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Old 03-02-2013, 08:51 AM    (permalink
Ozzy
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Default 2013 Combine Winners & Losers

After looking over the combine statistics in terms of bench, vertical, 40 time, height, weight, 10 yard split and broad jump these are the players that stood out to me.

Having the biggest winners, biggest disappointments then some of the standouts at each position.



Biggest winners:
Margus Hunt 6-8 277 4.60, 38 bench 34 vert
Really worked out well, great size, amazing 40 time, huge bench press for having such long arms and nice vertical. This could easily put him into the 1st round with these physical skills.

Knile Davis 5-10 227 4.37, 1.49 10 yard, 31 bench
Where was this all season, awesome work out for him. This possibly moves him into the 3rd or 4th round I feel. Too bad he had such a down year but this shows he might be getting back physically to what he was before.

Tavon Austin 5-9 174, 4.34, 1.45 10 yard
Really solid numbers for him, the fastest 10 yard split of any of the receivers, very impressive 40 time. Is not a surprise but shows he is as fast as he looks.

Xavier Rhodes, 6-2 210, 4.43, 14 bench 40.5 vert, 132 broad, 33.68 hands
Another player that really impressed, at his size, so large yet ran that 40 time, had a great vertical and broad jump as well as big hands. Awesome workout for him.

Ezekiel Ansah 6-5 271 4.63, 21 bench 34.5 vert 25.18 arm
Really fine numbers, just confirms how high he will be drafted. Such a physical upside to him along with that size.

Shamarko Thomas 5-9 213 4.42, 40 vert, 28 bench
Really impressive numbers, awesome bench press and vertical as well as good speed, he really helped himself out with this performance.

Onterio McCalebb 5-10 168, 4.34, 34 vert, 1.45 10 yard
Impressive 40 for him, not a huge surprise but helps put him in the place of a possible kick return man or punt return man as well as a change of pace back. His strength will come into question but good think he DNP in that event yet.

Justin Hunter 6-4 196 4.44 39 vert, 136 broad
Wow, huge numbers for Hunter, fine 40 time, a lot faster than I thought and a impressive vertical. Still is a little stiff I think but his potential is huge at his size.

Terron Armstead 6-5 306, 4.71, 31 bench
What a performance, insane 40 time for a man that big, I heard some teams want him to try out at tight end. Regardless this is what is great about the combine, a guy can come in and totally make a name for himself physically speaking.

Lane Johnson 6-6 303 4.72, 35.28 arms, 1.61 10 yard
Wow, another big man with a great 40 time. This probably puts him in the 1st round, it is so impressive for a guy so large.

Eric Reid 6-0 213, 4.53, 17 bench 40.5 vert, 33.58 hands
Really impressed by those numbers, big thick safety and ran well in the 40, had a good bench, impressive vertical and large hands. Really nice numbers for a player like him who was so productive.

Sharrif Floyd 6-3 297 4.92, 30 bench 106 broad
Shows that quick reaction ability, broke into the 4 second range in the 40 which is awesome for any defensive tackle, nice bench press as well.

Ryan Swope 4.34, 37 vert, 1.47 10 yard
Not a surprise really, good speed, already has awesome hands and his puts him right in the spot of the Wes Welker type of receiver and he could easily be a surprise 2nd-3rd round pick because of it I think.

Cornelius Washington 6-4 265 4.55, 36 bench 39 vert
Really impressive numbers for him, but on the field is another story. But these are fine numbers, good size, lost some weight, has good speed and strength as well.

Dee Milliner 6-0 201, 4.37, 36 vert
Very solid performance by him, was already the top corner and this just further proves that.

Vance McDonald 6-4 267 4.69, 33 vert 31 bench 34.38 arms
Always liked him, such an interesting prospect playing so much at receiver, nice 40 time and really impressive bench press performance better than any other tight end that participated. He is a big time sleeper at this position I think.

Mark Harrison 6-3 231 4.46, 38 vert, 129 broad
Amazing numbers for him, at that size, so big and thick yet can still run, fine vertical as well. This moves him up into the 3rd or 4th round I feel, such a bull at receiver.






