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Old 10-28-2013, 02:06 PM    (permalink
Trogdor
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We've had this conversation before and you were wrong then about it too. This "throwing guy open" fallacy you have with Romo is silly.

That being said Romo has been MUCH more reserved about letting the ball go to certain guys after Williams burned him running wrong routes to start the year. Sort of like Dez did when he first started out.

He throws Witten open. He throws Miles open. And he throws Dez open now too. It's a trust issue and if you cannot trust your receiver to make the correct move coming out of a cut then of course you wait until after the break to make the throw.

Eli is having the same frustration with Randle if I'm not mistaken.

The main issue currently is that the offensive gameplans dictate play AWAY from Dez rather than focusing him. It's like we come into the game expecting him to be bracketed so we focus on other players. We failed to adjust to single coverage on Dez and kept running plays designed for Williams and Harris.

On the topic of Harris he's a flat out TERRIBLE receiver. I love him on special teams but when he's on the field as a receiver we are really hurting.
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Old 10-28-2013, 02:11 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bigbluedefense View Post
Romo doesn't "throw guys open".

What I mean by that is, even when a mismatch is covered, he's still open if you throw it to them a certain way. You put it where he can get it and no one else and you trust him to make a play on the ball.

Romo doesn't make these throws. You have to be open for him to throw it to you.

Dez is a beast. And I'm of the belief he can be just as dominant as Calvin. Sometimes when you think he's covered he's still open. Let him make a play on the ball.

And I think that's what frustrates Dez.

I don't want to come across as a guy who's just saying this bc the Cowboys have lost, bc I have said this in the past as well, so please excuse me for using this time to bring it up again.

I'm not trying to cause trouble by bringing it up, I just feel that it's a legitimate critique of his game.
I think you may be on to something. However, let me say that I think romo still has a little bit of concern about Dez being where he's supposed to be. I think if he had 100% confidence that Dez was going to be where he's supposed to be, he makes that throw. I think he's like 85% sure Dez will be in the right spot.
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Old 10-28-2013, 02:13 PM    (permalink
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That's fair. I don't understand your offense's route combinations so I'm not entirely qualified to comment on it. If there's communication issues I completely understand why he wouldn't throw it in those scenarios.
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Old 10-28-2013, 02:15 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bigbluedefense View Post
Romo doesn't "throw guys open".

What I mean by that is, even when a mismatch is covered, he's still open if you throw it to them a certain way. You put it where he can get it and no one else and you trust him to make a play on the ball.

Romo doesn't make these throws. You have to be open for him to throw it to you.

Dez is a beast. And I'm of the belief he can be just as dominant as Calvin. Sometimes when you think he's covered he's still open. Let him make a play on the ball.

And I think that's what frustrates Dez.

I don't want to come across as a guy who's just saying this bc the Cowboys have lost, bc I have said this in the past as well, so please excuse me for using this time to bring it up again.

I'm not trying to cause trouble by bringing it up, I just feel that it's a legitimate critique of his game.
Well said, I'm not sure that is all on Romo though. I think that is an extension of what I mentioned earlier about Garrett and his inability to gamble. JG is all about risk management and since he has taken over it appears that Romo has been handcuffed to an extent. We get to see the best of Tony when our backs are against the wall and we need to stretch the field vertically. When the game is tight we see bland blah play calling an check downs to guys roaming underneath coverage.

Pre Garrett Romo was much more of a gun slinger and would put the ball up deep even with guys in the area of his target. Guys like TO, Glenn, and Crayton to an extent we able to battle for the ball in favorable matchups.
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Old 10-28-2013, 02:19 PM    (permalink
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They do amazingly well when they they are aggressive. It's when they try to slow down, they have no idea what to do with themselves.

CowboysBeastMode is right to think that we should've played to win the game and not settle. Pocket is also right to think that we should've ran out the clock and that we did the right thing. The problem with that is that what MOST teams effectively do in running out the clock, we have NO CLUE. W4HOF is right. The running concepts were predictable basic vanilla designs that every defense knows how to stop. That penalty was the killer. We can play hindsight till we're blue in the face.

