Draft Countdown Forums

Go Back   Draft Countdown Forums > Draft Countdown Forums > Pro Football

Pro Football Discuss professional football.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-19-2013, 02:07 AM    (permalink
Control
Rookie
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 57
Reputation: -12533
Control Control Control Control Control Control Control Control Control Control Control
Default Where does Steve Young rank all-time among QBs?

#1? Top 5? Top 10? top 15? Lower? Who would you put ahead of him?
Control is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 04:40 AM    (permalink
Ness
Legend
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: California
Posts: 21,053
Reputation: 2263548
Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

And here we go again.
__________________

"Every light must fade, every heart return to darkness!"
-San Francisco 49ers: Five Time Super Bowl Champions-
Quote:
Originally Posted by Borat View Post
Oh, my bad. Didn't realize SWDC was the pinnacle of class and grace.
Ness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 05:15 AM    (permalink
Control
Rookie
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 57
Reputation: -12533
Control Control Control Control Control Control Control Control Control Control Control
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ness View Post
And here we go again.
Great post, bro. It's posts like these, as well as the porn **** in your avatar, that make everyone respect you so much.
Control is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 06:37 AM    (permalink
FUNBUNCHER
All-Pro
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Dodge City
Posts: 7,620
Reputation: 1199061
FUNBUNCHER is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.FUNBUNCHER is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.FUNBUNCHER is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.FUNBUNCHER is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.FUNBUNCHER is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.FUNBUNCHER is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.FUNBUNCHER is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.FUNBUNCHER is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.FUNBUNCHER is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.FUNBUNCHER is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.FUNBUNCHER is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Underrated. Elite QB. One of those 'take your pick' kind of guys.
Not really important where he's ultimately ranked, if he's QBing your team, your squad is potentially capable of beating anyone.

RG3 has a picture of Steve Young in his locker.
__________________
FUNBUNCHER is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 07:37 AM    (permalink
WCH
All-Pro
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 5,164
Reputation: 3461560
WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

I always mentally organize the QBs based on who was the best of their primary decade. It's completely arbitrary and not the best way to organize them, but it's what I do in my head. The best by decade were probably: Peyton Manning, Brett Favre, Dan Marino, Fran Tarkenton, Johnny Unitas, Otto Graham, and Sammy Baugh. From there, I add in the next in line; and we get guys like Tom Brady, Steve Young, Joe Montana, Roger Staubach, Bart Starr, and Sid Luckman. Also, John Elway.

I think that's probably a fairly accurate approximation of the Top-15, in no particular order (I only named 14, but close enough).

Last edited by WCH : 10-19-2013 at 07:57 AM.
WCH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 09:41 AM    (permalink
XxXdragonXxX
Pro Bowler
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 4,598
Reputation: 693936
XxXdragonXxX is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.XxXdragonXxX is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.XxXdragonXxX is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.XxXdragonXxX is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.XxXdragonXxX is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.XxXdragonXxX is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.XxXdragonXxX is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.XxXdragonXxX is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.XxXdragonXxX is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.XxXdragonXxX is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.XxXdragonXxX is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Just behind Colin Kaepernick - Jaws




Ness, who's the girl in your av?
__________________
"Oh **** it's Kam, RUN!!!"
XxXdragonXxX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 09:49 AM    (permalink
J-Mike88
All-Pro
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Titletown USA
Posts: 9,886
Reputation: 1472737
J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by XxXdragonXxX View Post
Ness, who's the girl in your av?
It's his niece "Daisy".
J-Mike88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 12:10 PM    (permalink
Ness
Legend
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: California
Posts: 21,053
Reputation: 2263548
Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Control View Post
Great post, bro. It's posts like these, as well as the porn **** in your avatar, that make everyone respect you so much.
Precisely. Just look at that rep build up. You better get a move on son.
__________________

"Every light must fade, every heart return to darkness!"
-San Francisco 49ers: Five Time Super Bowl Champions-
Quote:
Originally Posted by Borat View Post
Oh, my bad. Didn't realize SWDC was the pinnacle of class and grace.