Biggest Disappointment:
Damontre Moore 6-5 250 4.95 12 bench
Really not a good combine for him, great on the field but not a good 40 time at all compared to like 4 or 5 other players at this position with similar size, and not a good bench press either.

Kenny Vaccaro 6-0 214 4.63 15 bench
Did not really impressive but not a surprise, always something missing about him I thought, not an awful time though but thought his bench would be move coming from a big physical safety.

Tony Jefferson 5-11 213 4.75, 16 bench
Really disappointing time for him, tough player and surprised at the small bench press as well. His tackling ability could makeup for that in the end though.

Tyler Wilson 6-2 215, hand 8.68
Nothing major but those are the smallest hands of all the quarterbacks by almost an inch, could be an issue.

Colin Klein 6-5 226, 4.78
Decent numbers for him but for some reason I thought he would be much faster in the 40 than that, will be interesting what position he goes too.

Ray Graham 5-9 199, 4.8
Not an impressive 40 time for him, very surprising number because he was a big play back in college with good speed on the field.

Theo Riddick 5-10 201 4.68
Not a great for time for him, I thought he would be much faster than that, possible reason why he moved to running back from receiver.

Zach Line 6-0 232 4.77
Love him as a player, but not a good showing in the 40 time, but will be interesting to see if he can improve on that.

Ace Sanders 5-7 173 4.58
Really surprised at that 40 time, thought he was a lot faster than that, he needs to improve on that time to prove his worth as a return man.

Zeke Motta 6-2 213 4.83
Slow time for this big safety, that is not good for him.

Johnthan Banks 6-2 185 4.61 10 bench 34 vert
Not a good 40 time for him, possibly can improve on that but with that time he cannot be a 1st round pick. Surprise coming from a return man like him, with that size still thought he would have more speed.

David Amerson 6-1 205 4.44
Decent numbers for him in the 40, impressive but I thought he would have been much taller than 6-1, was he not listed at like 6-3 in college? That is a pretty big disappointment I must say.






Best of the rest
QB
Matt Barkley 6-3 227 hand size 10.08
Nice numbers for him, good size and like that he has large hands as well. He is really undervalued in this draft but someone will get a fine player because of it cheap.

EJ Manuel 6-5 237, 4.65, hand size 10.30
Good size of course and put together a very nice 40 time as well for a player so large, along with that a good hand size.

Marquis Gray 6-3 240, 4.73, 1.59 10 yard
Not sure why he is with the quarterbacks, but has a decent 40 time, and with his skills I think he should get a look as a receiver or most likely a H-back/pass catching tight end.

Geno Smith 6-2 218, 4.59
Shows good athletic ability I did not think he had, decent frame as well so that is impressive for a player that did not really run much in college, still nice to know he has.




RB
DJ Harper 5-9 211 4.52, 23 bench, 10.28 hand
Very solid numbers, comes in bigger than I thought, had a great bench performance and nice 40 time, as well as a large hand size. His numbers surprised me and possibly made him into a possible draft selection now.

Michael Ford 5-9 210 4.5, 25 bench, 130 broad 38.5 vert
Had a down year on LSU, got lost in the mix of all those running backs. But these combine numbers clearly put him in the middle or top half of the back of players at the position. Always liked his frame and physical skills, could be a great pickup late.

Christine Michael 5-10 220 4.54, vert 43, bench 27
The numbers do not surprise, he has all the physical tools but on the field he really disappointed I think. But it is hard to be productive in that type of offense if one does not get the ball. Still a very talented player, probably a mid round pick.

LeVeon Bell 6-1 230, 4.52, bench 24
Why few are talking about this, that is a great time for a man his size in the 40. And he literally carried the Michigan State offense, he is a very underrated player I think and should be worth a 2nd round pick if not late 1st.




WR
Rodney Smith 6-4 225 4.51, 34 vert, 34 arms 10.38 hands
Very nice 40 time for him, good hand size and vertical as well, at his size he performed very well I think.

Kenny Stills 6-1 194, 4.38
That time surprises me, very impressive, I did not know he had that kind of speed and he already has such fine ball skills as well.

