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Old 05-31-2013, 01:20 AM    (permalink
BallerT1215
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Good QBs put their WRs in a position to make great catches.
Putting the ball where only your WRs can get it.
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Old 05-31-2013, 01:56 AM    (permalink
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I feel like there are people who want to argue that Eli Manning is the "luckiest" quarterback in the NFL. I think it's because he's not a great-looking athlete and he (and his brother) make some pretty meme-worthy expressions in front of cameras. But you don't get drafted first overall and become the franchise quarterback of an NFL team because you're "lucky," and you don't put up big stats through luck, but rather by dedicating oneself and constantly improving ones' ability to move the ball past a defense, so why, in the most important situations of his life, should his accomplishments be considered "luck?"
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Old 05-31-2013, 04:12 AM    (permalink
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The ball to Manningham was money.

The ball to Plaxico for the go ahead TD in 2007 was equally money.
Dude is clutchy, no way around it.

You give Eli too many chances and he's going to hurt you.
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Old 05-31-2013, 06:35 AM    (permalink
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Eli do what Eli do.

Eli's biggest crime is being Peyton's little brother.
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:04 AM    (permalink
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Eli do what Eli do.

Eli's biggest crime is being Peyton's little brother.
That's what I was going to say. He gets downgraded for not being Peyton.
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:09 AM    (permalink
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To be honest, as an obvious fan of Eli, I can't even be that upset. Because for the most part, I think most fans agree that he's a top 5 qb in the league, and I have no quarrels with that.

But for some reason that's just unknown to me, for the life of me I have no idea why Ben Roethlisberger doesn't get the respect he deserves. Ben is a beast, and he is hands down the most underrated and underappreciated qb in the league.

For everything that he's accomplished, all the big plays, all the SBs, all the clutch plays, his physical ability to break tackles, scramble, his huge arm, his accuracy, his winning pedigree, his hardware, I mean the guy has it all, yet for some reason he just doesn't get the respect he deserves.

I just don't understand it. I can't even be mad at Eli's perception when Ben is getting treated the way he's treated.

Yes, he's a dirtbag and a POS human being. But hes one hell of a football player and quarterback.
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:10 AM    (permalink
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That's what I was going to say. He gets downgraded for not being Peyton.


That is one. Draft day is two and his personality. Those three things will always work against him.

The more I look at Donovan McNabb and some his numbers I have to admit I am impressed by them. I never took the time to admire his play or look at what numbers he puts up year after year but its impressive .

I wonder if he gets serious HOF consideration or will he be the guy always on the ballot but passed over?
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:15 AM    (permalink
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Donovann's consideration takes a hit bc of the misplaced assumption that he was a system qb.

Everyone wants to say that Andy Reid had great success with any qb but that's simply not true. Andy Reid struggled without McNabb. Kolb never developed under Reid, neither did Vick, or Foles, or any other qb. Jeff Garcia was fools gold.

Without McNabb Reid struggled. Yet the perception is that McNabb only succeeded bc of Reid and the system. And that's simply not true. Everyone remembers McNabb's last several years but forgets his prime years of his career and that's gonna hurt his chances.

He's a tough one. He doesn't have the ring, and he doesn't have the raw statistics. But the man had a great career and was a winner. And he made chicken salad out of chicken **** on a regular basis during his prime. He did have some poor moments in the playoffs as well which hurts him.

He's borderline for me. I don't know where I stand on him yet.
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:15 AM    (permalink
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He gets a lot respect. I watch ESPN and NFL network they are constantly talking about him. I think he easily gets the respect . In fact, he had agood rookie year or I say first impression year so he his and will always be golden in the fan and media eye. Plus his style he plays will always be favored by many. I think he is far from under rated. I think he is rated perfectly. Either way I think that 2004 QB class is one of the best ever .
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:18 AM    (permalink
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To be honest, as an obvious fan of Eli, I can't even be that upset. Because for the most part, I think most fans agree that he's a top 5 qb in the league, and I have no quarrels with that.

But for some reason that's just unknown to me, for the life of me I have no idea why Ben Roethlisberger doesn't get the respect he deserves. Ben is a beast, and he is hands down the most underrated and underappreciated qb in the league.

For everything that he's accomplished, all the big plays, all the SBs, all the clutch plays, his physical ability to break tackles, scramble, his huge arm, his accuracy, his winning pedigree, his hardware, I mean the guy has it all, yet for some reason he just doesn't get the respect he deserves.

I just don't understand it. I can't even be mad at Eli's perception when Ben is getting treated the way he's treated.

Yes, he's a dirtbag and a POS human being. But hes one hell of a football player and quarterback.
I actually think Ben is better than Eli. But to say that Eli is downgraded for not being Peyton is silly. I don't think anyone is saying he sucks just that he isn't in the same class as those top 4 guys.
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oh please. as if canadians even know what beer is.
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:20 AM    (permalink
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He gets a lot respect. I watch ESPN and NFL network they are constantly talking about him. I think he easily gets the respect . In fact, he had agood rookie year or I say first impression year so he his and will always be golden in the fan and media eye. Plus his style he plays will always be favored by many. I think he is far from under rated. I think he is rated perfectly. Either way I think that 2004 QB class is one of the best ever .
We need Rivers to step up though. Eli and Ben are holding the 04 class down, and Schaub gets a head nod, but for the 04 class to be one of the best ever we need Rivers to revitalize his career. Current we're looking at 2 SB champions and 2 HOF qbs in this draft class, with 2 decent qbs in Rivers and Schaub.

