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Old 11-05-2013, 08:24 PM    (permalink
D-Unit
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Originally Posted by Trogdor View Post
To add on Ha Ha he's a nice centerfielder that I honestly rate higher than Mark Barron. IMHO by the time the draft rolls around he's going to be a top 10 pick and well out of our reach.

I hope I'm wrong as pairing him with Wilcox would be a very nice back end :D
I haven't been able to get a good read on HCD. Is he really elite? I wasn't a big believer in Barron, and he went way higher than I thought. Haven't really followed his pro career either. I just know he's pretty good at racking up tackles (which isn't always a good indicator of being able to cover). If HCD is better do you think he'd be available to us in Round 1 if Barron didn't even get out of the top 10?
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Old 11-05-2013, 09:14 PM    (permalink
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I haven't been able to get a good read on HCD. Is he really elite? I wasn't a big believer in Barron, and he went way higher than I thought. Haven't really followed his pro career either. I just know he's pretty good at racking up tackles (which isn't always a good indicator of being able to cover). If HCD is better do you think he'd be available to us in Round 1 if Barron didn't even get out of the top 10?
We might be picking in the top 10.
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Old 11-05-2013, 09:53 PM    (permalink
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I haven't been able to get a good read on HCD. Is he really elite? I wasn't a big believer in Barron, and he went way higher than I thought. Haven't really followed his pro career either. I just know he's pretty good at racking up tackles (which isn't always a good indicator of being able to cover). If HCD is better do you think he'd be available to us in Round 1 if Barron didn't even get out of the top 10?
HCD is MUCH more fluid than Barron ever was. He's pretty close to the ideal speed, size, and explosiveness. He is also much more adept at being a ball-hawk. He also catches the ball like a wide receiver.

He'll be off the board in the top 15 if not the top 10. The only thing that could drop him is off-the-field issues. He was suspended two games this season for violating “team rules and policies.” With Saban it is pretty hard to get suspended when you are a star player so this is concerning. Luckily for us Garrett and Saban are best buddies so we will get the full run-down.

Also keep in mind I typically underrate 'Bama prospects due to the talent level they have. So for me to highly rate an Alabama prospect it means I really like him :)
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Old 11-06-2013, 08:41 AM    (permalink
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I wouldn't mind the FS in round 1 but right now I'm liking the idea of Cyril Richardson.
It's early and I don't think you can go wrong with Dix because our safety issue has been going on for a long time.
But I want a dominating presence on the interior line, we haven't had one since Larry Allen.
I like the idea of pairing him with Frederick to give Romo more time and opening holes for our struggling running game.

Look at the sight of him coming at you..lol

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Old 11-06-2013, 10:25 AM    (permalink
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I wouldn't mind the FS in round 1 but right now I'm liking the idea of Cyril Richardson.
It's early and I don't think you can go wrong with Dix because our safety issue has been going on for a long time.
But I want a dominating presence on the interior line, we haven't had one since Larry Allen.
I like the idea of pairing him with Frederick to give Romo more time and opening holes for our struggling running game.

Look at the sight of him coming at you..lol

I am a Big fan of Richardson (no pun intended) but I think we are going to pick somewhere between 15 and 20 which is too rich for any of the guards in this draft. Plus I think between Cyril, Gabe Jackson, and David Yankey someone has to fall into the mid 2nd round where we will be picking.

