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Old 11-20-2006, 10:52 PM    (permalink
Basileus777
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Eli has actually gotten worse since last year.
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Old 11-20-2006, 11:15 PM    (permalink
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again,

1 game changes everyones perception..

You guys need to stop looking so short term
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Old 11-20-2006, 11:17 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Stiller
again,

1 game changes everyones perception..

You guys need to stop looking so short term

Eli Manning has been this way for the past five games...
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Old 11-20-2006, 11:25 PM    (permalink
Basileus777
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiver
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Stiller
again,

1 game changes everyones perception..

You guys need to stop looking so short term

Eli Manning has been this way for the past five games...
And pretty much the second half of last year. I was high on Eli, but these last few weeks has made me a doubter.
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Old 11-20-2006, 11:25 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Basileus777
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiver
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Stiller
again,

1 game changes everyones perception..

You guys need to stop looking so short term

Eli Manning has been this way for the past five games...
And pretty much the second half of last year.
Then why was everyone saying Rivers > Manning > Ben?
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Old 11-20-2006, 11:34 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Stiller
Quote:
Originally Posted by Basileus777
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiver
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Stiller
again,

1 game changes everyones perception..

You guys need to stop looking so short term

Eli Manning has been this way for the past five games...
And pretty much the second half of last year.
Then why was everyone saying Rivers > Manning > Ben?
Eli played pretty well earlier in the season. But he has since reverted to his old 2005 form. Eli hasn't taken the step that most predicted he would do this year. I actually think he is playing as bad as he ever has right now. Eli still has a long way to go.
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Old 11-21-2006, 02:29 AM    (permalink
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I want everybody to remember, too, how turnover prone Peyton was before Reggie Wayne developed into a bona-fide receiver.
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Old 11-21-2006, 06:51 AM    (permalink
 
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Eli has proved once again he isn't a very smart qb. That isn't a slam on him either, it is part of being a young qb. Rivers is having the best season of the three but to say he is the best of the 3 is hard to do. He hasn't played near as many games and I think the next 2 seasons will be when the comparisons can actually start to happen. As far as Ben and Eli go, all you have to do is look back at thier records and watch to see who is better. Right now Eli is just plain horrible, making stupid decisions and just doesn't have good pocket presence. There is a huge difference between Ben and Eli in the pocket. As Ben starts to feel better his game has been getting back to where it usually is, he still makes some dumb decisions but he is clearly the better qb.
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Old 11-21-2006, 09:20 AM    (permalink
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Ive been a staunch Eli supporter, and I still feel that he can eventually develop into a special qb, but I will readily admit that at this point in their developments...

1. Rivers
2. Ben
3. Eli

Eli will not go up on this list to me unless I see drastic improvement from now on until the end of the season. Is it doable? It can happen. But until it does, thats how I have it. His confidence is completely shot. TC has done a horrible job developing him by taking away his safety valve (Shockey) and sending everyone deep. And I realized why we have no checkdown. Its because our line can't block for their life, we need 6 guys minimum to block 4, its really bad right now for the Giants.

