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Old 10-03-2013, 11:27 PM    (permalink
gpngc
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Originally Posted by ElectricEye View Post
That's some pretty good perspective. Similar to how I feel about him as an NFL player.

Ultimately, I probably wouldn't take him high the first round though, even if he deserves to be taken there. The upside is immense, but there's a very real chance that his game doesn't translate. One of the reasons Roethlisberger has been able to get away with playing that way over the years is his size. It really seems like his body is made of different stuff than everyone else sometimes. It's not just that he can take a beating. Loads of guys can do that. He literally has things broken and just plays through it. The game against Cleveland where he had his ankle snapped and played right through it is one of the most impressive things I've ever seen on a football field. If you're going to play that way, hits like that are a reality. I'm just not sure anyone besides Roethlisberger can take it. The one thing Manziel has going for him there is his footspeed, which will probably let him be more effective at dodging bad situations, but all it takes is a single play.

His arm also concerns me. If you just look at it in a vacuum, it's certainly strong enough to be an effective NFL quarterback. I'm not sure it's strong enough for the type of player he is. A lot of those spectacular plays may turn into interceptions. We've seen it a bit at times in college already.

That's not even getting into character. That road is well traveled though, not even worth discussing. It's impossible to deny that he has something special to his game though. Throwing all the tangible elements of scouting, he simply sees the field and does things in a way other guys cannot.
Manziel is a really intriguing prospect. There's A LOT to like.

But I share your concerns. I also don't know if his SPEED will translate. He's very elusive but I'm not sure he runs under a 4.6. Simply put, he's not going to be this dynamic as a runner/scrambler at 4.7. That's just the difference between the NFL and college.

But smarts, accuracy, deep ball, touch. He's got it all. He might need Andy Dalton pills for outside breaking routes.

From what I see on the field, if I need a QB, I'm researching the **** out of his off-field, paying close attention to his measurements and athletic tests, and going in person to see if he can spin it outside the hashes with velocity. I can't answer all of those questions, but I'd probably guess he'd pass those eye tests and I'd decide YES to Manziel as high as No. 1 overall (pending my final evals of the other QBs).

I have nothing to back this up, but just based on what we know about the media and most of his wrongdoings, the character stuff is probably overblown. He's arrogant because he's ******* awesome and he's young and immature. The only thing that perks my ears up is the alcoholism rumor. But even that - 20-year olds drink - especially in the offseason. Teams will be able to discern if that's a real problem when the time comes.
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Old 10-04-2013, 12:02 AM    (permalink
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His athleticism and playmaking ability to me are almost exact copies of Russell Wilson. Neither of them have RG3 or Vick level speed and they don't have Newton's size but they're incredibly elusive. Also they both have an incredible awareness of what's going on around them while they're evading defenders.

With that said there are a lot of things that separate them as players. Manziel doesn't have as much arm strength as Wilson and doesn't have Wilson's polish as a pocket passer. Everyone gets excited about Manziel's playmaking ability but he very rarely shows the ability to step up in the pocket, make a read, and deliver a ball on time. To me Manziel has to learn a lot before he becomes a successful NFL Qb.

The other thing that concerns me about him are his maturity issues. I think the majority of the offseason stuff regarding him has been overblown but I do think it raises concerns over his maturity level and for a guy that I think needs to work hard to succeed that makes me really worried.

I see the talent and I really can imagine him succeeding in the NFL. I can see a team taking him at the end of round 1 and it being a steal but if I were a GM it wouldn't be my team taking him. If he didn't have the maturity issues I would see him as a risky investment that's worth it but right now I see too much potential for him to bust.
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Old 10-05-2013, 11:01 AM    (permalink
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So whats the reason?
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Old 10-19-2013, 04:25 PM    (permalink
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Johnny Manziel ... how can you not love the way he plays?
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Old 10-19-2013, 04:31 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by D-Unit View Post
Johnny Manziel ... how can you not love the way he plays?
as a pro OC id worry he'd play a bit too YOLO
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Old 10-19-2013, 04:56 PM    (permalink
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as a pro OC id worry he'd play a bit too YOLO
The OC's nightmare is also the opposing DC's nightmare.

I think he'd be an awesome weapon for a team that already had a lot of pieces in place. .. like Houston.
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Old 10-19-2013, 05:45 PM    (permalink
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Manziel doesn't have as much arm strength as Wilson and doesn't have Wilson's polish as a pocket passer. Everyone gets excited about Manziel's playmaking ability but he very rarely shows the ability to step up in the pocket, make a read, and deliver a ball on time. To me Manziel has to learn a lot before he becomes a successful NFL Qb.
He did that on his latest touchdown in today's game against Auburn, a 33 yard strike where he stepped up in the pocket after going through his reads and hit Evans right in the endzone.
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Old 10-19-2013, 06:25 PM    (permalink
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IT'S JOHNNY TIME!!!!

Who honestly thinks the man can be denied???
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Old 10-19-2013, 06:27 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by D-Unit View Post
The OC's nightmare is also the opposing DC's nightmare.

I think he'd be an awesome weapon for a team that already had a lot of pieces in place. .. like Houston.
So... what're you saying about Manziel?