How would you guys feel about the team taking the approach that Carolina took last year when they loaded up at DT. Possibly taking Hageman and Jerningan with back to back picks if they are available.
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Old 11-06-2013, 10:54 AM    (permalink
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This team has been frustrating no doubt. We always seem to have our fair share of stars though, and our units seem to go from bad to good and good to bad at different times, never quite all aligning at once (except in 2008 when we had 13 Pro Bowlers)... but this is the life of an NFL fan. There is misery every where you look around the league. 49ers are a proud franchise like us, but they haven't won a SB since the 90's as well. They bounced back pretty good last year on the shoulders of good coaching and a brand new shiny QB. It might take the same thing for us. ... which doesn't bode well for Garrett and Romo.
Yea but it starts at the top. JH gets a bulk of the credit and he deserves praise but any good team is only as good as its GM and personnel department. Baalke started the process before JH came in the building. Before he was officially the GM really. I question why there is no true 'football guy' at the head of the ship in Dallas. JJ is a businessman, not a 'football guy'. To me, that's where the problems start.
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Old 11-06-2013, 11:01 AM    (permalink
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Yea but it starts at the top. JH gets a bulk of the credit and he deserves praise but any good team is only as good as its GM and personnel department. Baalke started the process before JH came in the building. Before he was officially the GM really. I question why there is no true 'football guy' at the head of the ship in Dallas. JJ is a businessman, not a 'football guy'. To me, that's where the problems start.
And you'd be 100% correct.
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Old 11-06-2013, 11:48 AM    (permalink
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I am a Big fan of Richardson (no pun intended) but I think we are going to pick somewhere between 15 and 20 which is too rich for any of the guards in this draft. Plus I think between Cyril, Gabe Jackson, and David Yankey someone has to fall into the mid 2nd round where we will be picking.

How would you guys feel about the team taking the approach that Carolina took last year when they loaded up at DT. Possibly taking Hageman and Jerningan with back to back picks if they are available.
It's all conjecture at this point and I don't really like "falling in love" with a prospect because it never works out lol so give me help along both interior lines and a free safety and I'll be happy. The running back they can acquire via free agency or a trade perhaps but it also needs to be addressed to some degree.

Oh and while you're at it santa a new head coach and a GM. ;)

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Old 11-06-2013, 12:55 PM    (permalink
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Yea but it starts at the top. JH gets a bulk of the credit and he deserves praise but any good team is only as good as its GM and personnel department. Baalke started the process before JH came in the building. Before he was officially the GM really. I question why there is no true 'football guy' at the head of the ship in Dallas. JJ is a businessman, not a 'football guy'. To me, that's where the problems start.
At the same time, there are a lot of successful teams that give their Head Coach, GM duties (Belichick/Reid/etc). In Dallas that has largely been the case as well. The official title of GM belongs to Jerry, but the job of picking the players has belonged mostly to the coaches and scouts. Jerry brings in his gems once in a while, like TO and Roy Williams... but I don't think it's a secret that Dallas coaches and scouts work together to form the roster. Jerry may not be a true football guy (though I think he's learned a lot along the way), but the guys forming this roster are. I'll say what I keep thinking... that our success is dependent on the guys Jerry surrounds himself with. In that manner, that's where the problems start... so if he doesn't pick the right guys, then Jerry is a the top of the blame. But the blame doesn't start with him being the one building this roster. Onesies...twosies...ok, but the 53 man roster doesn't belong to Jerry's credit/blame.
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Old 11-06-2013, 01:00 PM    (permalink
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It's all conjecture at this point and I don't really like "falling in love" with a prospect because it never works out lol so give me help along both interior lines and a free safety and I'll be happy. The running back they can acquire via free agency or a trade perhaps but it also needs to be addressed to some degree.

Oh and while you're at it santa a new head coach and a GM. ;)
I've been catching up with Richardson and yeah man... I've been impressed! Fits our style of offensive lineman to a T!

...oh and has anyone seen Lache Seastrunk??? HOLY MOLY! Wouldn't mind drafting him as early as Round 2! HE'S A STUD! Gamebreaker! Just not sure if he's a full time type back. Similar to mold to Gio Bernard in Cincy, but I think Seastrunk has incredible hips that can turn and run full steam without losing speed. When he breaks it he has a special gear.
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Old 11-06-2013, 01:29 PM    (permalink
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I've been catching up with Richardson and yeah man... I've been impressed! Fits our style of offensive lineman to a T!

...oh and has anyone seen Lache Seastrunk??? HOLY MOLY! Wouldn't mind drafting him as early as Round 2! HE'S A STUD! Gamebreaker! Just not sure if he's a full time type back. Similar to mold to Gio Bernard in Cincy, but I think Seastrunk has incredible hips that can turn and run full steam without losing speed. When he breaks it he has a special gear.
We draft Murray, we draft Randall, now we are going to throw in another 2nd on another part time back? That certainly fits in with Jerrahs shiny toys over substance drafts of the past. Repeat after me. We need linemen, no skill position players this draft please!!!
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Old 11-06-2013, 01:38 PM    (permalink
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We draft Murray, we draft Randall, now we are going to throw in another 2nd on another part time back? That certainly fits in with Jerrahs shiny toys over substance drafts of the past. Repeat after me. We need linemen, no skill position players this draft please!!!
Weren't you just complaining about not taking Eddie Lacy?