And I seriously want to see Eli run a no huddle offense. Its obvious to me that when he runs his own plays, he's a different qb. TC needs to get his head out of his ass and give Eli control.
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Old 11-21-2006, 09:39 AM    (permalink
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How long have i been saying this? ha. No disrespect. I really do not understand what people have seen in Eli, he has been mediocre throughout his short career, I wonder if people actually watch the games. I feel he will be a great Qb....one day but, right now he is just average and as of late, the giants may be better off with Andrew Walter starting. The giants should have a stout O but, Eli is holding them back. You here all of this talk about how he won the division last season, blah, blah, blah. He threw for barely 50% last season, I wonder how far they would have gone with a more accurate QB, perhaps a Philip Rivers. Eli has great weapons, weapons that other QB's dream about, big talented vet receivers, an all pro TE, and quite possibly the top RB in football (LT is better :D ). The fact of the matter is Eli has had everything he has needed but, he continues to be inaccurate and make head scratching throws. The boy is just average. period.
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Old 11-21-2006, 10:29 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by M.O.T.H.
How long have i been saying this? ha. No disrespect. I really do not understand what people have seen in Eli, he has been mediocre throughout his short career, I wonder if people actually watch the games. I feel he will be a great Qb....one day but, right now he is just average and as of late, the giants may be better off with Andrew Walter starting. The giants should have a stout O but, Eli is holding them back. You here all of this talk about how he won the division last season, blah, blah, blah. He threw for barely 50% last season, I wonder how far they would have gone with a more accurate QB, perhaps a Philip Rivers. Eli has great weapons, weapons that other QB's dream about, big talented vet receivers, an all pro TE, and quite possibly the top RB in football (LT is better :D ). The fact of the matter is Eli has had everything he has needed but, he continues to be inaccurate and make head scratching throws. The boy is just average. period.
Um sorry...but youve lost all quarterback credibility when you insisted that Drew Bledsoe was better than him, then went on to say that Romo was better after 2 starting games.

Even Eli at his worst, which was yesterday is better than Bledsoe.
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Old 11-21-2006, 10:46 AM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M.O.T.H.
How long have i been saying this? ha. No disrespect. I really do not understand what people have seen in Eli, he has been mediocre throughout his short career, I wonder if people actually watch the games. I feel he will be a great Qb....one day but, right now he is just average and as of late, the giants may be better off with Andrew Walter starting. The giants should have a stout O but, Eli is holding them back. You here all of this talk about how he won the division last season, blah, blah, blah. He threw for barely 50% last season, I wonder how far they would have gone with a more accurate QB, perhaps a Philip Rivers. Eli has great weapons, weapons that other QB's dream about, big talented vet receivers, an all pro TE, and quite possibly the top RB in football (LT is better :D ). The fact of the matter is Eli has had everything he has needed but, he continues to be inaccurate and make head scratching throws. The boy is just average. period.
Coming from one of the guys that said Bledsoe was better than Eli, and then ate his words after that Monday night game. You are a great evaluator of QB talent.

I give all 3 of these KIDS until the end of the 2007 season until I label someone a legit bust or simply a bad QB. Eli is going through a horrendous stretch right now with so many different aspects of his game on the decline. He is a turnover machine as of late and is not converting in big spots like he is able to, no doubt. But young QBs often go through rough stretches and I am sticking with him unless he is playing like this in 2008, which is a far way down the road. His mechanics and confidence in his own ability are lacking right now, 2 VERY correctable things. I don't care what his statline looks liek the rest of the way, I want the division crown and I feel Eli will lead us to it for the 2nd year in a row because of what he can do late in games.
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Eli's opportunity to become a legend.
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These last 50 seconds will define Eli Manning.
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Old 11-21-2006, 12:24 PM    (permalink
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Number 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by M.O.T.H.
How long have i been saying this? ha. No disrespect. I really do not understand what people have seen in Eli, he has been mediocre throughout his short career, I wonder if people actually watch the games. I feel he will be a great Qb....one day but, right now he is just average and as of late, the giants may be better off with Andrew Walter starting. The giants should have a stout O but, Eli is holding them back. You here all of this talk about how he won the division last season, blah, blah, blah. He threw for barely 50% last season, I wonder how far they would have gone with a more accurate QB, perhaps a Philip Rivers. Eli has great weapons, weapons that other QB's dream about, big talented vet receivers, an all pro TE, and quite possibly the top RB in football (LT is better :D ). The fact of the matter is Eli has had everything he has needed but, he continues to be inaccurate and make head scratching throws. The boy is just average. period.
Coming from one of the guys that said Bledsoe was better than Eli, and then ate his words after that Monday night game. You are a great evaluator of QB talent.

