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Old 07-31-2006, 08:46 PM    (permalink
Bearsfan123
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Originally Posted by D-Buc
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Originally Posted by bearsfan_51
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Originally Posted by bearsfan_51
The Bears didn't have the benefit of an offense to support them last year. They scored points. They played with bad field position. And they were still the #1 defense in the league last year. They added Ricky Manning Jr and Dante Wesley to support at the corner position, they added Manning, Dvorack, Mark Anderson, and Jamar Williams to provide depth. This is with no disrespect to the other teams in the league with great defenses (Carolina, Pittsburgh, Washington) as I feel they are all better than the Bears as a total team, but nobody tops our defense, both starters and depth.
umm no they werent, the Bucs were.

and i have a feeling this board is anti-bucs(), 2 or 3 top 5 lists and the bucs arent in any? Wow...... :?
Oh stop it. The Bucs were first in yardage and that is only because the Bears put in their 3rd string against the Vikings in week 17. The Bears were still first in scoring (which is all that counts) even in spite of that. Any Bucs fan that actually asserts their defense was #1 without looking at the facts is just being a homer.
First in scoring is all that counts? So you can be first in scoring yet give up the most yards and it would matter? So you saying "first in scoring is all that matters" is false, and the bucs WERE the #1 defense last year.

I'll admit the Bears have a GREAT defense, just about everyone is a ballhawk but the bears haven't had their defense in the top 7 for 10 years straight. So I'd take Bucs defense over Bears defense any day of the week. Call me a homer all you want.
i believe this poll is wrong too, but i believe Carolina has the best D in the league. They have a stellar D line, a great group of corners. The only weakness is linebackers. Safeties arent all that great either.

Tampa's D is getting old, you know that. Yeah they still have some great players but they are aging. The Bears are the NEW Bucs. Not as talented, IMO as the Bucs back in the day. But none the less a great D.

my rankings
1 Carolina
2 Pittsburgh
3 Chicago
4 Washington
5 Tampa or Cowboys
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Old 07-31-2006, 08:46 PM    (permalink
bearsfan_51
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Originally Posted by bearsfan_51
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Originally Posted by D-Buc
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Originally Posted by bearsfan_51
The Bears didn't have the benefit of an offense to support them last year. They scored points. They played with bad field position. And they were still the #1 defense in the league last year. They added Ricky Manning Jr and Dante Wesley to support at the corner position, they added Manning, Dvorack, Mark Anderson, and Jamar Williams to provide depth. This is with no disrespect to the other teams in the league with great defenses (Carolina, Pittsburgh, Washington) as I feel they are all better than the Bears as a total team, but nobody tops our defense, both starters and depth.
umm no they werent, the Bucs were.

and i have a feeling this board is anti-bucs(), 2 or 3 top 5 lists and the bucs arent in any? Wow...... :?
Oh stop it. The Bucs were first in yardage and that is only because the Bears put in their 3rd string against the Vikings in week 17. The Bears were still first in scoring (which is all that counts) even in spite of that. Any Bucs fan that actually asserts their defense was #1 without looking at the facts is just being a homer.
First in scoring is all that counts? So you can be first in scoring yet give up the most yards and it would matter? So you saying "first in scoring is all that matters" is false, and the bucs WERE the #1 defense last year.

I'll admit the Bears have a GREAT defense, just about everyone is a ballhawk but the bears haven't had their defense in the top 7 for 10 years straight. So I'd take Bucs defense over Bears defense any day of the week. Call me a homer all you want.
You're a homer. And yes scoring is all that matters. I don't care if they give up 400 yards, if they only allow 3 points your team still wins, you should know that-it's the staple of the cover 2.

The Bucs are a defense that is aging, the Bears are a defense that is rising. Yes the Bucs defense has been tremendous over the last 10 years, and Monte Kiffen will still keep them at the top of the league for years to come, but they aren't the best anymore.
How much do you want to bet bucs will have the #1 defense again this year?
You're going to bet on the Bucs versus the rest of the league? I'll bet you any damn thing you want.
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Old 07-31-2006, 08:48 PM    (permalink
 
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Originally Posted by D-Buc
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Originally Posted by D-Buc
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Originally Posted by bearsfan_51
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Originally Posted by D-Buc
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Originally Posted by bearsfan_51
The Bears didn't have the benefit of an offense to support them last year. They scored points. They played with bad field position. And they were still the #1 defense in the league last year. They added Ricky Manning Jr and Dante Wesley to support at the corner position, they added Manning, Dvorack, Mark Anderson, and Jamar Williams to provide depth. This is with no disrespect to the other teams in the league with great defenses (Carolina, Pittsburgh, Washington) as I feel they are all better than the Bears as a total team, but nobody tops our defense, both starters and depth.
umm no they werent, the Bucs were.

