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Old 03-05-2013, 10:55 PM    (permalink
gpngc
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Originally Posted by descendency View Post
I'm just curious what everyone thinks: If you are going to trade up to #1 (with the Chiefs), who are you drafting?
Sharrif Floyd or if you inexplicably love either Fisher/Joeckel and dislike the other for no good reason. Maaaaaaaaybe Jarvis Jones or Ansah. That's it.
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Old 03-06-2013, 12:08 AM    (permalink
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Most of the Chiefs starters are set at this point.

QB: Alex Smith
RB: Jammal Charles
TE: Tony Moeaki
WR: Dwayne Bowe
WR: Dexter McCluster
WR: Jonathan Baldwin
LT: Brandon Albert
LG: Jeff Allen
C: Rodney Hudson
RG: Jon Asamoah
RT: Eric Winston

DE: Tyson Jackson
NT: Dontari Poe
DE: Ropati Pitoitua
OLB: Tamba Hali
ILB: Derrick Johnson
ILB: -
OLB: Justin Houston
CB: Brandon Flowers
SS: Eric Berry
FS: Kendrick Lewis
CB: Javier Arenas

They need a nasty bruiser next to Derrick Johnson. Brandon Siler would suffice if they bring him back, or even Bart Scott could be a decent short-term fix. They need more competition at WR, they need a backup C/G, they need more competition at CB and S, and they need someone to go with Charles.
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Old 03-06-2013, 12:11 AM    (permalink
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Damn, I really wish Robert Griffin was in this draft. The Chiefs would be such a fun team if he was on it
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Old 03-06-2013, 12:38 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by nepg View Post
Most of the Chiefs starters are set at this point.

QB: Alex Smith
RB: Jammal Charles
TE: Tony Moeaki
WR: Dwayne Bowe
WR: Dexter McCluster
WR: Jonathan Baldwin
LT: Brandon Albert
LG: Jeff Allen
C: Rodney Hudson
RG: Jon Asamoah
RT: Eric Winston

DE: Tyson Jackson
NT: Dontari Poe
DE: Ropati Pitoitua
OLB: Tamba Hali
ILB: Derrick Johnson
ILB: -
OLB: Justin Houston
CB: Brandon Flowers
SS: Eric Berry
FS: Kendrick Lewis
CB: Javier Arenas
Looks quite similar to the team that won 2 games this past season.
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Old 03-06-2013, 12:40 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Roddoliver View Post
Looks quite similar to the team that won 2 games this past season.
With better QB play (hopefully) and way better coaching, which were the two biggest reasons for us being 2-14.
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Old 03-06-2013, 01:06 AM    (permalink
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I just want to ask all you guys this. If KC can not move down at all and BPA and number 1 player was Chance Warmack and they took him at 1. He turned out to be a 5 time All Pro would it have been a bad pick for KC to take him number 1 overall?
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Old 03-06-2013, 03:04 AM    (permalink
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Guarantee that the Chiefs starting lineup won't look like that on opening day.

The Chiefs will get another WR and CB at the very least. They are also looking at a DE.