I give all 3 of these KIDS until the end of the 2007 season until I label someone a legit bust or simply a bad QB. Eli is going through a horrendous stretch right now with so many different aspects of his game on the decline. He is a turnover machine as of late and is not converting in big spots like he is able to, no doubt. But young QBs often go through rough stretches and I am sticking with him unless he is playing like this in 2008, which is a far way down the road. His mechanics and confidence in his own ability are lacking right now, 2 VERY correctable things. I don't care what his statline looks liek the rest of the way, I want the division crown and I feel Eli will lead us to it for the 2nd year in a row because of what he can do late in games.
Not to mention the fact your playing in a horrible division. The eagles are done without McNabb and the cowboys really are not that good. I would think you would win the division. The person who will lead you to it will be Tiki, not Eli.
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Old 11-21-2006, 12:29 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snortie
Quote:
Originally Posted by Number 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by M.O.T.H.
How long have i been saying this? ha. No disrespect. I really do not understand what people have seen in Eli, he has been mediocre throughout his short career, I wonder if people actually watch the games. I feel he will be a great Qb....one day but, right now he is just average and as of late, the giants may be better off with Andrew Walter starting. The giants should have a stout O but, Eli is holding them back. You here all of this talk about how he won the division last season, blah, blah, blah. He threw for barely 50% last season, I wonder how far they would have gone with a more accurate QB, perhaps a Philip Rivers. Eli has great weapons, weapons that other QB's dream about, big talented vet receivers, an all pro TE, and quite possibly the top RB in football (LT is better :D ). The fact of the matter is Eli has had everything he has needed but, he continues to be inaccurate and make head scratching throws. The boy is just average. period.
Coming from one of the guys that said Bledsoe was better than Eli, and then ate his words after that Monday night game. You are a great evaluator of QB talent.

I give all 3 of these KIDS until the end of the 2007 season until I label someone a legit bust or simply a bad QB. Eli is going through a horrendous stretch right now with so many different aspects of his game on the decline. He is a turnover machine as of late and is not converting in big spots like he is able to, no doubt. But young QBs often go through rough stretches and I am sticking with him unless he is playing like this in 2008, which is a far way down the road. His mechanics and confidence in his own ability are lacking right now, 2 VERY correctable things. I don't care what his statline looks liek the rest of the way, I want the division crown and I feel Eli will lead us to it for the 2nd year in a row because of what he can do late in games.
Not to mention the fact your playing in a horrible division. The eagles are done without McNabb and the cowboys really are not that good. I would think you would win the division. The person who will lead you to it will be Tiki, not Eli.
Now the NFC East is horrible? Ok. And the AFC North is......?

And if you want to say Tiki leads our offense, fine. But who has won games in tight spots late in games more often, Tiki or Eli? And if Tiki leads the Giants offense, the Steelers offense last year was led by the Steelers running game and defense and the Chargers are led by LT.
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Eli's opportunity to become a legend.
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These last 50 seconds will define Eli Manning.
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Old 11-21-2006, 12:30 PM    (permalink
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And Snortie...the Cowboys are aruably the top team in the NFC right now. Them and the Bears are neck and neck, and this is coming from someone who has watched a lot of the two teams play.
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Eli's opportunity to become a legend.
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Old 11-21-2006, 12:33 PM    (permalink
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Thats Eli's only saving grace right now, his late game moxy. Why does it take him so long to get it together? He looks dominant late in the game, but for the first 3 quarters he looks stagnant. I just don't get it.

And he clearly is a totally different player in the no huddle. To me, thats a telling sign that this coaching staff is not developing a game plan that utilizes his strengths, and his strengths are utilized better when he calls his own plays.

Its a good thing hte NFC is such a crapshoot. We just need to weather the storm, get healthy, and who knows what can happen.
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Old 11-21-2006, 12:37 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bigbluedefense
Thats Eli's only saving grace right now, his late game moxy. Why does it take him so long to get it together? He looks dominant late in the game, but for the first 3 quarters he looks stagnant. I just don't get it.