Last edited by Ness : 10-19-2013 at 12:14 PM.
Ness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 12:13 PM    (permalink
Halsey
All-Pro
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Cookeville,TN
Posts: 5,007
Reputation: 667043
Halsey is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Halsey is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Halsey is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Halsey is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Halsey is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Halsey is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Halsey is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Halsey is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Halsey is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Halsey is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Halsey is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Somewhere between Joe Montana and Blaine Gabbert.
__________________
What?
Halsey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 01:54 PM    (permalink
Eazy Picks
Veteran
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 716
Reputation: 469019
Eazy Picks is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Eazy Picks is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Eazy Picks is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Eazy Picks is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Eazy Picks is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Eazy Picks is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Eazy Picks is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Eazy Picks is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Eazy Picks is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Eazy Picks is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Eazy Picks is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Without actually counting off the QBs, Im gonna say top 15. His shortened career definitely hurts his rep, but he still holds the record im pretty sure for most touchdowns in a Super Bowl. Some of my earliest memories of watching football were Steve Young, the guy was fearless as a runner, but was always underrated as a passer.
Eazy Picks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 01:58 PM    (permalink
ViperVisor
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 2,473
Reputation: 762396
ViperVisor is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ViperVisor is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ViperVisor is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ViperVisor is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ViperVisor is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ViperVisor is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ViperVisor is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ViperVisor is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ViperVisor is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ViperVisor is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.ViperVisor is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WCH View Post
I always mentally organize the QBs based on who was the best of their primary decade. It's completely arbitrary and not the best way to organize them, but it's what I do in my head. The best by decade were probably:
There is no probably. Steve Young was the best in the 90s.

Young 101 Passer Rating
Favre 87 Passer Rating

Young would also of been 15th best RB in rush yards, 6th in rush TDs.
__________________
ViperVisor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 02:52 PM    (permalink
Ness
Legend
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: California
Posts: 21,053
Reputation: 2263548
Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by XxXdragonXxX View Post
Ness, who's the girl in your av?
Brandi Love.

Quote:
Originally Posted by J-Mike88 View Post
It's his niece "Daisy".
Come on J-Mike. "Daisy"? Really?
__________________

"Every light must fade, every heart return to darkness!"
-San Francisco 49ers: Five Time Super Bowl Champions-
Quote:
Originally Posted by Borat View Post
Oh, my bad. Didn't realize SWDC was the pinnacle of class and grace.
Ness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 02:56 PM    (permalink
Ness
Legend
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: California
Posts: 21,053
Reputation: 2263548
Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ViperVisor View Post
There is no probably. Steve Young was the best in the 90s.

Young 101 Passer Rating
Favre 87 Passer Rating

Young would also of been 15th best RB in rush yards, 6th in rush TDs.
You already know the common rebuttal to that though is right? Favre vs. Young in the 1990's? Well there are two actually.
__________________

"Every light must fade, every heart return to darkness!"
-San Francisco 49ers: Five Time Super Bowl Champions-
Quote:
Originally Posted by Borat View Post
Oh, my bad. Didn't realize SWDC was the pinnacle of class and grace.
Ness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 05:29 PM    (permalink
JordanTaber
Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 721
Reputation: -58773
JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ness View Post
You already know the common rebuttal to that though is right? Favre vs. Young in the 1990's? Well there are two actually.
2-1 GB? Meh, doesn't say much of anything.

Favre was only great for 3 years (95-97). Never the same after the thumb problems.
JordanTaber is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 05:39 PM    (permalink
prock
All-Pro
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 9,156
Reputation: 2098837
prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JordanTaber View Post
2-1 GB? Meh, doesn't say much of anything.

Favre was only great for 3 years (95-97). Never the same after the thumb problems.
He was pretty great in 09.
__________________

Bonekrusher.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JordanTaber View Post
Football...it's rocket surgery now, folks.
prock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 05:56 PM    (permalink
Raiderz4Life
All-NFLDC
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: R4L 3:16 says I just whipped your ass
Posts: 14,645
Reputation: 3110954
Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

I have him behind Ken the Snake, George Blanda, and Rich Gannon
__________________

Props to BK for the sig
"Dying ain't much of a living, boy" -Josey Wales
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitanHope View Post
R4L does security, and strips on the weekend.
He told me the best part is being able to wear the same uniform to both jobs.
Raiderz4Life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 09:37 PM    (permalink
Ness
Legend
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: California
Posts: 21,053
Reputation: 2263548
Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JordanTaber View Post
2-1 GB? Meh, doesn't say much of anything.