and i have a feeling this board is anti-bucs(), 2 or 3 top 5 lists and the bucs arent in any? Wow...... :?
Oh stop it. The Bucs were first in yardage and that is only because the Bears put in their 3rd string against the Vikings in week 17. The Bears were still first in scoring (which is all that counts) even in spite of that. Any Bucs fan that actually asserts their defense was #1 without looking at the facts is just being a homer.
First in scoring is all that counts? So you can be first in scoring yet give up the most yards and it would matter? So you saying "first in scoring is all that matters" is false, and the bucs WERE the #1 defense last year.

I'll admit the Bears have a GREAT defense, just about everyone is a ballhawk but the bears haven't had their defense in the top 7 for 10 years straight. So I'd take Bucs defense over Bears defense any day of the week. Call me a homer all you want.
You're a homer. And yes scoring is all that matters. I don't care if they give up 400 yards, if they only allow 3 points your team still wins, you should know that-it's the staple of the cover 2.

The Bucs are a defense that is aging, the Bears are a defense that is rising. Yes the Bucs defense has been tremendous over the last 10 years, and Monte Kiffen will still keep them at the top of the league for years to come, but they aren't the best anymore.
How much do you want to bet bucs will have the #1 defense again this year?
You're going to bet on the Bucs versus the rest of the league? I'll bet you any damn thing you want.
How about you baby?

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Old 07-31-2006, 08:49 PM    (permalink
bearsfan_51
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Umm..... :?
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Old 07-31-2006, 08:53 PM    (permalink
 
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Umm..... :?
im just f'king around.
i like this face better :!:
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Old 07-31-2006, 08:57 PM    (permalink
 
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Originally Posted by 4
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Umm..... :?
im just f'king around.
i like this face better :!:
:!: :!: :!: :!: :!: :!:
B TT R
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Old 07-31-2006, 08:59 PM    (permalink
 
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Originally Posted by bearsfan_51
Umm..... :?
im just f'king around.
i like this face better :!:
:!: :!: :!: :!: :!: :!:
B TT R
SUPER :!: :!:
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Old 07-31-2006, 09:02 PM    (permalink
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what do the ravens run
4-6 / 4-4 / 3-4 / 4-3 ?
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Old 07-31-2006, 09:41 PM    (permalink
Beans
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I voted Bucs, but who else would I vote for?
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Old 07-31-2006, 09:44 PM    (permalink
 
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what do the ravens run
4-6 / 4-4 / 3-4 / 4-3 ?
actualy they run a 10-10
they ran 46 last year, and theyre going to a 4-3 this year i believe.
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Old 07-31-2006, 09:44 PM    (permalink
 
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I voted Bucs, but who else would I vote for?
Houston Texans
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Old 07-31-2006, 10:08 PM    (permalink
steelersfan43
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hmmm miami and the browns are on it but not pittsburgh or dallas :?
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Old 07-31-2006, 10:16 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Buc
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Originally Posted by bearsfan_51
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Buc
Quote:
Originally Posted by bearsfan_51
The Bears didn't have the benefit of an offense to support them last year. They scored points. They played with bad field position. And they were still the #1 defense in the league last year. They added Ricky Manning Jr and Dante Wesley to support at the corner position, they added Manning, Dvorack, Mark Anderson, and Jamar Williams to provide depth. This is with no disrespect to the other teams in the league with great defenses (Carolina, Pittsburgh, Washington) as I feel they are all better than the Bears as a total team, but nobody tops our defense, both starters and depth.
umm no they werent, the Bucs were.

and i have a feeling this board is anti-bucs(), 2 or 3 top 5 lists and the bucs arent in any? Wow...... :?
Oh stop it. The Bucs were first in yardage and that is only because the Bears put in their 3rd string against the Vikings in week 17. The Bears were still first in scoring (which is all that counts) even in spite of that. Any Bucs fan that actually asserts their defense was #1 without looking at the facts is just being a homer.
First in scoring is all that counts? So you can be first in scoring yet give up the most yards and it would matter? So you saying "first in scoring is all that matters" is false, and the bucs WERE the #1 defense last year.