And he clearly is a totally different player in the no huddle. To me, thats a telling sign that this coaching staff is not developing a game plan that utilizes his strengths, and his strengths are utilized better when he calls his own plays.

Its a good thing hte NFC is such a crapshoot. We just need to weather the storm, get healthy, and who knows what can happen.
It isn't hard to figure out. I sound like a broken record here. HE IS A YOUNG QB THAT IS GOING THROUGH GROWING PAINS AND IS STILL LEARNING THE WAYS OF THE NFL.

The impatience of Giants fans and NFL fans is ridiculous to the point where it makes it look like the posters here are all under the age of 14 years old and know nothing of the NFL outside of Madden and Fantasy Football.
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Old 11-21-2006, 12:39 PM    (permalink
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Boy did those giants look bad. Both on offense and on defense. The loss of Amani Toomer looks to have made a bigger impact than i thought. Eli doesn't have a reliable disiplined route runner he can trust. He is reluctant to pull the trigger. Our defense didn't help us much either. Corey Webster should not be a starter in this league. To sum it up we got our asses handed to us, but you can't place all the blame on Eli.
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Old 11-21-2006, 12:45 PM    (permalink
 
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Originally Posted by Number 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by snortie
Quote:
Originally Posted by Number 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by M.O.T.H.
How long have i been saying this? ha. No disrespect. I really do not understand what people have seen in Eli, he has been mediocre throughout his short career, I wonder if people actually watch the games. I feel he will be a great Qb....one day but, right now he is just average and as of late, the giants may be better off with Andrew Walter starting. The giants should have a stout O but, Eli is holding them back. You here all of this talk about how he won the division last season, blah, blah, blah. He threw for barely 50% last season, I wonder how far they would have gone with a more accurate QB, perhaps a Philip Rivers. Eli has great weapons, weapons that other QB's dream about, big talented vet receivers, an all pro TE, and quite possibly the top RB in football (LT is better :D ). The fact of the matter is Eli has had everything he has needed but, he continues to be inaccurate and make head scratching throws. The boy is just average. period.
Coming from one of the guys that said Bledsoe was better than Eli, and then ate his words after that Monday night game. You are a great evaluator of QB talent.

I give all 3 of these KIDS until the end of the 2007 season until I label someone a legit bust or simply a bad QB. Eli is going through a horrendous stretch right now with so many different aspects of his game on the decline. He is a turnover machine as of late and is not converting in big spots like he is able to, no doubt. But young QBs often go through rough stretches and I am sticking with him unless he is playing like this in 2008, which is a far way down the road. His mechanics and confidence in his own ability are lacking right now, 2 VERY correctable things. I don't care what his statline looks liek the rest of the way, I want the division crown and I feel Eli will lead us to it for the 2nd year in a row because of what he can do late in games.
Not to mention the fact your playing in a horrible division. The eagles are done without McNabb and the cowboys really are not that good. I would think you would win the division. The person who will lead you to it will be Tiki, not Eli.
Now the NFC East is horrible? Ok. And the AFC North is......?

