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Old 07-31-2006, 12:21 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Don Vito
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Originally Posted by cardsalltheway
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Dontrelle. If he were on a powerhouse team he would be unbelievable.
cuz zambrano is on a powerhouse team :roll:
The Marlins have thrived on pitching for many years. So when Dontrelle is on the mound, he has the game essentially on his shoulders.


Up until this year, the cubs have been pretty good on offense. So if Zambrano were to give up 5 runs, the game would not be over.
What are you talking about?
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Old 07-31-2006, 12:25 PM    (permalink
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The d-train is pitching before the worst rated defense in the league.

He has already posted 22 wins, and won a Cy Young. He has already won a World Series. He pitches on a team with a payroll 1/8 that of the Cubs.


I will take Willis also because from a marketing sense he is one of the best faces in the majors. The guy has that aura and love of the game you can market. Black, Spanish, White, Green, Grey, everyone loves guys with personality like that.

He is just one of those kids it is impossible to hate.
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Old 07-31-2006, 12:26 PM    (permalink
 
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Originally Posted by Finsfan79
The d-train is pitching before the worst rated defense in the league.

He has already posted 22 wins, and won a Cy Young. He has already won a World Series. He pitches on a team with a payroll 1/8 that of the Cubs.


I will take Willis also because from a marketing sense he has one of the best faces in the majors. The guy has that aura and love of the game you can market. Black, Spanish, White, Green, Grey, everyone loves guys with personality like that.

He is just one of those kids it is impossible to hate.
are you gay?

anway Zambrano is more experienced, has a better career ERA and is an all around better pitcher than Dontrelle.
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Old 07-31-2006, 12:27 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cardsalltheway
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finsfan79
The d-train is pitching before the worst rated defense in the league.

He has already posted 22 wins, and won a Cy Young. He has already won a World Series. He pitches on a team with a payroll 1/8 that of the Cubs.


I will take Willis also because from a marketing sense he has one of the best faces in the majors. The guy has that aura and love of the game you can market. Black, Spanish, White, Green, Grey, everyone loves guys with personality like that.

He is just one of those kids it is impossible to hate.
are you cool?

anway Zambrano is more experienced, has a better career ERA and is an all around better pitcher than Dontrelle.
He means marketing wise..
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Old 07-31-2006, 12:29 PM    (permalink
 
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Originally Posted by stillaraiderfan
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Originally Posted by cardsalltheway
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Originally Posted by Finsfan79
The d-train is pitching before the worst rated defense in the league.

He has already posted 22 wins, and won a Cy Young. He has already won a World Series. He pitches on a team with a payroll 1/8 that of the Cubs.


I will take Willis also because from a marketing sense he has one of the best faces in the majors. The guy has that aura and love of the game you can market. Black, Spanish, White, Green, Grey, everyone loves guys with personality like that.

He is just one of those kids it is impossible to hate.
are you cool?

anway Zambrano is more experienced, has a better career ERA and is an all around better pitcher than Dontrelle.
He means marketing wise..
i was just kidding
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Old 07-31-2006, 12:29 PM    (permalink
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I would take Willis just because, he is one of my favs but, he is not as consistant as Zambrano.
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Old 07-31-2006, 12:33 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stillaraiderfan
Quote:
Originally Posted by cardsalltheway
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finsfan79
The d-train is pitching before the worst rated defense in the league.

He has already posted 22 wins, and won a Cy Young. He has already won a World Series. He pitches on a team with a payroll 1/8 that of the Cubs.


I will take Willis also because from a marketing sense he has one of the best faces in the majors. The guy has that aura and love of the game you can market. Black, Spanish, White, Green, Grey, everyone loves guys with personality like that.

He is just one of those kids it is impossible to hate.
are you cool?

anway Zambrano is more experienced, has a better career ERA and is an all around better pitcher than Dontrelle.
He means marketing wise..
thank you, yes I did.

Show average baseball fans a picture of Willis and Zambrano. I bet 95% will know Willis. Less will Zambrano.

dont get me wrong, Zambrano is the best pitcher on the cubs, been saying that for a few years now. But still, I would rather have willis, better all around pitcher if you ask me.
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Old 07-31-2006, 12:34 PM    (permalink
 
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Originally Posted by Finsfan79
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Originally Posted by stillaraiderfan
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Originally Posted by cardsalltheway
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finsfan79
The d-train is pitching before the worst rated defense in the league.

He has already posted 22 wins, and won a Cy Young. He has already won a World Series. He pitches on a team with a payroll 1/8 that of the Cubs.


I will take Willis also because from a marketing sense he has one of the best faces in the majors. The guy has that aura and love of the game you can market. Black, Spanish, White, Green, Grey, everyone loves guys with personality like that.

He is just one of those kids it is impossible to hate.
are you cool?

anway Zambrano is more experienced, has a better career ERA and is an all around better pitcher than Dontrelle.
He means marketing wise..
thank you, yes I did.

Show average baseball fans a picture of Willis and Zambrano. I bet 95% will know Willis. Less will Zambrano.

dont get me wrong, Zambrano is the best pitcher on the cubs, been saying that for a few years now. But still, I would rather have willis, better all around pitcher if you ask me.
i was kidding about the g a y thing but explain how dontrelle is a better pitcher
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Old 07-31-2006, 12:39 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finsfan79
The d-train is pitching before the worst rated defense in the league.

He has already posted 22 wins, and won a Cy Young. He has already won a World Series. He pitches on a team with a payroll 1/8 that of the Cubs.


I will take Willis also because from a marketing sense he is one of the best faces in the majors. The guy has that aura and love of the game you can market. Black, Spanish, White, Green, Grey, everyone loves guys with personality like that.