I'll admit the Bears have a GREAT defense, just about everyone is a ballhawk but the bears haven't had their defense in the top 7 for 10 years straight. So I'd take Bucs defense over Bears defense any day of the week. Call me a homer all you want.
Well, the Cardinals were the 10th rated defense last season, but were 28th in points allowed. But it's okay. The fact that they gave up the 10th fewest yards obviously proves they are a top 10 defense. It doesn't matter that they gave up 24 points a game, because yards are more important than points.
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Old 07-31-2006, 11:30 PM    (permalink
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It's easily the Chicago Bears, by far. They've only gotten better over the off-season. Chicago and Dallas are my NFC Front-Runners, but that's off-topic.
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Old 07-31-2006, 11:38 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Surtain & Law
what do the ravens run
4-6 / 4-4 / 3-4 / 4-3 ?
I am preety sure a mix of 4-4 and 4-3.
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Old 07-31-2006, 11:57 PM    (permalink
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Default Re: Who has the best Defense in the NFL?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4
this year i say Ravens Defence will be a scoreing machine

what your awnsers?
No Oakland? :?

:P Just kidding. I'll go with... Dallas.
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Old 08-01-2006, 12:03 AM    (permalink
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Bearsfan's Defensive Rankings

I didn't give the ranking a WHOLE lot of thought so don't jump down my throat if your team is 7th and you think they should be 3rd.

1)Bears
2)Chargers
3)Washington
4)Pittsburgh
5)Carolina
6)Tampa
7)Seattle
8)Dallas
9)Jacksonville
10)Baltimore
11)Denver
12)New England
13)New York Giants
14)Minny
15)Cleveland
16)Miami
17)Philly
18)Atlanta
19)Indy
20)Buffalo
21)Green Bay
22)Kansas City
23)Cincy
24)Detroit
25)St.Louis
26)Raiders
27)Arizona
28)New York Jets
29)Houston
30)San Fran
31)Tennessee
32)New Orleans
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Old 08-01-2006, 12:06 AM    (permalink
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Default Re: Who has the best Defense in the NFL?

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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4
this year i say Ravens Defence will be a scoreing machine

what your awnsers?
No Oakland? :?

:P Just kidding. I'll go with... Dallas.
Crud! Nevermind, Dallas gets 2nd place. Bears get first. Brain fart. Those things happen after 8 hour days.
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Old 08-01-2006, 08:24 AM    (permalink
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I say this with all due respect to Bears fans. I personally like the Bears, I respect the old school teams. Having that said....

Cover 2 $ucks. Thats why the Bears cannot be the best defense in the league. Ive said this before and I still believe it, Cover 2 (Tampa 2, whatever) is a regular season defense. Its simplicity, difficulty stopping power running backs, and inability to play man defense kills it in the playoffs. If youre talking about who will have the best regular season defense, then yes Chicago's is the best.

But when you get into the playoffs, where teams study tape more thoroughly and divise gameplans etc, Cover 2 lays a big egg. Only one Cover 2 team has not choked in the playoffs, and that was the year Tampa won the SB. Look at Cover 2 every other year, they always choked in the playoffs. This year alone, the Bears, Colts, and Bucs all choked in the playoffs.

The Bears defense in the playoffs this year gave up more yards than the Giants to the Panthers....and the Giants played that game with 4th string LBs...we were a walking bruise. Yet the Bears gave up more yards. What does that tell you?

To be the best defense, you must possess the ability to play man coverage. And no cover 2 team can do that. That in itself, limits what the defense can do. That kills about 50% of the possible plays the defense can throw at a qb. Confusion is half the battle. Every qb knows whats coming at them when they play a Cover 2. Its just a matter of execution. And in the playoffs where they are able to look at a year's worth of tape and break down the weaknesses of the respective defense, the Cover 2 cannot provide a counter strategy to mask its respective weaknesses, hence going back to its simplicity as a flaw.