What do we do to get better? Fire Callahan and show that we mean business.
This argument is silly for one reason. We tried to do this on the earlier drive and ended up saving Detroit a timeout. We put the ball in our QB's hands and the offense let us down.

Given the time (1:24) you clearly run 3 plays, run the clock down there, punt, and give Detroit 20 or so seconds to go 50 or so yards to kick a tying FG. That's what the Raiders (of all teams) did right yesterday against the Steelers.

That's why the penalty was the play of the game. And that's why Garrett needs to go because he didn't realize the clock stops on a penalty.
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Old 10-28-2013, 04:49 PM    (permalink
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Garrett needs to go


Thank you.
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Old 10-28-2013, 04:52 PM    (permalink
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this is probably a stupid question, but if schwartz declines the penalty, why doesn't the clock continue?
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Old 10-28-2013, 05:42 PM    (permalink
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this is probably a stupid question, but if schwartz declines the penalty, why doesn't the clock continue?
All penalties... accepted or declined stop the clock.
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Old 10-28-2013, 05:50 PM    (permalink
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Garrett needs to go


Thank you.
I agree. He doesn't pay enough attention to detail either. Let me ask people this...

With 12 seconds left and only needing a FG to win...

What do you do if the opposing team squib kicks it?

Is there a player on the field that doesn't know that he needs to fair catch and down the ball?

With 2 time outs and a kicker with a decent sized leg, don't we have a chance to get into miracle FG range?

Or do we just fold like we did? Why isn't his special teams prepared to save time on the clock? Anybody except Dwayne Harris should not even be thinking about returning it.
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Old 10-28-2013, 05:56 PM    (permalink
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This argument is silly for one reason. We tried to do this on the earlier drive and ended up saving Detroit a timeout. We put the ball in our QB's hands and the offense let us down.

Given the time (1:24) you clearly run 3 plays, run the clock down there, punt, and give Detroit 20 or so seconds to go 50 or so yards to kick a tying FG. That's what the Raiders (of all teams) did right yesterday against the Steelers.

That's why the penalty was the play of the game. And that's why Garrett needs to go because he didn't realize the clock stops on a penalty.
Yeah, but if Tanner doesn't run the play, instead tries to bounce it out and make something out of nothing... Smith doesn't have to adjust to his block and commit the penalty.

So then I look at Garrett and say, why did we run that play anyways?

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Old 10-28-2013, 06:06 PM    (permalink
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this is probably a stupid question, but if schwartz declines the penalty, why doesn't the clock continue?
Fouls that occur in the last five minutes of the fourth quarter as well as the last two minutes of the first half will result in the clock starting on the snap.
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Old 10-28-2013, 06:11 PM    (permalink
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I agree. He doesn't pay enough attention to detail either. Let me ask people this...

With 12 seconds left and only needing a FG to win...

What do you do if the opposing team squib kicks it?

Is there a player on the field that doesn't know that he needs to fair catch and down the ball?

With 2 time outs and a kicker with a decent sized leg, don't we have a chance to get into miracle FG range?

Or do we just fold like we did? Why isn't his special teams prepared to save time on the clock? Anybody except Dwayne Harris should not even be thinking about returning it.

Another great point we have got to be the dumbest team in the league, who do you blame for players not knowing what to do in situations, even this tanner run..why isnt he aware of the fact that he shouldn't bounce it outside?
Poor coaching, because Garrett himself doesn't know what to do--
How is he even qualified to be a head coach, based on what??!!

http://www.dallascowboys.com/news/ar...d-856a56f198c7

Everyone has an opinion on the situation and all of them are better than Garretts choice and the playcalling we had to endure.

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Old 10-28-2013, 06:12 PM    (permalink
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I agree. He doesn't pay enough attention to detail either. Let me ask people this...

With 12 seconds left and only needing a FG to win...

What do you do if the opposing team squib kicks it?

Is there a player on the field that doesn't know that he needs to fair catch and down the ball?

With 2 time outs and a kicker with a decent sized leg, don't we have a chance to get into miracle FG range?