Favre was only great for 3 years (95-97). Never the same after the thumb problems.
Not the win/loss record. The two biggest points I've heard brought up over the years is the durability factor for one. Steve Young unfortunately was not as durable as Favre was. The result of running around was a factor obviously, but also Young had a penchant for suffering a few concussions. I don't think that was ever a huge problem for Favre. Young's absence unfortunately effected the 49ers chances in winning a couple of big games from the mid 90's onward. Two that come to mind is the Monday Night game against the Packers in 1996 and the divisional playoff game against the Packers in 1996.

The second thing I hear is that Steve Young was fortunately to have a safety valve in Jerry Rice over the years along with other guys like Terrell Owens, John Taylor, and Brent Jones. The closest Favre had to a superstar was Sharpe whom he only played with for three seasons as a starter. His MVP years came after Sharpe was gone. Not that Favre was playing with scrubs. Freeman, Brooks, Rison, and Chimura were all good guys, but none had the gravitas as Rice and/or they got hurt or just weren't around that long.

In the end I think Young was still a better player with all things rolling. At the end of the day you still have to make the proper throw at the proper time, and Young did that. Favre also had those WTF games. Especially post 90's in the playoffs. I don't think Young ever threw more than three interceptions in a game. It's kind of like the Elway/Montana argument. A lot of people say Montana had it easy because of the talent around him and had a better team than the Broncos, but at the end of the day you still have to make the throws. If you can get your team to the Super Bowl then there isn't any reason you shouldn't be able to win it (Elway).

Personally I think Favre had more than three great seasons. Maybe one could say he had three or four first team All Pro type years. But the majority of his other years were at least at a Pro Bowl type level.
__________________

"Every light must fade, every heart return to darkness!"
-San Francisco 49ers: Five Time Super Bowl Champions-
Quote:
Originally Posted by Borat View Post
Oh, my bad. Didn't realize SWDC was the pinnacle of class and grace.

Last edited by Ness : 10-19-2013 at 09:40 PM.
Ness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2013, 01:09 AM    (permalink
JordanTaber
Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 721
Reputation: -58773
JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ness View Post
Not the win/loss record. The two biggest points I've heard brought up over the years is the durability factor for one. Steve Young unfortunately was not as durable as Favre was. The result of running around was a factor obviously, but also Young had a penchant for suffering a few concussions. I don't think that was ever a huge problem for Favre. Young's absence unfortunately effected the 49ers chances in winning a couple of big games from the mid 90's onward. Two that come to mind is the Monday Night game against the Packers in 1996 and the divisional playoff game against the Packers in 1996.
All right, I can accept that durability could be considered an issue with Young...but you know who else had durability issues? A certain Joe Montana. He was constantly beat up and missing games/coming out during games, and he had a habit of diving to the ground any time he saw a sack coming that Young certainly never did.

2 major back injuries in 10 years as a starter, and various other injuries that caused him to miss significant time.

We know Favre was the iron horse, but sometimes I think he may have been better off sitting out some games to recover from his injuries. They wound up hurting his performance...plus he developed an addiction to pain killers that could have killed him.

Quote:
The second thing I hear is that Steve Young was fortunately to have a safety valve in Jerry Rice over the years along with other guys like Terrell Owens, John Taylor, and Brent Jones. The closest Favre had to a superstar was Sharpe whom he only played with for three seasons as a starter. His MVP years came after Sharpe was gone. Not that Favre was playing with scrubs. Freeman, Brooks, Rison, and Chimura were all good guys, but none had the gravitas as Rice and/or they got hurt or just weren't around that long.
Rice wasn't the same player after 1995, though. In much the same way as Favre was able to move on from the loss of Sharpe, Young worked around slowing (and in 97, injured) Rice to develop a rapport with the other receivers. Owens had a learning curve in those early years.