Thats my take. Who's the best? Thats a good question, i have Baltimore, Dallas, Carolina, Jaguars, and SD all in the same level. We can only wait and see who plays at the highest level.
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Old 08-01-2006, 08:31 AM    (permalink
 
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it seems every one say Bears - then again theres alot of bears fans on here
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Old 08-01-2006, 12:45 PM    (permalink
 
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this is obviously the bears but the cowboys and colts should be on here if the eagles are.
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Old 08-01-2006, 12:53 PM    (permalink
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I'd have to say the bucs. I can only go on last years results, this year hasn't started so it's hard to say. The bears may have had a good defense last year, but then again it's not hard to be good when you play the nfc north teams twice a year. A good defense will also help you go far in the playoffs, Pittsburgh and Seattle both have very good Defenses and were the representatives in the big game. Dallas also had a good D. I'd have to rank the top 5 as this:
Bucs
Steelers
Seattle
Dallas
chargers
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Old 08-01-2006, 12:58 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bigbluedefense
But when you get into the playoffs, where teams study tape more thoroughly and divise gameplans etc, Cover 2 lays a big egg. Only one Cover 2 team has not choked in the playoffs, and that was the year Tampa won the SB. Look at Cover 2 every other year, they always choked in the playoffs. This year alone, the Bears, Colts, and Bucs all choked in the playoffs.

The Bears defense in the playoffs this year gave up more yards than the Giants to the Panthers....and the Giants played that game with 4th string LBs...we were a walking bruise. Yet the Bears gave up more yards. What does that tell you?
It doesn't really tell you anything at all. The Bears had a bad game. The Bears also scored points on offense which forced the Panthers to continue passing the ball whereas the Giants laid big egg on the offensive side of the ball allowing the Panthers to more or less run the clock out in the 4th quarter.

As for the cover 2 choking in the playoffs, the 2002 Bucs team was not the only sucessful Bucs team. They almost made the Superbowl in 1999 as well. The cover 2 hasn't been around that long to judge it by those standards.
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Old 08-01-2006, 01:18 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bearsfan_51
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Originally Posted by bigbluedefense
But when you get into the playoffs, where teams study tape more thoroughly and divise gameplans etc, Cover 2 lays a big egg. Only one Cover 2 team has not choked in the playoffs, and that was the year Tampa won the SB. Look at Cover 2 every other year, they always choked in the playoffs. This year alone, the Bears, Colts, and Bucs all choked in the playoffs.

The Bears defense in the playoffs this year gave up more yards than the Giants to the Panthers....and the Giants played that game with 4th string LBs...we were a walking bruise. Yet the Bears gave up more yards. What does that tell you?
It doesn't really tell you anything at all. The Bears had a bad game. The Bears also scored points on offense which forced the Panthers to continue passing the ball whereas the Giants laid big egg on the offensive side of the ball allowing the Panthers to more or less run the clock out in the 4th quarter.

As for the cover 2 choking in the playoffs, the 2002 Bucs team was not the only sucessful Bucs team. They almost made the Superbowl in 1999 as well. The cover 2 hasn't been around that long to judge it by those standards.
Thats not necessarily true. The Panthers came out scoring early and often. If you compare 1st half to 1st half, the Panthers put up way more yards against the bears, and the Bears didn't make it interesting until like halfway through the 2nd quarter.

I have nothing against the Bear's defensive players, I actually like the Bears, I enjoy rooting for the old school teams. I have a problem with the system. Even diehard bears fans will tell you theyre not really thrilled with the Cover 2. I know the days of the 46 Bear are gone, but a conventional 4-3 would be better imo. Even Urlacher himself said he doesn't particularly like Cover 2. I think he even said he hated it, but I'm not sure, so I won't say he did.

I think my main problem with Cover 2 is its vulnerability to power runners. Im a fan of old school football, and I cannot consider a defense the best if it has any type of vulnerability against the run. The best defense is a defense that can line it up and take on any running back any time any where. This game hasn't changed much. Its still all about running the ball and stopping the run. And if a defense is vulnerable to a certain run style, I simply cannot call it the best.

I know youre probably sick of hearing this, but take the Pitt game for example. When Chicago and Pitt both flexed their muscles, Pitt destroyed the Bears. That straight up muscle style will destroy Cover 2. Whereas a Pittsburgh for example, can line it up and muscle up against the Bears one week, then the next week spread it out and take on the Colts. They might not have the best statistical defense, but to me thats a better defense. Thats what I'm trying to say. Cover 2 has limitations. It cannot play man defense effectively, it cannot take on Big wide receivers in the vertical game, it has problems with power runners, has problems with big strong offensive lines, and its a simple playbook that will not surprise/confuse anybody which further limits its effectiveness in the postseason when teams are able to look at a year's worth of tape and dissect a defense and attack its tendencies. Cover 2 doesn't really have a counter strategy for this.
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Old 08-01-2006, 01:40 PM    (permalink
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1. Bears
2. Panthers
3. Redskins
4. Ravens
5. Cowboys
I think the Panthers will have the # 1 Defense
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