Geno Smith, QB, West Virginia - Page 7

P-L · 10-01-2012, 04:32 PM

I can't say that the system and garbage competition he faces doesn't make me nervous at all, but I won't kill him over it either. Honestly, these wide open passing spread offenses mask the deficiencies of wide receivers more than they do for quarterbacks. Regardless of any of that, he does look like the best quarterback in the country. I do have him comfortably above Matt Barkley at the moment, but I still don't think he's someone to go nuts over (like Luck or RGIII last year).

I do think people are overrating his performance against LSU last year a bit. I thought it was ok or maybe even good, but far from great. He did throw for a lot of yards, but also threw the ball 60-70 times. His YPA wasn't that impressive considering the offense he plays in. I also recall a sub-60% completion percentage and a couple of turnovers. It was an impressive performance considering the opponent, but I've seen people act like he had a really great game.

y.f.s. · 10-01-2012, 04:45 PM

I mean...it's important to evaluate a player's system in the context of understanding what he's asked to do, but at the end of the day, you still have to just isolate his traits and try to project them - independently of surrounding talent, opposing talent, system, etc (I'm paraphrasing Cosell a bit here, but that's is probably the most poignant evaluation stance I've ever heard him make).

For instance, WVU has a read option play that's similar to what Baylor did with RG3 (and I've also seen the Redskins run it). QB reads the weakside alley player and, depending on his pursuit, can choose to either give it to a runningback or hit the backside pass combo. Some people will call it "gimmick" offense, but I fail to see who it's any different conceptually than what a traditional zone bootleg pass. It's the same damn thing.

So back to projectable traits: eye-level? Elite. Pocket movement and comfort? Elite. Ability to play within compressed spaces? Elite from what I've personally seen. Arm talent (not in terms of pure velocity, but in terms of functional arm strength and ball placement)? Elite.

He's the real deal.

onejayhawk · 10-01-2012, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rosebud

Can you imagine how good he'd be if he had the maturity of a 28 year old?

Who?

Speaking of 28 year olds, Weeden is proving the Browns were smart.

J

bruschis4all · 10-02-2012, 09:30 AM

Geno was 38/65 463 yards with two td's and 2 int's. Against LSU last year. Really looking forward to see how he does against Texas this week. Most good college offenses protect the qb so well we don't get to see how they do against a pass rush. Maybe, Texas can get in his face and we'll what happens.

Pontus · 10-03-2012, 02:19 AM

Debated who is the best pro comparision for Geno Smith. Thinking it may be Aaron Rodgers. Totally off?

Babylon · 10-03-2012, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pontus

Debated who is the best pro comparision for Geno Smith. Thinking it may be Aaron Rodgers. Totally off?

Not seeing Rodgers mobility to be honest. I'd go with Sam Bradford.

Don Vito · 10-03-2012, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pontus

Debated who is the best pro comparision for Geno Smith. Thinking it may be Aaron Rodgers. Totally off?

He reminds me of Alex Smith when he was coming out of Utah. I know that name sets of a **** storm, but they have a lot of similarities as prospects,

y.f.s. · 10-03-2012, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pontus

Debated who is the best pro comparision for Geno Smith. Thinking it may be Aaron Rodgers. Totally off?

I like Warren Moon or Ken Anderson as comps. That deep ball accuracy is like "woah" and totally eliminates an Alex Smith comp for me. That and his eye level is better than Alex's has been at any point - Heisman campaign included.

He's got a strong arm but is still a touch thrower, so I can see where a Bradford comp would come from.

I can see Rodgers to a certain point, too, if we're talking about college Aaron Rodgers and not RoboQB Aaron Rodgers.

scottyboy · 10-03-2012, 12:07 PM

Dante Culpepper because they're both black QBs, lawls

DanDanE420 · 10-03-2012, 09:09 PM

His calmness in the pocket actually reminds me of Tom Brady. He stands very tall.

kwilk103 · 10-06-2012, 10:31 PM

not his best game vs texas

25/35 269yds 4td 0 int; 2 fumbles off of sacks though

went 10/11 in the 2nd half

vidae · 10-06-2012, 10:32 PM

Future Chief y'all.

PossibleCabbage · 10-06-2012, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vidae

Future Chief y'all.

I'm not sure you want to be aiming for the #1 overall pick in week 5 of the NFL season...

You might have to settle for Barkley.

descendency · 10-06-2012, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwilk103

not his best game vs texas

25/35 269yds 4td 0 int; 2 fumbles off of sacks though

went 10/11 in the 2nd half

Still pretty good. Too bad it won't be on replay, because it was on Fox :(

PossibleCabbage · 10-06-2012, 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by descendency

Still pretty good. Too bad it won't be on replay, because it was on Fox :(

I think it's a great game. He managed 4 TDs and a 71% completion rate against a good defense, with a lot of pressure in his face.

It's not as good as his game against Baylor, but Texas's defense is a lot better than Baylor's. The Longhorns have some legitimate defensive talent on the DL and in the secondary.

farfromforgotten · 10-07-2012, 06:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PossibleCabbage

I think it's a great game. He managed 4 TDs and a 71% completion rate against a good defense, with a lot of pressure in his face.

It's not as good as his game against Baylor, but Texas's defense is a lot better than Baylor's. The Longhorns have some legitimate defensive talent on the DL and in the secondary.

Agreed.