Quote:
In the end I think Young was still a better player with all things rolling. At the end of the day you still have to make the proper throw at the proper time, and Young did that. Favre also had those WTF games. Especially post 90's in the playoffs. I don't think Young ever threw more than three interceptions in a game. It's kind of like the Elway/Montana argument. A lot of people say Montana had it easy because of the talent around him and had a better team than the Broncos, but at the end of the day you still have to make the throws. If you can get your team to the Super Bowl then there isn't any reason you shouldn't be able to win it (Elway).

Personally I think Favre had more than three great seasons. Maybe one could say he had three or four first team All Pro type years. But the majority of his other years were at least at a Pro Bowl type level.
I don't know, I kind of thought the Packers put some good players and a good scheme around him for a number of years (the Sherman years, with Ahman Green taking the load off him) and he more or less stayed at the same good, not great level. Holmgren was able to keep his gunslinger mentality in check for a few years, but he eventually relapsed. That 2001 Rams/Packers divisional playoff game was an embarrassment.
JordanTaber is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2013, 01:10 AM    (permalink
nepg
Icon
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 16,192
Reputation: 1955636
nepg is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.nepg is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.nepg is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.nepg is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.nepg is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.nepg is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.nepg is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.nepg is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.nepg is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.nepg is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.nepg is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raiderz4Life View Post
I have him behind Ken the Snake, George Blanda, and Rich Gannon
Ahead of Plunkett? Seriously?
__________________

Last edited by nepg : 10-20-2013 at 01:12 AM.
nepg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2013, 01:17 AM    (permalink
Raiderz4Life
All-NFLDC
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: R4L 3:16 says I just whipped your ass
Posts: 14,645
Reputation: 3110954
Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by nepg View Post
Ahead of Plunkett? Seriously?
Gtdamn it!! I knew I was forgetting someone but I couldn't remember who!

I feel sad I forgot Jimmy Plunkett :(
__________________

Props to BK for the sig
"Dying ain't much of a living, boy" -Josey Wales
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitanHope View Post
R4L does security, and strips on the weekend.
He told me the best part is being able to wear the same uniform to both jobs.
Raiderz4Life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2013, 07:56 AM    (permalink
J-Mike88
All-Pro
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Titletown USA
Posts: 9,886
Reputation: 1472737
J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.J-Mike88 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

How would you rank Young of the 80's?
Factor it all in.
J-Mike88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2013, 07:57 AM    (permalink
WCH
All-Pro
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 5,164
Reputation: 3461560
WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.WCH is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

As somebody who watched every single game, week in and week out, I can confidently say that Mike Sherman was the Packers problem during the Sherman years. He would try to run out the clock a full two quarters too soon, throw temper tantrums and "shut down" on the sideline during games, hire his buddies who weren't necessarily qualified for the job, and was just overall promoted to his level of incompetence. He's a good assistant coach and I think a solid college coach, but he should never have been a Head Coach and GM in the NFL. Most of Favre's worst games came when they would fall into a hole early, and he'd have to try to bail them out. The Packers just simply should have had more success with Favre and Green.

I'm surprised that Favre vs. Young is what people latched onto. I expected more hatred for Tarkenton over Staubach.

Last edited by WCH : 10-20-2013 at 08:10 AM.
WCH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2013, 01:08 PM    (permalink
Ness
Legend
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: California
Posts: 21,053
Reputation: 2263548
Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by J-Mike88 View Post
How would you rank Young of the 80's?
Factor it all in.
Steve Young wasn't a starter until 1991. At least with the 49ers.

If you want to talk about his days with the Buccaneers he was horrible. But the entire Buccaneers organization was horrible and would continue to be horrible for another decade.
__________________

"Every light must fade, every heart return to darkness!"
-San Francisco 49ers: Five Time Super Bowl Champions-
Quote:
Originally Posted by Borat View Post
Oh, my bad. Didn't realize SWDC was the pinnacle of class and grace.

Last edited by Ness : 10-20-2013 at 01:22 PM.
Ness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2013, 01:40 PM    (permalink
Ness
Legend
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: California
Posts: 21,053
Reputation: 2263548
Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JordanTaber View Post
All right, I can accept that durability could be considered an issue with Young...but you know who else had durability issues? A certain Joe Montana. He was constantly beat up and missing games/coming out during games, and he had a habit of diving to the ground any time he saw a sack coming that Young certainly never did.