And Husain Abdullah is a the starting SS this year IMO. He was top 10 run defender for 2 years on Pro Football Focus before he left and Berry needs to be in space defending the deep ball more often.
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Old 03-06-2013, 04:58 AM    (permalink
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I just want to ask all you guys this. If KC can not move down at all and BPA and number 1 player was Chance Warmack and they took him at 1. He turned out to be a 5 time All Pro would it have been a bad pick for KC to take him number 1 overall?
If I take a guard first overall, he needs to be freakier than Warmack.
I don't see Chance as a guy who's going redefine the position in the NFL, etc.
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Old 03-06-2013, 06:03 AM    (permalink
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I just want to ask all you guys this. If KC can not move down at all and BPA and number 1 player was Chance Warmack and they took him at 1. He turned out to be a 5 time All Pro would it have been a bad pick for KC to take him number 1 overall?
I just don't think guard is a valuable enough position, and while Warmack is a stud you just don't pick a guard with the 1st overall pick. I'm hoping the Chiefs look at Jarvis Jones, Dee Milliner or Cordarrelle Patterson.
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Old 03-06-2013, 07:41 AM    (permalink
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I just want to ask all you guys this. If KC can not move down at all and BPA and number 1 player was Chance Warmack and they took him at 1. He turned out to be a 5 time All Pro would it have been a bad pick for KC to take him number 1 overall?
I think I'm going to be in the minority in this but no. We have seen an offensive guard be a game changer (see Larry Allen) but the overall grading of the pick weather it is good or bad will ultimately be determined by how well the other top picks do. If Chance Warmack goes #1 overall and then Geno Smith turns into the next Tom Brady then obviously it is a terrible pick.
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oh please. as if canadians even know what beer is.
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Old 03-06-2013, 07:56 AM    (permalink
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Unless Albert is traded, OL isn't really a need. Jeff Allen wasn't great, but he was a high second round pick who was forced into the lineup as a rookie due to injuries. He shouldn't be replaced already.
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Old 03-06-2013, 09:08 AM    (permalink
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I just don't think guard is a valuable enough position, and while Warmack is a stud you just don't pick a guard with the 1st overall pick. I'm hoping the Chiefs look at Jarvis Jones, Dee Milliner or Cordarrelle Patterson.
I'm a big Patterson fan. The kid is raw and needs some refinement. But it seems like everytime I watched a Vols game he made some kind of "wow" play. If Andy Reid and his offensive coaches think they can iron out his "rawness", then he should be in the discussion. It wouldn't be a conventional pick. But I keep saying, this is a very odd draft year where conventional wisdom may have to be bent some in order to make the best move possible to advance the team. And considering Jon Baldwin is on the path to becoming a bust (although he still has time and the coaching staff to turn his career around), WR is a huge need. Especially if they plan to go into battle with Alex Smith next year.
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Old 03-06-2013, 09:10 AM    (permalink
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I'm not a fan of Patterson at #1, but I'd be more than fine picking him 7th or 8th after a trade back, if Star and Geno are off the board.

Geno and Star are my 1a/1b right now, though neither are likely to happen.
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Old 03-06-2013, 09:13 AM    (permalink
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Dorsey gave an interview today with radio station 810WHB.

some things he said:
1. Chiefs have had preliminary discussions with other teams about trading the #1 overall pick.

2. Albert is the chiefs starting LT.
He also hinted that there may be 6-8 prospects in play for that #1 pick. Now, it's poker season in the NFL right now. But I found that pretty interesting.
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Old 03-06-2013, 09:17 AM    (permalink
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I'm not a fan of Patterson at #1, but I'd be more than fine picking him 7th or 8th after a trade back, if Star and Geno are off the board.

Geno and Star are my 1a/1b right now, though neither are likely to happen.
I'm with you on Geno. I'll be with you on Star too soon as we get more info on his condition.
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Old 03-06-2013, 09:23 AM    (permalink
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http://www.kansascity.com/2013/03/05...establish.html

Albert missed five starts late last season with back spasms, but Dorsey said the Chiefs have no concerns about his ability to play a full season.

“His back is fine,” Dorsey said. “He passed our physical.”
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Old 03-06-2013, 09:35 AM    (permalink
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http://www.kansascity.com/2013/03/05...establish.html

Albert missed five starts late last season with back spasms, but Dorsey said the Chiefs have no concerns about his ability to play a full season.

“His back is fine,” Dorsey said. “He passed our physical.”
I read that article. Not trying to kick dirt on Scott Pioli, although he probably deserves some, but it's likely had he still been in power, none or very little of this would have happened.

I can't seem to find the article, it's some months old, but there was a statement by Bowe some months ago (long before Pioli was let go) that he wanted to stay in KC. But KC just had to, "get their front office situation straigntened out". Or something along those lines.

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Old 03-06-2013, 11:59 AM    (permalink
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I know it's crazy. But, I'm thinking Dee Milliner looking at their depth chart. Don't think any of the 3-4 de's are better than him. That would be my next target area.
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Old 03-06-2013, 12:01 PM    (permalink
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You just don't take a DB #1 overall. You just don't.

The pick has to be OL or DL at this point. It's either going to be Joeckel, Fisher, Lotulelelei, or Floyd.
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Old 03-06-2013, 12:06 PM    (permalink
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You just don't take a DB #1 overall. You just don't.