People will be able to take a lot more away from this game than the Baylor game. I need to watch the game again as I've been on-call at work the past couple days and had to go in for some night shifts... my mind wasn't all there during the game last night.

farfromforgotten · 10-07-2012, 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwilk103

not his best game vs texas

25/35 269yds 4td 0 int; 2 fumbles off of sacks though

went 10/11 in the 2nd half

Updated Geno tracker: 1996 YRDS 24 TDS 0 INTS 81% COMP 204 ATTS

vidae · 10-07-2012, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PossibleCabbage

I'm not sure you want to be aiming for the #1 overall pick in week 5 of the NFL season...

You might have to settle for Barkley.

That is exactly what I want to be aiming for.

TACKLE · 10-08-2012, 04:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by y.f.s.

Arm talent (not in terms of pure velocity, but in terms of functional arm strength and ball placement)? Elite.

Can you clarify the difference between 'functional arm strength' and regular arm strength? I don't think any prospect's arm in this draft is being judged by whether or not they can throw the ball through the uprights off their knees from the 50 yard line or whether he or any other QB can throw it 75 yards in the air at a pro day workout. All we have is so far is what we've seen on the field so as I understand it functional arm strength is all we're really going off right now? (really not trying to be snarky with ya, tone is tricky on the interwebz)

Is he an elite passer right now? Hard to argue with his efficiency at all three levels of the field. I would say he might be the best pure 'passer' since Bradford (who I loved). But would I say he's an elite arm talent or "thrower of the football"? No. His arm is solid. Most of his 'wow' throws are because of great touch and placement more so than velocity. You see him really stepping up and driving his downfield throws which is not meant as a knock, but he can't quite throws those effortless-looking darts from different throwing positions like some other top prospects we've seen can. I do really believe he has a lot of room for growth as far as 'arm talent' if he can get stronger and more coordinated in the lower half. I think we will see noticeable progression in that area like we've seen from other top QB's in the league who's arms have gotten gradually stronger. Relative to other highly drafted QB prospects, I'd say his arm is around the middle of the pack - better than Bradford and Sanchez, a bit below Tannehill and Locker. I do understand that you're factoring in more than just velocity in 'arm talent'. I know it's a Cosell-ism but I don't love the term because I feel it's a little too broad and leaves a little too much up to interpretation which was kinda the reason I started going off on whatever you wanna call this thing where I type a lot and don't say much. This isn't meant to bash piece on Geno at all and I don't feel the need to state the obvious that there are other things he does at a very high level and that this criticism if you want to call it that, is not a significant one. I just think that if he did in fact have elite arm talent, he'd be a special, slam-dunk #1 QB prospect in a lot of years because the other stuff he does so well opposed to a very good QB prospect and the likely #1 pick in an ever declining QB class.

FUNBUNCHER · 10-08-2012, 06:11 AM

Arm talent isn't just velocity throwing the football or pure arm strength, IMO it also includes the ability to make a wide variety of throws from multiple launch points, accuracy throwing and ball placement.

Arm talent is a bundle of skill sets, both physical and technical.

y.f.s. · 10-08-2012, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TACKLE

Can you clarify the difference between 'functional arm strength' and regular arm strength? I don't think any prospect's arm in this draft is being judged by whether or not they can throw the ball through the uprights off their knees from the 50 yard line or whether he or any other QB can throw it 75 yards in the air at a pro day workout. All we have is so far is what we've seen on the field so as I understand it functional arm strength is all we're really going off right now? (really not trying to be snarky with ya, tone is tricky on the interwebz)

Is he an elite passer right now? Hard to argue with his efficiency at all three levels of the field. I would say he might be the best pure 'passer' since Bradford (who I loved). But would I say he's an elite arm talent or "thrower of the football"? No. His arm is solid. Most of his 'wow' throws are because of great touch and placement more so than velocity. You see him really stepping up and driving his downfield throws which is not meant as a knock, but he can't quite throws those effortless-looking darts from different throwing positions like some other top prospects we've seen can. I do really believe he has a lot of room for growth as far as 'arm talent' if he can get stronger and more coordinated in the lower half. I think we will see noticeable progression in that area like we've seen from other top QB's in the league who's arms have gotten gradually stronger. Relative to other highly drafted QB prospects, I'd say his arm is around the middle of the pack - better than Bradford and Sanchez, a bit below Tannehill and Locker. I do understand that you're factoring in more than just velocity in 'arm talent'. I know it's a Cosell-ism but I don't love the term because I feel it's a little too broad and leaves a little too much up to interpretation which was kinda the reason I started going off on whatever you wanna call this thing where I type a lot and don't say much. This isn't meant to bash piece on Geno at all and I don't feel the need to state the obvious that there are other things he does at a very high level and that this criticism if you want to call it that, is not a significant one. I just think that if he did in fact have elite arm talent, he'd be a special, slam-dunk #1 QB prospect in a lot of years because the other stuff he does so well opposed to a very good QB prospect and the likely #1 pick in an ever declining QB class.

No, you're definitely right in that the terms "arm talent" and "functional arm strength" are somewhat broad and leave questions to interpretation.

When I refer to functional arm strength, I'm alluding to the fact that there is a necessarily threshold for arm strength and once you get past that threshold, you generally see diminishing returns that negate whatever advantage throwing with a lot of velocity gives you.

Further, while I don't necessarily see the ball "explode" or "crease" out of Smith's hand, I rarely/ever see WRs having to slow up and wait for his balls (even when throwing deep, which he does quite a bit). And I think another part of it has to do with how good he is at moving in the pocket to find space to reset and throw.