DaRick Rogers 6-2 217 4.52, 39 vert 132 broad
Very good performance, he still has those physical tools and skills that already shows up on the field for him. He is worth a 1st round pick but should be gone for sure by round 2 or 3.

Denard Robinson 5-11 199, 4.43
Does not amaze with his speed, but it is a decent time, would be interesting to see his cone drill numbers.

Cordarrelle Patterson 6-2 216 4.42, 37 vert
This puts him as the 1st receiver taken, on the field he has so much potential and these are solid numbers for him.

Marquise Goodwin 5-9 183 4.27
Very nice time for him, but he should get a time like that if he is a former Olympian. He has far better football skills than John Capel or Leonard Scott did though, and should actually stick around the league for awhile.

Marcus Davis 6-3 233 4.56 hands 10.28 vert 39.5
Very good number also for this big thick receiver. Has always had that physical talent and a team will take a chance on him even though he is not always the most consistent player on the field.



TE
Dion Sims 6-5 262 4.75, bench 22, vert 35, hands 10.48
Very nice numbers, big kid, strong, ran well and has big hands. Should make him a good 2nd or 3rd round pick I think, he has that kind of ability.

Chris Gragg 6-3 244 4.5, 37.5 vert
Really impressive performance by him, great 40 time and vertical, shows natural running ability and ability to stretch the field and go deep.

Levine Toilolo 6-8 260 4.86
Tallest tight end in the draft, huge kid and decent numbers for a guy his size.



OL
Alvin Bailey 6-3 312, 4.95
Surprised by that fine performance by him, always thought of him as a top flight elite guard and now he physically backs that up.

Ried Fragel 6-8 308 bench 33, 5.14
Always liked the kid and came in at a huge 6-8 with room to grow, and that bench is very impressive and the 40 time as decent as well.

DJ Fluker 6-5 340, 5.31
Not an awful 40 time coming from one of the biggest players in the draft, did not impress as much on the bench but it is a lot harder when you have longer arms like he has.


DL
TJ Barnes 6-6 370, 5.3
That is a very impressive 40 time for I believe the largest player at the combine.

Dion Jordan 6-6 248, 4.6
Really impressive for a big tall guy like he is, nice performance in the 40.

Corey Lemonier 6-3 255 4.6, 27 bench
A nice performance by him, good speed and surprising strength as well.

Barkevious Mingo 6-4 241 4.58, 37 vert, 128 broad
Not a surprise his numbers, kind of thought they would be a little better but still very impressive physical player.

Stansly Maponga TCU 6-2 256 30 bench
Wish he would have ran the 40, but that bench press, holy crap that is good for a player his size.

Devin Taylor 6-7 266 4.72 bench 14 vert 35
I think he did well, the bench is not a surprise but had a very good 40 time for his height I feel and a good vertical.


LB
Jamie Collins 6-3 250, 4.64, 19 bench, 41 vert 139 broad
Impressed with his physical skills for a player like him, showed good speed and impressive leg power as well, could be a fine pass rusher in a 4/3.

Jon Bostic 6-1 245, 4.61
Nice 40 time for him, shows his natural speed at the linebacker position

Sio Moore 6-1 245 4.65 29 bench
Nice speed and strength from him, decent prospect and performed well with these numbers.

Alec Ogletree 6-2 242 4.70 20 bench 33 vert
Decent performance by him, did not hurt anything but I thought he would have measured out to be a little tall and jumped a little higher, but on the field he shows a lot more athletic ability than these numbers put out.



DB
Robert Alford 5-10 188 4.39, 40 vert
Very nice numbers for him, good speed and gets his name out there as a small school player.

John Boyett 5-10 204, 27 bench
Did not run the 40, but that is a very impressive number for the bench press I must say.

Sanders Commings 6-0 216, 4.41
Good size and nice time from him, thick corner and put himself in the picture now.

Micha Hyde 6-0 197 4.56
Impressed by that 40 time from him, might have ran a slower time but that is good for a big corner like he is.

Tyrann Mathieu 5-9 186, 4.5, 4 bench
Decent time in the 40 for him, that bench press is weak but one other defensive back did the same at the combine. Would have been much better off not doing the bench because it was his one negative.