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IT'S JOHNNY TIME!!!!

Who honestly thinks the man can be denied???
Denied.

Last edited by twiz : 10-19-2013 at 06:32 PM.
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Old 10-19-2013, 07:10 PM    (permalink
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Manziel will get broked in the NFL at this rate.
Fun as hell to watch tho
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Old 10-19-2013, 07:53 PM    (permalink
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So... what're you saying about Manziel?



Denied.
Spectacular historic 500+ yards passing and a loss??? This guy is the next Tony Romo!
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Old 10-19-2013, 08:19 PM    (permalink
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He's a good college quarterback. His game doesn't translate to the NFL.
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Old 10-19-2013, 08:30 PM    (permalink
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Spectacular historic 500+ yards passing and a loss??? This guy is the next Tony Romo!
454 yds passing. And a loss. Get it right D.
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Old 10-19-2013, 11:16 PM    (permalink
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He did that on his latest touchdown in today's game against Auburn, a 33 yard strike where he stepped up in the pocket after going through his reads and hit Evans right in the endzone.
Well I said very rarely, not never. I didn't watch the end of the game but from the small amount of the game I did watch he's still trying to escape out of the back of the pocket and make a throw on the run. He's going to have to learn to step up in the pocket more often in the NFL.

I think the comparison to Romo is decent but he's not a polished as Romo at this point so he's going to need some time to develop like Romo did. He's got more athleticism and more upside than Romo but he also has some character concerns.
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Old 10-19-2013, 11:18 PM    (permalink
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He's a good college quarterback. His game doesn't translate to the NFL.
This. I just can't see it.
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Old 10-19-2013, 11:27 PM    (permalink
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He's a good college quarterback. His game doesn't translate to the NFL.
What about his game doesn't translate? I think he has the tools to be a good NFL QB.
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Old 10-19-2013, 11:38 PM    (permalink
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He's a fantastic and innovative player with special skills, but people will see what they want to see because of the story.
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Old 10-19-2013, 11:41 PM    (permalink
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I don't like the Romo comparison. I think Manziel compares very well to Johnny Football.

I really don't know if he will succeed in the NFL but I wouldn't be surprised if he did.
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Old 10-20-2013, 04:57 AM    (permalink
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People need to open up their thinking a little bit. I'm not saying people's opinions about Manziel's pro prospects are off base, but remember there were a contingent of us who said two year's ago that Russell Wilson would be a top 10 pick if he were 6'2.

And yet there were others who believed he simply could not play in the pros regardless.

Manziel won't be able to run around like he does as much as he does to buy time. But that element of his game won't be totally eliminated in the NFL.

The kid is mobile and has an innate feel and elusiveness to avoid a pass rush, something that cannot be taught.

THe only thing I wonder about Manziel is why is he doing all that scrambling??
Is his recognition after the snap slower than it should be, like Roethlisberger?

Manziel's too small to play Big Ben's game in the NFL.

But I don't see why he can't approximate Romo at the next level.
IMO that's who Manziel is, a more athletic Tony Romo.
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Old 10-20-2013, 07:30 AM    (permalink
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Manziel = Jeff Garcia
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Old 10-20-2013, 08:26 AM    (permalink
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Everyone is gonna have him going to Houston in mocks. If Gary Kubiak sticks around he could be good fit in that offense. run, run, boot. TD Johnny.
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Old 10-20-2013, 10:27 AM    (permalink
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Manziel has the talent to play at the next level, he is instant offense - he has not played a poor game his whole career, he puts up points and has elevated his game from last year. He is alot like Vick athletically and in style of play but a better passer and more disciplined when throwing from the pocket. If Bridgewater, Mariota, Boyd and Hundley are being touted as first round QBs on this board I see no reason Manziel can't be as well.
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Old 10-20-2013, 01:03 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by prock View Post
What about his game doesn't translate? I think he has the tools to be a good NFL QB.
He doesn't have a great arm. He's going to get hurt a lot. His athleticism is overrated. He looks better than he is athletically because of his feel for the game. He has instincts that can't be taught. Also, a lot of the good throws he makes are because of Mike Evans.
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Old 10-20-2013, 11:25 PM    (permalink
Brown Leader
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Originally Posted by princefielder28 View Post
Manziel = Jeff Garcia
Looks like Garcia ...plays like Vick.
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Are you not entertained? Is this not why you are here?
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....ask Brandon Weeden.
Pre-Draft 2014 Mock *FULL DRAFT*
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Old 10-20-2013, 11:57 PM    (permalink
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He doesn't have a great arm. He's going to get hurt a lot. His athleticism is overrated. He looks better than he is athletically because of his feel for the game. He has instincts that can't be taught. Also, a lot of the good throws he makes are because of Mike Evans.
This. I want Manziel to prove me wrong and succeed though. I feel like one of the major sports really needs a Mayweather/Ali-esque personality. As much as most would hate it, I would LOVE a trash talker, cocky person that really stirs the pot in the media and constantly tells us how amazing they are.

I hope Johnny Football can grow into that, lol.
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fwiw, i amz deunks ofs myt ass. ilo vez drinmoinz befotre i post. wha t a hreat ideas.z.
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