He is just one of those kids it is impossible to hate.
He didn't win a Cy Young, Chris Carpenter won it.
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Old 07-31-2006, 12:47 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cardsalltheway
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finsfan79
Quote:
Originally Posted by stillaraiderfan
Quote:
Originally Posted by cardsalltheway
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finsfan79
The d-train is pitching before the worst rated defense in the league.

He has already posted 22 wins, and won a Cy Young. He has already won a World Series. He pitches on a team with a payroll 1/8 that of the Cubs.


I will take Willis also because from a marketing sense he has one of the best faces in the majors. The guy has that aura and love of the game you can market. Black, Spanish, White, Green, Grey, everyone loves guys with personality like that.

He is just one of those kids it is impossible to hate.
are you cool?

anway Zambrano is more experienced, has a better career ERA and is an all around better pitcher than Dontrelle.
He means marketing wise..
thank you, yes I did.

Show average baseball fans a picture of Willis and Zambrano. I bet 95% will know Willis. Less will Zambrano.

dont get me wrong, Zambrano is the best pitcher on the cubs, been saying that for a few years now. But still, I would rather have willis, better all around pitcher if you ask me.
i was kidding about the g a y thing but explain how dontrelle is a better pitcher
He has better ranger then any other pitcher around. According to most League GM's he screws up hitters the next few games often because of his release points and deception upon the ball. Yes, he doesnt throw as fast (only on average 93-91 range instead of 95-93 for zambrano), but speed isnt everything. His slider is much better and his fastball's movement is very sick.

He is younger, and when he has a league average defense (marlins defense was ranked in the lower half last year, unlike dead last here), He will see most of the balls upon the ground and easily turned for doubleplays.

His numbers last year, upon a .500 ball club with lower half of the league defense were.

2.63 era 1.13 whip 170 Ks, 236.1 innings pitched, 22-10

First black pitcher in 20+ years to break 20 wins

He also has the fact he has never been injured in his career, not even once missing a start (knock on wood), unlike Zambrano whom has missed some games each year so far of his career.

He has been the leader of his ball club since he came up in 2003 and really it was him that was the catalyst to start the winning streak and lead them to win the 2003 WS

I think overall, I would take him before Zambrano. But I would take Zambrano over most other pitchers in the game from Prior, Wood, Schilling, Randy, Felix Hernandez, etc.
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Old 07-31-2006, 12:55 PM    (permalink
 
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You said he was a better overall pitcher so age has nothing to do with it. You can't just look at one year and say those stats show that a pitcher is better. Zambrano has a better career ERA and is averaging 30 more strikeouts per season than Willis. You realize that when a player makes an error that it doesnt count against the pitchers era right?
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Old 07-31-2006, 01:19 PM    (permalink
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Haha. Well I know who you're taking next.
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Old 07-31-2006, 01:20 PM    (permalink
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Both are great and almost even in my book, but I would go with Dontrelle because he's left handed.
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Old 07-31-2006, 01:22 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by cardsalltheway
You said he was a better overall pitcher so age has nothing to do with it. You can't just look at one year and say those stats show that a pitcher is better. Zambrano has a better career ERA and is averaging 30 more strikeouts per season than Willis. You realize that when a player makes an error that it doesnt count against the pitchers era right?
not all poor defense ranks into errors dude. That is why era is a flawed system. Alot of plays that are "bad plays" arent counted as errors. Or balls hat should be gotten to but arent, which are counted as errors. It all factors into range and fielding percentages. But if you must before this year Willis had a better career ERA.

As for Strike Outs, Dontrelle isnt a strike out pitcher, if you notice I said he is a groundball pitcher that gets strike outs as well. He isnt going to give you 1 for 1 K/IP ratio. that is what becket, penny, burnett were for.

He is a different type of pitcher then that.
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Old 07-31-2006, 01:31 PM    (permalink
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Oh btw, I'd probably take Zambrano, all this stuff aside.
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Old 07-31-2006, 02:41 PM    (permalink
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This is real close. If Willis was a righty I'd say Zambrano by far. But him being a lefty pushes his value up. Still, I like Zambrano a little more.
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Old 07-31-2006, 02:47 PM    (permalink
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Both are outstanding, but I'd take willis. He hasn't shown it as much this year, but in previous years, he's let his emotions run him wild. Both are great pitchers
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Old 07-31-2006, 03:08 PM    (permalink
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Both are outstanding, but I'd take willis. He hasn't shown it as much this year, but in previous years, he's let his emotions run him wild. Both are great pitchers
you're just upset about carlos owning you this past weekend.
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Old 07-31-2006, 03:13 PM    (permalink
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Zambrano- He's a horse, has great stuff, and the only reason he doesn't get as much recognition as he should is because he is on one of the worst teams in a while.

I'm not trying to take anything away from Willis, but I just like Zambrano more.
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Old 07-31-2006, 03:40 PM    (permalink
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Both are good but i gotta go with Dontrell Willis. He's a stud. Even though he has no run support with his team he still managed to try his best to put this team behind his shoulder
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Old 07-31-2006, 04:12 PM    (permalink
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All I have to say is if if we don't get Willis in '03 we don't win the world series. Him not having Castillo and Gonzo behind him is killing him.
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Old 07-31-2006, 04:12 PM    (permalink
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wow dead even.
I love the Marlins but had to take Zambrano here
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Old 07-31-2006, 04:27 PM    (permalink
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Willis is having a bad year, but he has a history Zambrano hasn't. The definitive answer for this question comes next season.

One thing is for sure: they both are great hitters as pitchers.
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Old 08-01-2006, 01:26 PM    (permalink
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willis also is getting the top 5 lowest run support in the majors btw
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Old 08-01-2006, 01:29 PM    (permalink
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Dontrelle.
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