Or do we just fold like we did? Why isn't his special teams prepared to save time on the clock? Anybody except Dwayne Harris should not even be thinking about returning it.
I agree, then (Im not sure how much time we had 7-8 sec?) with 2 timeouts why not throw it 10-20 yards downfield and call an immediate timeout? Its a longshot I know but our last play was a stupid 10 yard hook and ladder that had NO shot. At least set up a hail mary play with a few seconds to go.
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Old 10-28-2013, 06:17 PM    (permalink
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I agree, then (Im not sure how much time we had 7-8 sec?) with 2 timeouts why not throw it 10-20 yards downfield and call an immediate timeout? Its a longshot I know but our last play was a stupid 10 yard hook and ladder that had NO shot. At least set up a hail mary play with a few seconds to go.
He doesn't give the team a chance to win, even when there is a small chance, he takes it away.

I will say this again, week in and week out, its like we play the opponent and our HC!!
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Old 10-28-2013, 06:20 PM    (permalink
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That's fair. I don't understand your offense's route combinations so I'm not entirely qualified to comment on it. If there's communication issues I completely understand why he wouldn't throw it in those scenarios.
Oh our concepts are pure vanilla. My grandma is qualified to comment on them.

It's not communication issues. We've had that before (Kevin Ogletree says Hi) but we don't have that here. Our guys know where to be. Even T-Will who Romo said has picked up things incredibly fast and is miles from where he was when he got here. Everyone is on the same page.

It boils down to trust. Romo doesn't have the same trust level with his #1 WR that the great QBs develop with theirs. I think Romo tries hard not to play favorites. I think he prefers to throw to open guys (and who wouldn't right?) But I don't think it's just that. I think history has molded him to be that way. Memories of mistake after mistake have scared him. So instead of having fearless trust in Dez, he will ask for time from the OL so he can scan the field for an open guy. When things breakdown -> look for Witten 90% of the time. This mental mindset of his forces him to hold onto the ball too long. Who doesn't love it when he zips it out quickly? Part of that is playcalling so there is shared fault there.

When he is fearless and he gets rid of the ball good things tend to happen. If he's having too much success, watch out, he's gonna do something we'll regret soon enough. Cause when he gets careless that usually leads to doom. Then add to that... as if the mistake wasn't bad enough, the following drives result in a reeled back conservative Romo and we get away from doing what we do best. The best way for him to get over his mistakes is to keep being relentless. We saw Stafford get picked off 4 times and he kept coming and coming. There's NO WAY Romo does the same. He doesn't get over things that quickly. It stays with him. He'll tend to avoid going back to the guy until he gets in a groove again.
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Old 10-28-2013, 06:37 PM    (permalink
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http://www.dallascowboys.com/news/ar...d-856a56f198c7

David: "I appear to be in the minority, but I thought it was far too conservative. The strengths of the offense are a veteran quarterback with good accuracy and a freakishly athletic receiver who is hard to cover. You essentially took the game out of their hands and gave it to a rookie running back and a good-not-great offensive line. I get that they wanted to make the Lions use their timeouts, but why not just move the sticks and make that issue irrelevant?"

And personally for me, if I'm not punting there, I'm bringing Dez out on 4th and 5 and throwing him a slant off of play action. I don't care if it seems crazy grow a pair and win a game.

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Old 10-28-2013, 06:48 PM    (permalink
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http://www.dallascowboys.com/news/ar...d-856a56f198c7

David: "I appear to be in the minority, but I thought it was far too conservative. The strengths of the offense are a veteran quarterback with good accuracy and a freakishly athletic receiver who is hard to cover. You essentially took the game out of their hands and gave it to a rookie running back and a good-not-great offensive line. I get that they wanted to make the Lions use their timeouts, but why not just move the sticks and make that issue irrelevant?"