If Rivers can reestablish his career and somehow make it to the HOF (which seems unlikely at this point but you never know) then we can have a valid discussion about it. Until then we can't.
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:20 AM    (permalink
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Every HC is going to struggle without their franchise QB. So I expect AR to struggle without McNabb in there. In fact, kudos to AR for always keeping his team in the race no matter what. That team never dies! Even after a bad start they managed to do well. That season Jeff Garcia player very well for them.
His overall numbers are impressive. The question is will they be enough and the longer he stays out the more QBs will retire that beat his overall all bottom line. That will hurt him I think.
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:22 AM    (permalink
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I actually think Ben is better than Eli. But to say that Eli is downgraded for not being Peyton is silly. I don't think anyone is saying he sucks just that he isn't in the same class as those top 4 guys.
I would understand an argument for Ben over Eli. I think they're very close.

I think the presence of Peyton casting a shadow over Eli is still very much there. Even now we still hear the silly "Is Eli better than Peyton" discussions in the media, which would never happen if Eli wasn't his brother.

Having that said, I also understand why some feel that Eli is not in the same class as the 4 ranked ahead of him, but I disagree with that notion. I think Rodgers needs to establish more of a playoff resume before we can say that.
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:23 AM    (permalink
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We need Rivers to step up though. Eli and Ben are holding the 04 class down, and Schaub gets a head nod, but for the 04 class to be one of the best ever we need Rivers to revitalize his career. Current we're looking at 2 SB champions and 2 HOF qbs in this draft class, with 2 decent qbs in Rivers and Schaub.

If Rivers can reestablish his career and somehow make it to the HOF (which seems unlikely at this point but you never know) then we can have a valid discussion about it. Until then we can't.


Yeah Rivers is going backwards. He needs to get his head out his butt and start to play better. Starting off strong is one thing but if you're a great QB raise the game of the others around you. I will be watching to see how he does this year. He needs to raise his game because he is lagging out of that class as of right now. I think Matt S. who is less talented is currently out playing him.
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:28 AM    (permalink
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I would understand an argument for Ben over Eli. I think they're very close.

I think the presence of Peyton casting a shadow over Eli is still very much there. Even now we still hear the silly "Is Eli better than Peyton" discussions in the media, which would never happen if Eli wasn't his brother.

Having that said, I also understand why some feel that Eli is not in the same class as the 4 ranked ahead of him, but I disagree with that notion. I think Rodgers needs to establish more of a playoff resume before we can say that.
Yeah I think you wrapped everything up real nicely here. I even agree with you on Rodgers I think he is starting to get a little over rated.
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oh please. as if canadians even know what beer is.
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:31 AM    (permalink
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Yeah I think you wrapped everything up real nicely here. I even agree with you on Rodgers I think he is starting to get a little over rated.
I personally have Brees ahead of Rodgers right now. I think Brees has established more playoff success and honestly, there's nothing that you can say about Rodgers and his success that you can't say about Brees, so I think the tiebreaker goes to Brees.

Both have incredible statistics, both have 1 SB, both have carried their teams, in fact I think Brees might have better statistics, plus more success in the playoffs overall.

I love both of them don't get me wrong, but I think we're giving Rodgers a little too much credit right now. He needs more playoff success. He had one good playoff run and the rest have been disappointments. I have total confidence that he will improve his playoff record, it's just that he hasn't done it yet, and for that reason I have to rank Brees ahead of him for now.
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:36 AM    (permalink
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AR is rated fine and where he should be. Sure his playoff resume needs a boost but overall the guy plays very, very well. The media and fans are going to hype him up and now he represents the elite face of the NFL. I think he is that super star guy now.

So I do think he is rated perfectly fine.
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:41 AM    (permalink
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AR is rated fine and where he should be. Sure his playoff resume needs a boost but overall the guy plays very, very well. The media and fans are going to hype him up and now he represents the elite face of the NFL. I think he is that super star guy now.

So I do think he is rated perfectly fine.
That depends on where you consider him being rated. I think too many people saying "Greatest QB ever." or even "Best in the league." is premature.
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oh please. as if canadians even know what beer is.
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:46 AM    (permalink
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That depends on where you consider him being rated. I think too many people saying "Greatest QB ever." or even "Best in the league." is premature.
Best in the league, sure, best ever is way premature.
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:52 AM    (permalink
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Who the crap thinks he's the best ever? You'd have a tough time making the case for "best Packer QB since Bart Starr."
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:53 AM    (permalink
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That depends on where you consider him being rated. I think too many people saying "Greatest QB ever." or even "Best in the league." is premature.
Who's calling Rodgers the greatest ever? He's not even the greatest in the franchise's history.
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:53 AM    (permalink
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I don't think it's fair to say AR is the best in the league right now. I think it's too early for that. He can be, but he's not there yet.
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:56 AM    (permalink
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I don't think it's fair to say AR is the best in the league right now. I think it's too early for that. He can be, but he's not there yet.
Of course he is. No QB right now is better. You have guys that are close, but in terms of. "Who is the best QB in the league, right now?" The answer to that is AR. I mean that's an easy one. He is the face of the NFL and will be until the younger guys prove to be "elite".
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Old 05-31-2013, 08:56 AM    (permalink
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Right here right now, I think Tom Brady is the best. And I think the throne is his until he retires.
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Old 05-31-2013, 09:03 AM    (permalink
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Right here right now, I think Tom Brady is the best. And I think the throne is his until he retires.
Brady is and Peyton are 2 a. and 2b. not in any order. But it's AR for me. The thing that makes him stand out is his limited number of passing attempts every season and still puts up mind numbing numbers. He doesn't need 29891283918932 pass attempts per season to trick fans into thinking he is better than he should be in their minds. AR is the real deal and gets his without needing a boat load of pass attempts. The things he does makes him the best QB in the NFL. If there is a knock it's get his playoff record better.
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