after all.
These are the guys that don’t make it.
For the fortunate ones, the game slows down, the hits suddenly don’t seem as hard, the playbook isn’t as indecipherable as it once was. Right about then, they correctly perceive they will have an NFL career that is measured in seasons, not just in weeks.
These are the David DeCastros of the NFL.
DeCastro, the right guard who will become — barring injury — only the fourth rookie lineman to start a Pittsburgh season opener, isn’t about to proclaim he has arrived or that his transition from Stanford to the Steelers is complete. Then again, arguably the quietest player in the locker room doesn’t proclaim much at all.
“When I was playing beside him, I was like, ‘Am I talking too much to you?’ He said, ‘No, no you’re fine, it’s me, I’m just quiet,’ ” Ramon Foster said Wednesday. “That’s just him. You can’t get a bead on him.”
Even if offensive line coach Sean Kugler thinks he has.
“He doesn’t make mistakes, he’s physical and he understands the game,” Kugler said. “He has made drastic improvements, and I think that’s what he is going to be all about.”
DeCastro’s speak-when-spoken-to demeanor was misread early on by some as being confusion, but his play in the first two preseason games has quieted that talk.
“His technique has gotten a lot better, and his double-team blocks (are impressive),” center Maurkice Pouncey said. “He’s finishing, man, you can see it. He’s driving guys to the ground and running down the field whenever we have long runs. It’s exciting to watch.”
Even if the 6-foot-5, 316-pound DeCastro manages to hide any excitement. He is businesslike at all times, even during the sometimes lively position meetings in which his fellow linemen often must coax him to open up.
“It’s a great group of guys,” DeCastro said.
For DeCastro, this is a virtual monologue.
Asked if he feels any more comfortable now than he did when camp opened nearly a month ago, DeCastro replied, “It’s going all right. … It’s just a process getting there. I’m sure I’ll get more comfortable every day.”
Left tackle Max Starks believes DeCastro is close to being there already, even though a truly accurate assessment of the rookie’s progression can’t be made until the regular season arrives in 2½ weeks.
“He’s a very intelligent kid, and he’s also a very physical individual,” Starks said. “Now that everything has slowed down for him, I think he’s starting to play a lot more settled. Therefore, he’s allowed to be more physical because he’s not having to think as much.”
Not that thinking has ever been a problem for a student who had a 4.06 grade-point average in high school and was a management, science and engineering major at Stanford.
“I’ve got to give it to him. He’s been a pro about everything; he knows the book,” Foster said, referring to the playbook. “The physical part will come. It’s a longer season, and I’m sure he’ll handle it well. Most rookies have a wall, but I think he’s a unique guy and I honestly don’t think he’ll hit it.”
What Foster likes is that DeCastro is the kind of “road grader” that all good running backs and quarterbacks seem to have in front of them — a player who, despite his size, possesses good feet, good hands and excellent flexibility.
“He’s going really fast,” Foster said.
And, to Kugler, it’s in the right direction.
“I don’t expect to look back when it comes to David DeCastro,” he said.

http://triblive.com/sports/steelers/...d-nfl-physical

LonghornsLegend · 08-23-2012, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by K Train

it looks like mike wallace is reporting today, giving him 19 days to sign a long term deal or he will be a FA at the end of the season

Speaking of Wallace, the Colts could end up being an interesting landing spot to re-connect with Arians and be Luck' #1 WR. I like that fit on paper, but then again I can think of a ton of great fits for Wallace.

K Train · 08-23-2012, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornsLegend

Speaking of Wallace, the Colts could end up being an interesting landing spot to re-connect with Arians and be Luck' #1 WR. I like that fit on paper, but then again I can think of a ton of great fits for Wallace.

colts and dolphins seem like good fits. Id be pissed at anything less than a #1 pick for him though. If deion branch goes for a 1, chad johnson gets offered 2 firsts for, and brandon marshall goes for 2 seconds wallace is definitely worth a first rounder.

i expect him to play this year, probably get some pretty big numbers because brown has elevated himself to a new level this year and i would expect sanders to emerge under haley....but if they dont sign him long term i bet he gets franchised and really really pissed off next season