Murray was a 3rd rounder who we've gotten our return on already. His contract is up and I personally don't want to throw big money in order to keep him. He hasn't shown enough durability or consistency. Randle was a 6th round depth guy. Let's not pretend like the investment and expectations are sky high for him.

I like Seastrunk a lot and I wouldn't be mad at the pick, but as I mentioned, him being a full time back is questionable to me, so we would need some sort of RB combination. That said, if he ended up like Darren Sproles (speedy/pass catching RB), that pick would be awesome.
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Old 11-06-2013, 01:52 PM    (permalink
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Weren't you just complaining about not taking Eddie Lacy?

Murray was a 3rd rounder who we've gotten our return on already. His contract is up and I personally don't want to throw big money in order to keep him. He hasn't shown enough durability or consistency. Randle was a 6th round depth guy. Let's not pretend like the investment and expectations are sky high for him.

I like Seastrunk a lot and I wouldn't be mad at the pick, but as I mentioned, him being a full time back is questionable to me, so we would need some sort of RB combination. That said, if he ended up like Darren Sproles (speedy/pass catching RB), that pick would be awesome.
Ummmmm Nope. But if we take a skill position player in the top 3 rounds I'm gonna puke!
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Old 11-06-2013, 02:21 PM    (permalink
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Ummmmm Nope. But if we take a skill position player in the top 3 rounds I'm gonna puke!
Oh ok. Others think a case should've been made for him.

BTW, in your mock Clinton-Dix is a skill position player. lol

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Old 11-06-2013, 02:39 PM    (permalink
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Oh ok. Others think a case should've been made for him.

BTW, in your mock Clinton-Dix is a skill position player. lol
Lol. I guess I should have said Offensive
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Old 11-06-2013, 03:56 PM    (permalink
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Theres this interesting toy that you can try I saw it on another thread here.

http://draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=57645

my draft was this lol I'm not sure how the grading system works because those first 4 would be amazing!!

Nfl Draft Game 2014Logged in as: jas
Your Team: Dallas Cowboys
GAME OVER!


Your score is: 2683 (Drafting Ability: D+, Player Quality B, Future Draft Picks: N/A)

Your Picks:
Round 1 Pick 20: Hasean Clinton-Dix, FS, Alabama (A)
Round 2 Pick 20: Cyril Richardson, OG, Baylor (A)
Round 3 Pick 20: DaQuan Jones, DT, Penn State (A)
Round 4 Pick 20: Aaron Donald, DT, Pittsburgh (A-)
Round 5 Pick 20: Austin Wentworth, OT, Fresno State (C+)
Round 7 Pick 20: Brandon Dixon, CB, Northwest Missouri State (D+)
Round 7 Pick 24: Anthony Hitchens, OLB, Iowa (D-)
Round 7 Pick 32: B.J. Butler, FB, Louisville (F)

I didn't do any trading because I just went through it quick but they offer trades.

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Old 11-06-2013, 04:26 PM    (permalink
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Weren't you just complaining about not taking Eddie Lacy?

Murray was a 3rd rounder who we've gotten our return on already. His contract is up and I personally don't want to throw big money in order to keep him. He hasn't shown enough durability or consistency. Randle was a 6th round depth guy. Let's not pretend like the investment and expectations are sky high for him.

I like Seastrunk a lot and I wouldn't be mad at the pick, but as I mentioned, him being a full time back is questionable to me, so we would need some sort of RB combination. That said, if he ended up like Darren Sproles (speedy/pass catching RB), that pick would be awesome.
What makes you think that Murray is going to require big money? He's looked good when healthy, but the health stigma is enough to keep people from wanting to drop a lot of money on him. I think they could keep him for cheap. I don't think that running back is even a need at this point. The bigger problems are offensive line and the coaches not running at all. I'd rather they keep Murray and Randle as it is while focusing on building a quality line to give them holes.
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Old 11-06-2013, 04:37 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Jas View Post
Theres this interesting toy that you can try I saw it on another thread here.

http://draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=57645

my draft was this lol I'm not sure how the grading system works because those first 4 would be amazing!!