2 major back injuries in 10 years as a starter, and various other injuries that caused him to miss significant time.

We know Favre was the iron horse, but sometimes I think he may have been better off sitting out some games to recover from his injuries. They wound up hurting his performance...plus he developed an addiction to pain killers that could have killed him.
Well yes Montana did have durability issues. But we aren't talking about Montana. We're talking about Young and Favre. So I'm not sure how that's relevant.

Anyways, yeah Favre did take Vicodin a lot. Ironically that was during his best years as a pro though. I don't think it was a problem after 1996. There are probably a handful of games where Favre played and it might have been better for him to sit out, but I can't remember any significant ones off the top of my head.



Quote:
Originally Posted by JordanTaber View Post
Rice wasn't the same player after 1995, though. In much the same way as Favre was able to move on from the loss of Sharpe, Young worked around slowing (and in 97, injured) Rice to develop a rapport with the other receivers. Owens had a learning curve in those early years.
Not sure if I agree with that. Rice was still one of the top receivers in the league at that point. And he was still taking five yard slants the distance and getting behind the defense deep. Sure his statistics went down after his best year in 1995, but he was still a 1,100-1,200 receiver. The 49ers were also trying to spread the ball a lot more to younger talent like Owens and Stokes. Jones was still on the team another two years as well. And when Rice was absent in 1997, Steve Young didn't go down the field that much (only 9 times over 30 yards all year) and barely had over 200 yards passing per game. He also only had 19 touchdowns passing in 15 games started that year. Granted, we were ranked near the bottom in pass attempts (probably a result of a more conservative approach with Rice gone and trying to utilize the running game in Mariucci's first year). But Young's touchdown percentage that year for the amount of games he played wasn't as good as he's had in the past. Or what he would have just one season later.
__________________

"Every light must fade, every heart return to darkness!"
-San Francisco 49ers: Five Time Super Bowl Champions-
Quote:
Originally Posted by Borat View Post
Oh, my bad. Didn't realize SWDC was the pinnacle of class and grace.
Ness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2013, 02:01 PM    (permalink
JordanTaber
Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 721
Reputation: -58773
JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber JordanTaber
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ness View Post
Well yes Montana did have durability issues. But we aren't talking about Montana. We're talking about Young and Favre. So I'm not sure how that's relevant.

Anyways, yeah Favre did take Vicodin a lot. Ironically that was during his best years as a pro though. I don't think it was a problem after 1996. There are probably a handful of games where Favre played and it might have been better for him to sit out, but I can't remember any significant ones off the top of my head.





Not sure if I agree with that. Rice was still one of the top receivers in the league at that point. And he was still taking five yard slants the distance and getting behind the defense deep. Sure his statistics went down after his best year in 1995, but he was still a 1,100-1,200 receiver. The 49ers were also trying to spread the ball a lot more to younger talent like Owens and Stokes. Jones was still on the team another two years as well. And when Rice was absent in 1997, Steve Young didn't go down the field that much (only 9 times over 30 yards all year) and barely had over 200 yards passing per game. He also only had 19 touchdowns passing in 15 games started that year. Granted, we were ranked near the bottom in pass attempts (probably a result of a more conservative approach with Rice gone and trying to utilize the running game in Mariucci's first year). But Young's touchdown percentage that year for the amount of games he played wasn't as good as he's had in the past. Or what he would have just one season later.
Rice had 0 plays of 40+ yards in 1996 (and only 11 20+) and averaged only 11.6 yards/catch. His YAC average also fell to 3.0.

The 49ers' get-Rice-the-ball agenda in 1998 actually hurt the offense, as Owens was clearly the better receiver at that point, but they still featured a noticeably slower/less explosive Rice.

My point on Montana is, unless you would also hold Montana's durability against him in an argument with him vs. other quarterbacks, you shouldn't hold Young to that standard. If we were comparing Montana vs. Favre, I doubt the issue of Montana's durability would be brought up by anyone.
JordanTaber is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:45 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.