And personally for me, if I'm not punting there, I'm bringing Dez out on 4th and 5 and throwing him a slant off of play action. I don't care if it seems crazy grow a pair and win a game.
Quote:
Nick: If it's outdated, I guess I'm too old. I think that's exactly what you have to do. It doesn't matter about the yards. Honestly, I thought they should've run simple plays up the middle and then on fourth down run the clock down and take the penalty to give me more room to punt. I was never thinking about a field goal. It was going to be three runs and punt. You can make the argument that he wasn't conservative enough. On the drive before, if they run it instead of a bad pass to Beasley, game over.

Rowan: I think he tends to take the conservative approach in those situations, one that many coaches would adopt. It’s hard to say it’s all on him though, being that he’s not calling the plays. Still, he has the ability to make the final decisions. Just hours removed from the game and still processing it, I have less of a problem with the running out of the clock on the final possession than I do with the previous possession, running two draws out of shotgun and then deciding to throw on third-and-12, resulting in an incompletion
Same article lol
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Old 10-28-2013, 06:56 PM    (permalink
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Broddus has a good writeup of the next to last series of the game. Again poor clock management


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If you are committed to running the ball after the pass interference call against Bryant, then you should have been committed to running the ball on 3rd down and trying to make the Lions use their timeouts or bleed those 24 seconds off the clock until the two minute warning. The Cowboys defense came up with a huge stop on 4th down that gave them the ball back with 1:24 left in the game. In three plays, the Cowboys were only able to knock 22 seconds off the clock, giving the Lions a full minute to work with which was all they needed to win the game.
http://www.dallascowboys.com/news/ar...n=News13718174
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Old 10-28-2013, 06:57 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by pocketaces View Post
Same article lol
I know, I was just highlighting davids opinion because I felt it was most in line with my own.
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Old 10-28-2013, 07:05 PM    (permalink
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Broddus has a good writeup of the next to last series of the game. Again poor clock management




http://www.dallascowboys.com/news/ar...n=News13718174
He just has to go, c'mon he should be fired today but that won't happen because Jerry is committed to ineptitude at HC.
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Old 10-28-2013, 07:10 PM    (permalink
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In 2013 the Cowboys are hemorrhaging yards and big plays on an unprecedented level. So far this year, they've given up 59 passing plays of 16+ yards and 20 runs of 12 or more yards. Those 79 plays are tops in the league and six more than the Jaguars have allowed. The Jaguars!
http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2013/...bodys-business

About that Offensive heavy draft again...
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Old 10-28-2013, 08:02 PM    (permalink
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http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2013/...bodys-business

About that Offensive heavy draft again...
Didn't read it yet, but I do have a comment on it that's probably relevant to what you're getting at.

I've been defending his draft, but that Escobar pick is looking more and more stupid. His addition was supposed to enhance the offense and give Garrett the chance to run more 2 TE sets. Well, we haven't seen it and it's already blatantly cost us one game (Romo throwing to Escobar to lose the Denver game). There's no defending Garrett on a pick when he doesn't deliver on the expectations created from making it.

But even more than that... was the whole idea to run 2 TEs a good one in the first place??? When you have WR weapons like we have, the 2 TE set formation is more of a gimmick.

I'm starting to have doubts about that pick even though I like the player. Garrett was too selfish on offense with the draft and he's not delivering. I had a hunch going into the draft that it would be offensive heavy (as it was potentially Garrett's last draft). If we don't go farther than 1 round in the playoffs, or look embarrassed while there, then Garrett deserves to be fired.
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Old 10-28-2013, 08:04 PM    (permalink
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http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2013/...bodys-business

About that Offensive heavy draft again...
Eliminate the big play?

Sounds like the Rob Ryan bend but don't break defense would be a smart way to go for us.
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Old 10-28-2013, 08:06 PM    (permalink
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http://fansided.com/2013/10/28/jerry...ding%20on%20FS

We knew they could just walk down the field and beat us so we didn't try to end the game and go on 4th down we kicked a field goal..this team and its owner are a mess...lol wtf

No we're not shocked..we should be used to it by now...hahaha!!
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Old 10-28-2013, 08:07 PM    (permalink
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Todd Archer ‏@toddarcher 22m
Cowboys will sign Everette Brown. Have to make a roster move to fit him in. David Arkin headed back to practice squad.
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