Nfl Draft Game 2014Logged in as: jas
Your Team: Dallas Cowboys
GAME OVER!


Your score is: 2683 (Drafting Ability: D+, Player Quality B, Future Draft Picks: N/A)

Your Picks:
Round 1 Pick 20: Hasean Clinton-Dix, FS, Alabama (A)
Round 2 Pick 20: Cyril Richardson, OG, Baylor (A)
Round 3 Pick 20: DaQuan Jones, DT, Penn State (A)
Round 4 Pick 20: Aaron Donald, DT, Pittsburgh (A-)
Round 5 Pick 20: Austin Wentworth, OT, Fresno State (C+)
Round 7 Pick 20: Brandon Dixon, CB, Northwest Missouri State (D+)
Round 7 Pick 24: Anthony Hitchens, OLB, Iowa (D-)
Round 7 Pick 32: B.J. Butler, FB, Louisville (F)

I didn't do any trading because I just went through it quick but they offer trades.
Cool find. I traded out of the first and got a boatload in return. Even took a RB and QB with some of the extra picks.


Your score is: 3864 (Drafting Ability: B-, Player Quality A, Future Draft Picks: N/A)

Your Picks:
Round 2 Pick 3 (MINN): Cyril Richardson, OG, Baylor (A)
Round 2 Pick 29 (N.E.): Daniel McCullers, DT, Tennessee (A-)
Round 3 Pick 3 (MINN): Aaron Colvin, CB, Oklahoma (A)
Round 3 Pick 20: DaQuan Jones, DT, Penn State (B+)
Round 3 Pick 29 (N.E.): De'Anthony Thomas, RB, Oregon (A-)
Round 3 Pick 31 (MINN): Dion Bailey, FS, Southern California (A)
Round 4 Pick 3 (MINN): Sean Hickey, OT, Syracuse (A)
Round 4 Pick 20: Andrew Jackson, ILB, Western Kentucky (A-)
Round 4 Pick 29 (N.E.): Deandre Coleman, DT, California (A-)
Round 5 Pick 20: Jimmy Garoppolo, QB, Eastern Illinois (B+)
Round 5 Pick 29 (N.E.): Boseko Lokombo, OLB, Oregon (A)
Round 7 Pick 20: Corey Nelson, OLB, Oklahoma (C)
Round 7 Pick 24: Jimmie Ward, SS, Northern Illinois (B-)
Round 7 Pick 32: Zack Kerr, DT, Delaware (C-)
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Old 11-06-2013, 04:50 PM    (permalink
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Fun game but it's broken since player values are off a lot of times.
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Old 11-06-2013, 04:54 PM    (permalink
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What makes you think that Murray is going to require big money? He's looked good when healthy, but the health stigma is enough to keep people from wanting to drop a lot of money on him. I think they could keep him for cheap. I don't think that running back is even a need at this point. The bigger problems are offensive line and the coaches not running at all. I'd rather they keep Murray and Randle as it is while focusing on building a quality line to give them holes.
I don't mind him back on the cheap. I wouldn't pay him more than $2M a year. I wouldn't give him a contract longer than 3 years. IMO, you have to be an elite back to get a second contract. We learned a hard lesson from MB3 when he no longer could produce.

If we had a young guy with fresh legs who had amazing potential, I could be convinced to take him as early as the Mid 2nd Round. I don't believe in Round 1 RBs though.
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Old 11-06-2013, 06:19 PM    (permalink
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It's all conjecture at this point and I don't really like "falling in love" with a prospect because it never works out lol so give me help along both interior lines and a free safety and I'll be happy. The running back they can acquire via free agency or a trade perhaps but it also needs to be addressed to some degree.

Oh and while you're at it santa a new head coach and a GM. ;)
FA RBs are terrible moves, imo. Usually have worn out tread on their tires or cost a pretty penny. I think getting help in the trenches in FA would be an ideal move. I just don't know if we'll be big spenders in FA.
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Old 11-06-2013, 06:20 PM    (permalink
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HCD is MUCH more fluid than Barron ever was. He's pretty close to the ideal speed, size, and explosiveness. He is also much more adept at being a ball-hawk. He also catches the ball like a wide receiver.