The pick has to be OL or DL at this point. It's either going to be Joeckel, Fisher, Lotulelelei, or Floyd.
Joeckel and Fisher don't fit given Albert being franchised and Stephenson behind him. Floyd playing the 5 technique would be a complete waste of a pick and a waste of his talent. Star has the health question marks, and after bringing Jackson back, I'm guessing they won't put such a premium on the position.

I could see the Chiefs trading down and not for the market value of the first pick or any deal that matches up with the trade value chart. The discrepancy in talent between the top 5-10 players and guys going around pick 20 is minimal compared to the usual draft, and if the Chiefs can pick up an additional 2nd in the process then it's worth it. (Example: Rams trade #16 and their 2nd rounder for the 1st pick, Chiefs can select a player that makes sense and fills a need like a WR, ILB or CB).
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Old 03-06-2013, 12:08 PM    (permalink
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The Rams will give up 16/22/their 2nd. I have spoken.
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Old 03-06-2013, 12:12 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by princefielder28 View Post
Joeckel and Fisher don't fit given Albert being franchised and Stephenson behind him. Floyd playing the 5 technique would be a complete waste of a pick and a waste of his talent. Star has the health question marks, and after bringing Jackson back, I'm guessing they won't put such a premium on the position.
You don't pass up elite talent just because you have a player at that position in place.

Taking Joeckel because he is a top-5 OT on their board is still smart even with Albert. They are one injury away from needing an OL anyway, and you never know what your "needs" will be like 2 years from now, so just take the best talent.

Taking the best talent worked out for the Giants in 2010 (Jason Pierre Paul despite having tons of DE depth) and the Lions in 2011 (Nick Fairley despite having a great DT rotation already).
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Old 03-06-2013, 12:14 PM    (permalink
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We drafted Donald Stephenson in the 3rd last year, and he showed promise when Albert was hurt. The only depth at OL we need is interior, with a swing C/G player who can play either guard spot and center.

OT wasn't a need five years ago, last year, or today. It won't be tomorrow.
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Old 03-06-2013, 12:14 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by AcheTen View Post
You don't pass up elite talent just because you have a player at that position in place.

Taking Joeckel because he is a top-5 OT on their board is still smart even with Albert. They are one injury away from needing an OL anyway, and you never know what your "needs" will be like 2 years from now, so just take the best talent.

Taking the best talent worked out for the Giants in 2010 (Jason Pierre Paul despite having tons of DE depth) and the Lions in 2011 (Nick Fairley despite having a great DT rotation already).
You can play multiple defensive linemen at one time so those picks are both logical for New York and Detroit. Only one left tackle can play at a time unfortunately.
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Old 03-06-2013, 12:38 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AcheTen View Post
You don't pass up elite talent just because you have a player at that position in place.

Taking Joeckel because he is a top-5 OT on their board is still smart even with Albert. They are one injury away from needing an OL anyway, and you never know what your "needs" will be like 2 years from now, so just take the best talent.

Taking the best talent worked out for the Giants in 2010 (Jason Pierre Paul despite having tons of DE depth) and the Lions in 2011 (Nick Fairley despite having a great DT rotation already).
You do when you are solid in a particular area and have holes elsewhere and there might be other prospects available that provide reasonable value. The Chiefs have depth at tackle. They don't really have any interior O-Line depth though. Branden Albert has stated pretty strongly that he is not interested in moving to guard. They've already franchised him at just under $10 for this upcoming season. Don't really see them franchising him at that price and moving him to guard just so they can draft Joeckel. I've said this several times, Joeckel or Fisher only make sense if Branden Albert is no longer a Chief. And seeing as how the Chiefs aren't concerned with his back, the only way he's gone is if they can't reach a long-term agreement.

At some point, assuming the Chiefs don't let Albert go, you have to ask if you're "good enough" at a particular position group. The Chiefs have invested a lot of picks in the first 3 rounds of the draft in recent years on that offensive line. And it's still a pretty young and ascending group. What makes an offensive line good, as much or more than pure talent, is cohesion. That's something the Chiefs really haven't had at that group in some years.

That being said, Joeckel/Fisher just don't make sense to me with Albert, and to a lesser degree Donald Stephens, already in house. That pick would be better served finding another prospect that fills a hole that provides reasonable value for the pick. Even if that player isn't the BPA.
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