TJ McDonald 6-3 219, 4.59, 19 bench, 40 vert, 131 broad
Decent physical skills, very nice size but thought he would have a little better 40, that could drop him out of the 1st round potentially. Good numbers outside of that.

Nickell Robey 5-7 169, 4.53
Decent 40 time for him, thought it would have been faster but still ok.

Darius Slay 6-0 192 4.36
Very impressive with that 40 time, shows great speed and is already a decent player.

Jamar Taylor 5-11 192 4.39, 22 bench, 35 vert
Really like his numbers, awesome 40 time, very impressive bench press as well for such a small player.

Desmond Trufant 6-0 190 4.38
Did not think he would run that fast but he did well and shows good speed.

Shawn Williams 6-0 213 4.46, 25 bench 36 vert
Such a leader on the field, these are very solid numbers, good size and speed, very solid bench press as well.

Earl Wolff 5-11 209 4.44
Did not think he would run that fast but those are good numbers for a safety in the 40.
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Old 03-02-2013, 09:13 AM    (permalink
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I love the depth in this draft. Loaded at the top of the OL class, as I think there are 5 elite OL prospects, probably all going in the top 15. But I really like the depth at WR, CB, OLB/DE, and RB. I think you can get contributors at those positions in rounds 3-6. Maybe not starters on a good team, but I think it would be realistic to come away with a good combination of 4 of those players if you're picking in the 8-15 range of each round.

As a Bears fan, I'd really love to get Michael Ford in the 5th or 6th and groom him as the #3 RB for a year, moving up the depth chart when Forte has no guaranteed money left after 2013 and moving up further when Bush gets cut after 2014. I think he can be a dynamic back that just isn't ready yet.
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Old 03-02-2013, 03:27 PM    (permalink
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Most of the performances were expected though. Taking your top "+" guy, Hunt, I remember reading an article a year or so ago about his raw athletic ability, and I think all the numbers they gave were about the same as his combine numbers. But he was still a mediocre football player last year, and he will be 26 soon. Same could be said for Ansah.

OTOH, no one thought Damontre Moore would test particularly well in terms of strength or speed. Probably not as badly as he did, but I think there were some extenuating circumstances. No one brings up the fact that Moore was top three in the other two test he did, (I think) vertical and broad jump. But he was still a great player in the SEC. Better numbers than Von Miller had at the same stage. He is also five years younger than Hunt and Ansah.

I wouldn't change a thing following the Combine, and I really doubt that any teams do so. Other than for medical concerns.
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Old 03-02-2013, 03:37 PM    (permalink
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Eifert had a nice day.
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Old 03-02-2013, 04:30 PM    (permalink
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jamie collins definately needs to go to the winners, he might be the biggest draft stock winner of the entire combine
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Old 03-02-2013, 04:50 PM    (permalink
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Eifert had a nice day.
Vance McDonald had a better one. Wouldn't be surprised to see him as the first TE off the board. Definitely would top my list.
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Old 03-02-2013, 06:15 PM    (permalink
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Vance McDonald had a better one. Wouldn't be surprised to see him as the first TE off the board. Definitely would top my list.
Except for the bench press where was McDonald better than Eifert?
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Old 03-02-2013, 06:27 PM    (permalink
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Except for the bench press where was McDonald better than Eifert?
More the fact that McDonald put up similar speed/agility numbers while being 20 pounds heavier, with longer arms and bigger hands. Eifert seems to be strictly a receiving TE, while McDonald looks to have to potential to be an all round TE. Or even to work out of a FB/HB slot. At 6-4, 270 with that kind of strength.
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Old 03-02-2013, 06:31 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by raphael View Post
More the fact that McDonald put up similar speed/agility numbers while being 20 pounds heavier, with longer arms and bigger hands. Eifert seems to be strictly a receiving TE, while McDonald looks to have to potential to be an all round TE. Or even to work out of a FB/HB slot. At 6-4, 270 with that kind of strength.
Like McDonald but for me Eiferts agility numbers (cone, shuttles) were much better. Good year for TEs.
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Old 03-02-2013, 06:37 PM    (permalink
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Vance McDonald had a better one. Wouldn't be surprised to see him as the first TE off the board. Definitely would top my list.
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Old 03-02-2013, 06:37 PM    (permalink
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Like McDonald but for me Eiferts agility numbers (cone, shuttles) were much better. Good year for TEs.
I agree, I think the TEs and WRs as well are not getting the attention they deserve. Probably because there isn't one dominant individual at either position.
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Old 03-02-2013, 07:34 PM    (permalink
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wicket jamie collins definately needs to go to the winners, he might be the biggest draft stock winner of the entire combine
He did have a fine combine I agree, but it was not jaw dropping in my book, but did standout compared to some other linebackers.