He'll be off the board in the top 15 if not the top 10. The only thing that could drop him is off-the-field issues. He was suspended two games this season for violating “team rules and policies.” With Saban it is pretty hard to get suspended when you are a star player so this is concerning. Luckily for us Garrett and Saban are best buddies so we will get the full run-down.

Also keep in mind I typically underrate 'Bama prospects due to the talent level they have. So for me to highly rate an Alabama prospect it means I really like him :)
Cool beans! I just hope we're not picking in the Top 15. :/
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Old 11-06-2013, 06:36 PM    (permalink
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I don't mind him back on the cheap. I wouldn't pay him more than $2M a year. I wouldn't give him a contract longer than 3 years. IMO, you have to be an elite back to get a second contract. We learned a hard lesson from MB3 when he no longer could produce.

If we had a young guy with fresh legs who had amazing potential, I could be convinced to take him as early as the Mid 2nd Round. I don't believe in Round 1 RBs though.
Yeah that Barber contract was pretty bad. He ran himself into the ground pretty early too. I don't think that's the case with Murray yet, and I like Randle a lot. I don't see these guys getting much room to do something, so I hope they get some new blood on the line to make that unit dominant again. Tyron is playing fantastic this season, and Frederick is looking like a real good find. Now they need some guys to go along with that since I don't think that Leary or Mack is the answer. Leary has potential, but he's just average right now. Waters probably will be gone now that he's hurt, and Mack damn sure isn't good. I still worry about Free too, so I would love it if they went pretty hard at the trenches next draft.

Imagine if they got a good, young guy that was in between Tyron and Frederick. I would be awesome seeing them dominate. I'd much rather them fix the line before getting any more backs because I think the same problem would happen.
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Old 11-06-2013, 06:52 PM    (permalink
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Yeah that Barber contract was pretty bad. He ran himself into the ground pretty early too. I don't think that's the case with Murray yet, and I like Randle a lot. I don't see these guys getting much room to do something, so I hope they get some new blood on the line to make that unit dominant again. Tyron is playing fantastic this season, and Frederick is looking like a real good find. Now they need some guys to go along with that since I don't think that Leary or Mack is the answer. Leary has potential, but he's just average right now. Waters probably will be gone now that he's hurt, and Mack damn sure isn't good. I still worry about Free too, so I would love it if they went pretty hard at the trenches next draft.

Imagine if they got a good, young guy that was in between Tyron and Frederick. I would be awesome seeing them dominate. I'd much rather them fix the line before getting any more backs because I think the same problem would happen.
I think we all would LOVE to have a dominant line. I don't necessarily think that you have to draft the OL before the RB in order for it all to come together though. I think you have to gauge the value of the players and the draft class for the position. Yes, our OL has to get an infusion of talent. But I don't think that's a prerequisite for improving our ground game.

If we had Adrian Peterson instead of Murray and we had the same line, I wouldn't have any doubts about us being able to run the ball better.

It's just a guage of talent and what you can piece together with the available resources. I'd want a rare OG over a RB if there were several good RBs I liked and vice versa, I'd want a rare RB over a OG if there were several good OGs I liked.
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Old 11-06-2013, 06:54 PM    (permalink
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Yeah that Barber contract was pretty bad. He ran himself into the ground pretty early too. I don't think that's the case with Murray yet, and I like Randle a lot. I don't see these guys getting much room to do something, so I hope they get some new blood on the line to make that unit dominant again. Tyron is playing fantastic this season, and Frederick is looking like a real good find. Now they need some guys to go along with that since I don't think that Leary or Mack is the answer. Leary has potential, but he's just average right now. Waters probably will be gone now that he's hurt, and Mack damn sure isn't good. I still worry about Free too, so I would love it if they went pretty hard at the trenches next draft.

Imagine if they got a good, young guy that was in between Tyron and Frederick. I would be awesome seeing them dominate. I'd much rather them fix the line before getting any more backs because I think the same problem would happen.
Oh yeah and another thing, I think we're smartening up with the way we do new deals. The deal we gave Sean Lee, the way we handled Anthony Spencer, and even the Romo deal, they are much better than the contracts we gave to MB3, Free and Ratliff.
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