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Old 12-16-2013, 11:34 AM    (permalink
Jomoz
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Default Is there a 4-3 DE you'd rather have for the next 5+ years than Robert Quinn?

Is there? If I were building a 4-3 defense right now, I think the first player I'd take is Robert Quinn of the Rams.

The kid is unbelievable. He has elite first step quickness, elite speed around the edge, and enough strength to mix in the bull-rush. On top of that he has a great motor.

The only other player I'd want in a 4-3 over Quinn is *maybe* JJ Watt to play DT or DE, but even at that I don't think Watt has Quinn's blinding athleticism and speed, and Quinn has the highest ceiling of any defensive player in the NFL right now.
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Old 12-16-2013, 11:44 AM    (permalink
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Yeah he's purty good.
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Old 12-16-2013, 12:02 PM    (permalink
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I will take Clowney! No seriously I like Quinn a lot but I think I need to see another season or two before going out on a long term limb.
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Old 12-16-2013, 01:19 PM    (permalink
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'Highest ceiling of any defensive player in the NFL right now.'

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Old 12-16-2013, 01:35 PM    (permalink
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vs. Peterson - I think you always take the elite edge rusher over the elite CB.

vs. Miller - Great player as well but he can't play DE and he has shown some issues with maturity/substance abuse. I think Quinn can have more of an impact in his career potentially.

vs. Hardy - Hardy is a solid DE on a good defense, but has not shown the speed and ability that Quinn has.

vs. Wilkerson - Wilkerson is a 3-4 run-stuffing DE. He's an amazing run stuffer and a solid pass rusher, but this league is all about pass rush first and foremost. I'd take an elite pass rusher like Quinn over Wilkerson every day.
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Old 12-16-2013, 01:36 PM    (permalink
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vs. Peterson - I think you always take the elite edge rusher over the elite CB.

vs. Miller - Great player as well but he can't play DE and he has shown some issues with maturity/substance abuse. I think Quinn can have more of an impact in his career potentially.

vs. Kuechly - Hardy is a great MLB on a good defense, but MLB doesn't affect the passing game nearly as much as pass rushing DE

vs. Wilkerson - Wilkerson is a 3-4 run-stuffing DE. He's an amazing run stuffer and a solid pass rusher, but this league is all about pass rush first and foremost. I'd take an elite pass rusher like Quinn over Wilkerson every day.
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Old 12-16-2013, 01:42 PM    (permalink
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I'd take a 12 sack two way player like Wilkerson any day over an 18 sack pass rusher like Quinn. I think players like Wilkerson make the players around them able to play more aggressively whereas a Quinn makes his own played play more conservatively.

That being said, the year 3 improvement of both of those guys is incredible. I'm hoping for the same from Chandler Jones.
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Old 12-16-2013, 01:45 PM    (permalink
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Jomoz, re-read your OP.

You said highest ceiling of any defensive player in the game, not highest ceiling of any DE or pass rusher in the game.

All those guys have HOF ceilings. Quinn isn't the only great young defender in the NFL.
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Old 12-16-2013, 10:09 PM    (permalink
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J. clowney
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Old 12-17-2013, 03:16 AM    (permalink
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I don't care what defense I am building but for the next 5 years I am taking JJ Watt. Quinn is an awesome player but give me interior pressure every day over edge pressure.
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Old 12-17-2013, 06:43 AM    (permalink
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What the hell happened to JPP?
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The end. Cut to black. Audience goes ****ing ape****.
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Old 12-17-2013, 06:46 AM    (permalink
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What the hell happened to JPP?
Did you not here? He's not even as good as Brandon Graham!!!
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Old 12-17-2013, 07:02 AM    (permalink
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Did you not here? He's not even as good as Brandon Graham!!!
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I heard that Sylvester Stallone wrote The Expendables with The Alex in mind. He had to keep it realistic though and split The Alex's abilities into multiple characters. Stallone thought that critics would pan it for being too far-fetched if he just had one character effing everyone up.
The end. Cut to black. Audience goes ****ing ape****.
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Old 12-17-2013, 01:06 PM    (permalink
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What the hell happened to JPP?
Seems like he hasn't done anything outside of his one good year in 2011.