Quote:
JohnCandy Eifert had a nice day.
True there is nothing that hurt Eifert, and on the field I think he is arguably the best tight end in the draft. Other guys came on strong but Eifert has been elite from day one in my book. McDonald I really like but I would not take him over Eifert.


Quote:
raphael Most of the performances were expected though. Taking your top "+" guy, Hunt, I remember reading an article a year or so ago about his raw athletic ability, and I think all the numbers they gave were about the same as his combine numbers. But he was still a mediocre football player last year, and he will be 26 soon. Same could be said for Ansah.
I would not compared Ansah to Hunt, Ansah is far less experienced in the game of football. And Hunt had 8 sacks last year, not amazing but hard to argue with those physical skills, he could be worth the gamble. Hell even as a possible kick blocker he is worth the risk, kid had what 7 blocked kicks as a freshman.
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Old 03-02-2013, 07:51 PM    (permalink
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Yeah, I like Hunt, he seems like he could be an asset in a lot of different ways. Mainly disrupting the passing lanes for QBs, but not enough to justify a first round pick.

Point I was trying to make was that I don't think that the Combine should alter draft boards all that much.

Last edited by raphael : 03-02-2013 at 08:08 PM.
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Old 03-02-2013, 08:08 PM    (permalink
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raphael Point I was trying to make was that I don't think that the Combine should alter draft boards all that much.
Possible but depending on the prospect it does. One has the season and how they performed, then if the combine provides safe numbers that show a solid base of athletic ability then the prospect is fine. If the under perform that will make them drop depending on their position, or if a player performs well that will increase his stock, rightfully so in some cases, not so right in other cases.

If Williams Gholston had the combine numbers Hunt had, no way he would not be a higher pick, and both players are similar in size.

Sure numbers do not say everything, but they are interesting and are just one more way to compare and rank players based off the differences.
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Old 03-02-2013, 08:15 PM    (permalink
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Possible but depending on the prospect it does. One has the season and how they performed, then if the combine provides safe numbers that show a solid base of athletic ability then the prospect is fine. If the under perform that will make them drop depending on their position, or if a player performs well that will increase his stock, rightfully so in some cases, not so right in other cases.

If Williams Gholston had the combine numbers Hunt had, no way he would not be a higher pick, and both players are similar in size.

Sure numbers do not say everything, but they are interesting and are just one more way to compare and rank players based off the differences.
Yeah, if the Combine wasn't worthwhile, the NFL wouldn't spend multi millions holding it each year, I'm sure. But for the most part, the guys who perform well there are expected to, and vica versa. The individual tests are more indicative of the prospects ability to master the particular skills associated with each test. Like getting a good jump in the 40, or swinging your weight properly for the jumps, or judging the cones well. Track guys, like Hunt and Ansah, have an advantage there to start. They are used to spending long hours focussing on an individual task.
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Old 03-02-2013, 08:19 PM    (permalink
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Old 03-02-2013, 10:10 PM    (permalink
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Amerson did measure short but came in at 6'1" 205 and ran 4.44. That's solid numbers whether you have him as a safety or a corner. He also looked good making plays on the ball in drills. I think the conseus was that he improved his stock in Indy.

I liked UNC linemen Cooper and Sly Williams' combines and think both guys help themselves. Both are well built and athletic.