And if you want to say Tiki leads our offense, fine. But who has won games in tight spots late in games more often, Tiki or Eli? And if Tiki leads the Giants offense, the Steelers offense last year was led by the Steelers running game and defense and the Chargers are led by LT.
Who is talking about the AFC North or last year? It's this season that counts and we are talking about Eli, not Ben leading his team to the division title. Learn to read. If you think the cowboys are neck and neck with the Bears, then I can actually see why your discussing last year and this year. Be a man and admit the fact your qb can't lead his team very well. I've admitted that Ben can lead his team and win a superbowl. He may not have had a great game in the SB, but he led the Steelers there. See it's just easy to admit what the facts really are. Just like this past week. Ben led his team to victory, Eli didn't.
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Old 11-21-2006, 12:50 PM    (permalink
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How long have i been saying this? ha. No disrespect. I really do not understand what people have seen in Eli, he has been mediocre throughout his short career, I wonder if people actually watch the games. I feel he will be a great Qb....one day but, right now he is just average and as of late, the giants may be better off with Andrew Walter starting. The giants should have a stout O but, Eli is holding them back. You here all of this talk about how he won the division last season, blah, blah, blah. He threw for barely 50% last season, I wonder how far they would have gone with a more accurate QB, perhaps a Philip Rivers. Eli has great weapons, weapons that other QB's dream about, big talented vet receivers, an all pro TE, and quite possibly the top RB in football (LT is better :D ). The fact of the matter is Eli has had everything he has needed but, he continues to be inaccurate and make head scratching throws. The boy is just average. period.
Coming from one of the guys that said Bledsoe was better than Eli, and then ate his words after that Monday night game. You are a great evaluator of QB talent.

I give all 3 of these KIDS until the end of the 2007 season until I label someone a legit bust or simply a bad QB. Eli is going through a horrendous stretch right now with so many different aspects of his game on the decline. He is a turnover machine as of late and is not converting in big spots like he is able to, no doubt. But young QBs often go through rough stretches and I am sticking with him unless he is playing like this in 2008, which is a far way down the road. His mechanics and confidence in his own ability are lacking right now, 2 VERY correctable things. I don't care what his statline looks liek the rest of the way, I want the division crown and I feel Eli will lead us to it for the 2nd year in a row because of what he can do late in games.
Not to mention the fact your playing in a horrible division. The eagles are done without McNabb and the cowboys really are not that good. I would think you would win the division. The person who will lead you to it will be Tiki, not Eli.
Now the NFC East is horrible? Ok. And the AFC North is......?

And if you want to say Tiki leads our offense, fine. But who has won games in tight spots late in games more often, Tiki or Eli? And if Tiki leads the Giants offense, the Steelers offense last year was led by the Steelers running game and defense and the Chargers are led by LT.
Who is talking about the AFC North or last year? It's this season that counts and we are talking about Eli, not Ben leading his team to the division title. Learn to read. If you think the cowboys are neck and neck with the Bears, then I can actually see why your discussing last year and this year. Be a man and admit the fact your qb can't lead his team very well. I've admitted that Ben can lead his team and win a superbowl. He may not have had a great game in the SB, but he led the Steelers there. See it's just easy to admit what the facts really are. Just like this past week. Ben led his team to victory, Eli didn't.
So you tell me to talk about this year, and then you go and talk about last year's Super Bowl win?

Nobody is backing Eli here but he has been clutch in big spots THIS year. I'm assuming you forgot about the win in Philly. Or his 4th quarter drive and TD for the win against the Texans.

Tiki has played great this year and he is the most important player on our offense. But Eli had led us when it counts, 4th quarter and because of that, we are in 1st place.
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Old 11-21-2006, 12:54 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by M.O.T.H.
How long have i been saying this? ha. No disrespect. I really do not understand what people have seen in Eli, he has been mediocre throughout his short career, I wonder if people actually watch the games. I feel he will be a great Qb....one day but, right now he is just average and as of late, the giants may be better off with Andrew Walter starting. The giants should have a stout O but, Eli is holding them back. You here all of this talk about how he won the division last season, blah, blah, blah. He threw for barely 50% last season, I wonder how far they would have gone with a more accurate QB, perhaps a Philip Rivers. Eli has great weapons, weapons that other QB's dream about, big talented vet receivers, an all pro TE, and quite possibly the top RB in football (LT is better :D ). The fact of the matter is Eli has had everything he has needed but, he continues to be inaccurate and make head scratching throws. The boy is just average. period.
Coming from one of the guys that said Bledsoe was better than Eli, and then ate his words after that Monday night game. You are a great evaluator of QB talent.