People are too quick to label players as the next big thing. Sometimes players just have a good year or two and never go on to repeat that performance.
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Old 12-17-2013, 01:50 PM    (permalink
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JPP is hurt. If can ever get back close to 90%, I think he re-establishes himself as one of the top pass rushers in the game.
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Old 12-17-2013, 01:58 PM    (permalink
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I've still got to go with Hardy, every defense needs a wizard.

In seriousness, I remember when we recruited Quinn out of high school, but dropped him because it appeared his career was probably over due to a tumor. And then that turned out to not be true, and he dominated at UNC instead.

There are a number of other defensive players I'd take over him, but he's certainly among the premier young pass rushers.
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Old 12-17-2013, 09:41 PM    (permalink
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J.J. Watt is the man you are looking for. He provides versatility, production and leadership along with the fact that he is 24. He affects the game in all the ways a defensive player can: gets tackles for loss, FF, blocks passes and gets tons of SACKS and pressure.
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Old 12-17-2013, 10:06 PM    (permalink
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Chandler Jones.
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Old 12-17-2013, 10:15 PM    (permalink
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Jones doesnt get consistent pressure and disappears for too long of stretches in games. I like him, and think hes a good player but alot of sacks this year have been the result of coverage sacks.
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Old 12-17-2013, 10:46 PM    (permalink
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JPP is hurt. If can ever get back close to 90%, I think he re-establishes himself as one of the top pass rushers in the game.
He wasn't that great last year either. How long does it take for an injury to heal?

Sometimes players have one good year and then you don't hear a peep from them again. They're called "one year wonders". Happens all the time. Sometimes injuries are a part of that, sometimes they're not.

If Pierre Paul suffered an injury that saps him of his explosiveness and he never returns to the player he was in 2011, he won't be the first player or the last player to have a promising career derailed by injuries.
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Old 12-18-2013, 12:15 AM    (permalink
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If you call Watt a DE, I take him but he really is closer to a DT than a DE. He makes his plays inside. He is a true middle between the positions; he is strong enough to play the run but way too quick for interior guys to block him.

I might also consider Clowney as crazy as it sounds. He could bust horribly but his potential is as high as it gets.
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Old 12-18-2013, 12:50 AM    (permalink
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Justin Houston

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Old 12-18-2013, 03:45 AM    (permalink
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Jones doesnt get consistent pressure and disappears for too long of stretches in games. I like him, and think hes a good player but alot of sacks this year have been the result of coverage sacks.
I think Descendency was likely being facetious with saying Jones, however I think his improvement this year has been great and if he can build on that he could be on of the top DEs in the league.

The problem I have is what I saw of him in college has rung true in the pros. He doesn't have the ability to bend the corner as an end of the line player but gets his pressures and TFLs from using his length, strength and ability to disengage. I always thought he could make a great 5 technique and I now believe that even more.

That being said I am not sure there are many pure 43 DEs at this point in time who is a better run defender than Jones.
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Old 12-18-2013, 04:28 AM    (permalink
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2nd in sacks (15.0)
1st in forced fumbles (7)
4th in fumble recoveries (2)
3rd in hits on the quarterback (20)
2nd in hurries on the quarterback (48)
1st in total quarterback disruptions (83)
4th overall among 4-3 defensive ends against the run.

Did anyone see his Forced Fumble this week versus the Saints? He's been unblockable this year. I'm kind of hoping the Rams take Clowney because that's gonna be a fun D-Line to watch.
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Old 12-18-2013, 09:16 AM    (permalink
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I don't think I would take Clowney if I am the Rams. I would trade down again if possible and take a O-lineman, db, or DT. However, if someone out there warrants the number two or three overall pick, then I would stay put.
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