I thought DeAndre Hopkins and Andre Ellington would have posted better combine numbers. They sure looked fast for Clemson the past few years.

I like EJ Manuel and Mike Glennon but I was disappointed in both at the combine. I thought CJ would show as a more impressive athlete and neither showed good deep ball accuracy. I still like both as prospects but both will need some work.
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Old 03-02-2013, 10:37 PM    (permalink
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Amerson did measure short but came in at 6'1" 205 and ran 4.44. That's solid numbers whether you have him as a safety or a corner. He also looked good making plays on the ball in drills. I think the conseus was that he improved his stock in Indy.

I liked UNC linemen Cooper and Sly Williams' combines and think both guys help themselves. Both are well built and athletic.

I thought DeAndre Hopkins and Andre Ellington would have posted better combine numbers. They sure looked fast for Clemson the past few years.

I like EJ Manuel and Mike Glennon but I was disappointed in both at the combine. I thought CJ would show as a more impressive athlete and neither showed good deep ball accuracy. I still like both as prospects but both will need some work.
Manuel jumped 34 inches to lead all QBs, he ran a 4.65 that was second among QBs and he has the biggest hands of the bunch. I also saw him thrown some beautiful deep balls in which the WRs didn't have to break stride. Daniel Jeremiah said some GMs have him as a mid second round pick now. And you were disappointed him?
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Old 03-02-2013, 11:37 PM    (permalink
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Manuel jumped 34 inches to lead all QBs, he ran a 4.65 that was second among QBs and he has the biggest hands of the bunch. I also saw him thrown some beautiful deep balls in which the WRs didn't have to break stride. Daniel Jeremiah said some GMs have him as a mid second round pick now. And you were disappointed him?
Pete Shraeger from Fox Sports had him going 7th overall in his mock. Don't think that's necessarily too far off the mark.
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Old 03-02-2013, 11:52 PM    (permalink
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Zavier Gooden is one of the winners. He finished first among LBs in four of the seven drills, including the 40. He was the only LB to clock under 4.5.
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Old 03-03-2013, 01:18 AM    (permalink
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Nice post. One correction, though:

Margus Hunt does NOT have long arms. He's tall, yeah, but his arms are merely average. Short when you consider his height.

Robert Woods has longer arms than him :(
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Old 03-03-2013, 01:37 AM    (permalink
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How about Devin Taylor. I think his arms were 37" or something ridiculous. 6-7, 270, and his test numbers were right there with Hunt and Ansah. Better in the agility drills, I think.
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Old 03-03-2013, 01:53 AM    (permalink
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He did have a fine combine I agree, but it was not jaw dropping in my book, but did standout compared to some other linebackers.
his long and high jumps were ridiculous
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Old 03-03-2013, 03:06 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by marks01234 View Post
Amerson did measure short but came in at 6'1" 205 and ran 4.44. That's solid numbers whether you have him as a safety or a corner. He also looked good making plays on the ball in drills. I think the conseus was that he improved his stock in Indy.

I liked UNC linemen Cooper and Sly Williams' combines and think both guys help themselves. Both are well built and athletic.

I thought DeAndre Hopkins and Andre Ellington would have posted better combine numbers. They sure looked fast for Clemson the past few years.

I like EJ Manuel and Mike Glennon but I was disappointed in both at the combine. I thought CJ would show as a more impressive athlete and neither showed good deep ball accuracy. I still like both as prospects but both will need some work.

Ellington got hurt halfway through his 40 run. He's a 4.47-4.50 guy on tape.
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Old 03-03-2013, 10:59 AM    (permalink
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Yeah, I like Hunt, he seems like he could be an asset in a lot of different ways. Mainly disrupting the passing lanes for QBs, but not enough to justify a first round pick.

Point I was trying to make was that I don't think that the Combine should alter draft boards all that much.
You have to significantly alter your board based on the combine. Game tape is nice, but they aren't playing against the same level of competition they will face at the next level. You have to further evaluate. Will he be able to beat an NFL CB the same way he beat some scrub college CB? Is he quick in reality, or just quicker than a future NFL G who is playing LT in college. Etc etc etc.

Game tape and college production only tell you so much.
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