I give all 3 of these KIDS until the end of the 2007 season until I label someone a legit bust or simply a bad QB. Eli is going through a horrendous stretch right now with so many different aspects of his game on the decline. He is a turnover machine as of late and is not converting in big spots like he is able to, no doubt. But young QBs often go through rough stretches and I am sticking with him unless he is playing like this in 2008, which is a far way down the road. His mechanics and confidence in his own ability are lacking right now, 2 VERY correctable things. I don't care what his statline looks liek the rest of the way, I want the division crown and I feel Eli will lead us to it for the 2nd year in a row because of what he can do late in games.
Not to mention the fact your playing in a horrible division. The eagles are done without McNabb and the cowboys really are not that good. I would think you would win the division. The person who will lead you to it will be Tiki, not Eli.
Now the NFC East is horrible? Ok. And the AFC North is......?

And if you want to say Tiki leads our offense, fine. But who has won games in tight spots late in games more often, Tiki or Eli? And if Tiki leads the Giants offense, the Steelers offense last year was led by the Steelers running game and defense and the Chargers are led by LT.
Who is talking about the AFC North or last year? It's this season that counts and we are talking about Eli, not Ben leading his team to the division title. Learn to read. If you think the cowboys are neck and neck with the Bears, then I can actually see why your discussing last year and this year. Be a man and admit the fact your qb can't lead his team very well. I've admitted that Ben can lead his team and win a superbowl. He may not have had a great game in the SB, but he led the Steelers there. See it's just easy to admit what the facts really are. Just like this past week. Ben led his team to victory, Eli didn't.
Wow, that was very manly of you. I can only dream of such manliness. Are you kidding me?

Eli has led our team to many come from behind victories. He in fact has more comebacks than Ben, just because Ben cameback this week doesn't mean you can crown him.

And Ben still has the most INTs in the league. Eli is no sweety in this regards either, but as bad as he is, he's still better than Ben when it comes to chucking it up.

And don't use the wins argument either thats so weak. Youre telling me Eli doesn't win? By your implications, he won the NFC East last year, and is still in strong contention to win it again this year. But I hate using wins as a measuring stick, because its more of a reflection of the team.

And don't also tell me that Eli costs us games, and Ben doesn't. Didn't Ben throw away the Oakland game?

The only ones who can be talking right now are the Rivers bandwagoners. They have at least a decent argument. But right now, come on man, you act like Ben threw for 500 this past week. He dug himself out of a whole, fine, congratulations. But his game was by no means spectacular. Neither was Eli's.

Quite honestly, theyre both su cking right now. You want to debate who su cks harder, be my guest, but its kind of stupid.
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Old 11-21-2006, 12:57 PM    (permalink
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Exactely. Why anyone would want to make an argument for a QB that is on a losing team and has thrown 17 interceptions this year is beyond me. There's no other legit reason other than pure homerism.

Rivers is the only QB worth a damn right now.
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Old 11-21-2006, 01:15 PM    (permalink
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lol, someones suggesting that ben is better than eli? thats hilarious

i must sasy, i used to think it was eli and rivers very close at 1 and 2 with eli higher, and ben a very distant 3rd, now i think rivers has jumped eli, he looks a lot better right now... that said i still think eli will end up better
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Old 11-21-2006, 01:19 PM    (permalink
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in eli's defense, plaxico burress is probably the laziest receiver i've ever seen in my entire life. he easily challenges randy moss in the *****-factor of wr's who give up if it's not an easy catch. in fact, i think an argument could be made that burress is the biggest waste of talent in the nfl. if he ran routes with the same passion and desire as torry holt or marvin harrison, he'd be top 5 wr with no questions asked.
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Old 11-21-2006, 01:22 PM    (permalink
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Exactely. Why anyone would want to make an argument for a QB that is on a losing team and has thrown 17 interceptions this year is beyond me. There's no other legit reason other than pure homerism.

Rivers is the only QB worth a damn right now.




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